# Sci fi vs. SF vs. science fiction: What's the big deal? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 3, 2001, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sci-fi-vs-sf-vs-science-fiction-whats-the-big-deal/60605 "2001-04-03T06:58:41Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![MusicJunkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df788c/32.png) [@MusicJunkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MusicJunkie)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2001, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sci-fi-vs-sf-vs-science-fiction-whats-the-big-deal/60605/81 "2001-04-06T14:32:12Z")
> [@](#): > > I’m in the middle of a mindless 5-book space-opera series that’s redeemed by the author having so damned much fun that you overlook the lack of deep characteriztion, mediocre prose and the complete lack of subtleties Are you reading the nightsdawn trilogy **Fenris**? ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2001, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sci-fi-vs-sf-vs-science-fiction-whats-the-big-deal/60605/82 "2001-04-06T14:38:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by MusicJunkie \* > \*\*Are you reading the nightsdawn trilogy **Fenris**? \*\* Nope: The Deathstalker series by Simon Green. Loads of fun! Fenris ---
**Author:** ![LateComer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b5ac83/32.png) [@LateComer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LateComer)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2001, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sci-fi-vs-sf-vs-science-fiction-whats-the-big-deal/60605/83 "2001-04-06T15:01:07Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by RealityChuck \* > \*\* > > For a fan to make the differentiation is no different than a member of the Masons to make a differentiation between Masons and non-Masons. > > \*\* Except that the Masons rule the world . . . and many Science Fiction fans wish they could. And, by the way, I see Comic Book Guy as representative of anti-fans. Bozos who have read every Star Trek, Star Wars and Forgotten Realms books and think this makes them Fans. These folks are often called “Fanboys.” ---
**Author:** ![Podkayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Podkayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Podkayne)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2001, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sci-fi-vs-sf-vs-science-fiction-whats-the-big-deal/60605/84 "2001-04-06T15:10:39Z")
I’d just like to add, so that my snarling and snapping doesn’t give anyone the wrong impression, that I do not look down my nose at fandom of any sort. If that’s your schtick, then that’s great. I’m always glad to see people doing what makes them happy. As long as you don’t look down your nose at _me_ because I don’t do the exact same schtick as you, we’ll get along famously. ---
**Author:** ![Podkayne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Podkayne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Podkayne)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2001, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sci-fi-vs-sf-vs-science-fiction-whats-the-big-deal/60605/85 "2001-04-06T15:13:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Ben \* > > > [@](#): > > > > \*Originally posted by Podkayne \* > > tell everybody that _I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream_ is my faaaaaaavorite skiffy book? \*\* > > But IHNMAIMS isn’t science fiction- it’s speculative fiction. The word you’re looking for is “speffy.” 😉 :: Blinks in confusion :: Really? Hey, wait a minute. I don’t see anyone in a chainmail biniki. This isn’t the Xena convention! Who _are_ you people? ---
**Author:** ![LateComer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b5ac83/32.png) [@LateComer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LateComer)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2001, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sci-fi-vs-sf-vs-science-fiction-whats-the-big-deal/60605/86 "2001-04-06T15:18:42Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by RealityChuck \* > \*\* > > For a fan to make the differentiation is no different than a member of the Masons to make a differentiation between Masons and non-Masons. > > \*\* Except that the Masons rule the world . . . and many Science Fiction fans wish they could. And, by the way, I see Comic Book Guy as representative of anti-fans. Bozos who have read every Star Trek, Star Wars and Forgotten Realms books and think this makes them Fans. These folks are often called “Fanboys.” ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2001, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sci-fi-vs-sf-vs-science-fiction-whats-the-big-deal/60605/87 "2001-04-06T16:22:04Z")
**Fenris** : 1. Michaela Roessner? I’ll look into her. 2. Lemme guess - you like Donaldson, but you can’t stand his central characters, right? Well, I’d say that Kay is closer to the Donaldson of _Mordent_ than the Donaldson of _Covenant_; in other words, less angst. As for Bradley - when was _Mists of Avalon_ written? Kay has a similar dreamy, sad style, with much less of a political agenda. Kay also seems to write in a rather unusual sub-genre, especially in his later books, sort of a “fictionalized history”: he takes a specific time and place, changes the details, adds a bit of magic, and changes the historical outcome. That’s why you can replace “Tigana” with “Tuscany”, “Arbonne” with “Provence” and “Sarantium” with “Byzantium”; but just because you know history, you ca’t know how the story will turn out. 1. You’ve read early Martin? Tell me, have you read _Armageddon Rag_? 2. I started reading the _Deathstalker_ books a while ago and gave up about 100 pages into the first volume. I Think it was a bit TOO mindless for my tastes - the characters seemed singularly uninteresting, and the universe didn’t make much sense. Besides, the “hero” ruled an entire planet and couldn’t find a _single_ loyal bodyguard? What a loser. ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2001, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sci-fi-vs-sf-vs-science-fiction-whats-the-big-deal/60605/88 "2001-04-06T17:09:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Alessan \* > \*\ ***Fenris** : > > 1. Lemme guess - you like Donaldson, but you can’t stand his central characters, right? Well, I’d say that Kay is closer to the Donaldson of _Mordent_ than the Donaldson of _Covenant_; in other words, less angst. As for Bradley - when was _Mists of Avalon_ written? Kay has a similar dreamy, sad style, with much less of a political agenda.\*\* Mists was about '81 or '82 I believe. You’re exactly right about Donaldson. Whatshername in Mordant was whiney and Covenant…well, let’s not have that discussion 🙂 \*\* > [@](#): > > Kay also seems to write in a rather unusual sub-genre, especially in his later books, sort of a “fictionalized history”: he takes a specific time and place, changes the details, adds a bit of magic, and changes the historical outcome. That’s why you can replace “Tigana” with “Tuscany”, “Arbonne” with “Provence” and “Sarantium” with “Byzantium”; but just because you know history, you ca’t know how the story will turn out.\*\* Cool. As long as he’s not doing the irritatingly coy “Magic…or not?” gimmick where he doesn’t _really_ want to write fantasy, but figures it’ll sell better. (From what I’ve heard, he doesn’t) \*\* > [@](#): > > 1. You’ve read early Martin? Tell me, have you read _Armageddon Rag_?\*\* I _just_ got my hands on a copy! I can’t wait to read it. I hear it’s great. \*\* > [@](#): > > 1. I started reading the _Deathstalker_ books a while ago and gave up about 100 pages into the first volume. I Think it was a bit TOO mindless for my tastes - the characters seemed singularly uninteresting, and the universe didn’t make much sense. > Besides, the “hero” ruled an entire planet and couldn’t find a _single_ loyal bodyguard? What a loser. > \*\* True, but he pays for his folly and does learn and grow from his experiences. I occasionally like mindless fun. Fenris [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sci-fi-vs-sf-vs-science-fiction-whats-the-big-deal/60605.md?page=4)