# Scientist finds "god gene"
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027
**Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
**Created:** [January 4, 2005, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027 "2005-01-04T14:26:28Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/1 "2005-01-04T14:26:28Z")
Dean Hamer, the same fellow who made headlines about a decade ago with his research into the supposed “gay gene,” has now found an alleged [“faith gene.”](http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=16378)
> [@](#):
>
> Hamer claims there is a version of the VMAT2 gene that is a ‘God Gene’. The presence of this version of the gene makes the person who has it more religious and spiritual than people who do not.
>
> Hamer has written a book called ‘The God Gene - How Faith is Hard Wired into our Genes’.
>
> Hamer studied 2,000 DNA samples. He interviewed 2,000 people extensively (226 questions in each interview). The questions, among other things, looked at how spiritual a person is and what their level of faith in God is.
>
> He found that the VMAT2 Gene was significantly more common among people who believed in a higher spiritual being. According to his research, whether or not your upbringing is religious has no bearing on how religious you turn out to be - but the presence of the VMAT2 Gene version does.
Maybe I should have started this in the Pit, because all sorts of sarcastic comments are coming to mind. But maybe it’s better I started it here to keep the sarcastic outbursts to a minimum.
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### Author:  [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/2 "2005-01-04T14:40:10Z")
Actually, I think it’s kinda neat. And shows how useless prostletyzing is.
It also explains how I was raised by two atheists (or maybe they’re hard agnostics) and yet am seriously the most spiritual person I know. Whereas many of my friends raised by parents of faith couldn’t give two squats about it.
Except - if my parents lack faith, where did I get the faith gene from? Does that mean it’s a recessive gene, and my parent’s each had a dominant “no-faith” gene that inactivated it? Like my blue-eyed friend with two brown-eyed parents?
If so, wouldn’t three-quarters of the world have “no-faith”? Seems like that’s not the case. Are they faking faith? Interesting questions this raises.
Or does it just mean that one or more of my parents has the faith gene, but it was overcome by cultural or biographic factors? If so, then it’s not a very strong gene.
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### Author:  [@Ponder\_Stibbons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponder_Stibbons)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/3 "2005-01-04T14:43:35Z")
Oooh, ooh, maybe there are “preferred color” genes as well? How many people do you suppose have “blue genes”?
Hey, it’s MPSIMS, you had to expect frivolous comments …
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### Author:  [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/4 "2005-01-04T14:46:35Z")
Well, it would explain a lot. I was raised religiously neutral and I cannot have faith. I’ve tried. Believe me, growing up in the bible belt, I’ve tried. It was very inconveniencing to not believe in God, and I even pretended (or, rather, convinced myself) for a couple years.
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### Author:  [@Uvula\_Donor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uvula_Donor)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/5 "2005-01-04T14:48:34Z")
My genes are usually hanging on the bedpost in the morning, but I could use some help finding my keys.
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### Author:  [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/6 "2005-01-04T15:30:31Z")
How long before the Random Law of Sequential Thread Titles causes this one to hang out with the one **Polycarp** started about whether or not we let conservative evangelicals marry?
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### Author:  [@jk1245](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jk1245)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/7 "2005-01-04T15:32:39Z")
Wonder if this means a religion vaccine is possible?
Just for the most virulent strains.
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### Author:  [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/8 "2005-01-04T15:34:41Z")
I’m disappointed; I thought this thread would be about a gene marker that could be flipped on and then we would all become gods… the days of Olympus and the pantheon of immortals would come again.
So, is the implication that there’s a cure for religion or a cure for atheism?
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### Author:  [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/9 "2005-01-04T15:45:12Z")
> [@WhyNot](#):
>
> Except - if my parents lack faith, where did I get the faith gene from? Does that mean it’s a recessive gene, and my parent’s each had a dominant “no-faith” gene that inactivated it?
Obviously it’s a combination of genetics and environment. My theory is that you were exposed to an unusual combination of pre-natal hormones triggered by your mother watching “A Charlie Brown Christmas” while she was pregnant with you.
> [@WhyNot](#):
>
> Like my blue-eyed friend with two brown-eyed parents?
What color eyes does the milkman have?
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### Author:  [@Dragwyr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dragwyr)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/10 "2005-01-04T15:54:59Z")
It seems just a bit too convenient to me.
Sure let’s blame genetic makeup for all of our behaviors. What’s next? The “Laziness” gene that makes people not want to go out and get a job? “Hey I would love to be employed, but my genetic makeup prevents me from doing so.” How about those that have criminal tendancies: “I would love to be a law abiding citizen, but my genes just make me want to go out and stab somone 25 times.”
Now we have research suggesting that belief in a higher spiritual power is based on our genetic makeup. Yes, advances in genetic research have greatly improved modern medicine, but where is the line that separates behavior due to genetics from behavior I choose to do?
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### Author:  [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/11 "2005-01-04T15:56:35Z")
> [@Otto](#):
>
> Obviously it’s a combination of genetics and environment. My theory is that you were exposed to an unusual combination of pre-natal hormones triggered by your mother watching “A Charlie Brown Christmas” while she was pregnant with you.
Nope, impossible! I was born in November before there where VCRs! But maybe she was inexplicably moved by Memorial Day or something. 😃
> [@](#):
>
> What color eyes does the milkman have?
Well, that doesn’t have to be the case. Brown eyes can have a recessive not-brown gene that gets “overruled” by the brown. So each of Rebekah’s parents have one dominant (brown) gene and one recessive (not-brown, in this case, blue) gene. Each child has a 1 in 4 chance of being not-brown-eyed. (Whether “not-brown” means hazel or blue or green is rather more complicated, and I’ll leave it up to the geneticists to explain.)
Which is why, if this “faith gene” is a simple dominant/recessive thing, 3/4 of people should be not-faith or should be faith. It’s just the way the math works. Not all genes are dom/rec, though. There are other options. It could be an “extra” gene which arose from mutation. It could be on the X-chromosome, which means you inherit your faith status from your mother, like baldness and hemophellia. (Now that raises interesting support for the Jewish matrilineal thing, doesn’t it?)
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### Author:  [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/12 "2005-01-04T16:02:56Z")
> [@Dragwyr](#):
>
> It seems just a bit too convenient to me.
>
> Sure let’s blame genetic makeup for all of our behaviors. What’s next? The “Laziness” gene that makes people not want to go out and get a job? “Hey I would love to be employed, but my genetic makeup prevents me from doing so.” How about those that have criminal tendancies: “I would love to be a law abiding citizen, but my genes just make me want to go out and stab somone 25 times.”
>
> Now we have research suggesting that belief in a higher spiritual power is based on our genetic makeup. Yes, advances in genetic research have greatly improved modern medicine, but where is the line that separates behavior due to genetics from behavior I choose to do?
Not that I believe (heh, heh) in the “god gene” as of now, but this line of reasoning is wrong.
Should we draw a line where we say “OK, we no longer like the results of this research, so it’s wrong.”?
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### Author:  [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/13 "2005-01-04T16:31:54Z")
> [@WhyNot](#):
>
> Nope, impossible! I was born in November before there where VCRs! But maybe she was inexplicably moved by Memorial Day or something.
A-ha! Somebody dosed her chocolate Easter bunny!
And she thought that filling was marshmallow fluff…
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### Author:  [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/14 "2005-01-04T17:27:59Z")
> [@WhyNot](#):
>
> Actually, I think it’s kinda neat. And shows how useless prostletyzing is.
Eh? The point of prosetelyzing (sp?) is to convince people of faith that your beliefs are better than their current ones.
In any case, faith isn’t a simple, binary “On/Off” condition. There are varying degrees of faith. Some people have none; most people have a certain degree of faith (like me); and some have faith out the wazoo (like my dad).
Interestingly, traditional Christian theology considers faith to be a gift of the Holy Spirit, much like being a good athlete or being good at math. Some people have it, some people don’t.
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### Author:  [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/15 "2005-01-04T17:52:52Z")
> [@Diceman](#):
>
> Eh? The point of prosetelyzing (sp?) is to convince people of faith that your beliefs are better than their current ones.
Or to convince people without faith that having faith (specifically your faith) is better than having none, which I think was the point of the original comment.
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### Author:  [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/16 "2005-01-04T18:10:58Z")
> [@Dragwyr](#):
>
> It seems just a bit too convenient to me.
It is, and Hamer is a fraud. His ‘gay gene’ didn’t stand up to scrutiny, and if he ever publishes this instead of just announcing what he claims is a discover, I’m betting this won’t either.
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### Author:  [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/17 "2005-01-04T18:22:00Z")
> [@Marley23](#):
>
> It is, and Hamer is a fraud. His ‘gay gene’ didn’t stand up to scrutiny
Well what’s the status on the “gay gene”? I’m usually afraid to ask because (depending on who you ask) the answer is almost invariably either:
“OF COURSE there’s a gay gene YOU FUCKING IDIOT!”
or
“OF COURSE there’s not a gay gene YOU FUCKING IDIOT!”
Well excuuu-use me for asking.
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### Author:  [@Futile\_Gesture](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Futile_Gesture)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/18 "2005-01-04T18:31:42Z")
> [@Otto](#):
>
> > [@](#):
> >
> > The presence of this version of the gene makes the person who has it more religious and spiritual than people who do not.
Now define ‘spiritual’. It’s always seemed to me that it’s one of those ‘blah’ words that people like to claim they are, but helpfully can’t be pinned down to actually meaning anything.
Which makes it a very difficult thing to go labelling genes with. Or, all too easy. Depending on your viewpoint.
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### Author:  [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/19 "2005-01-04T18:42:31Z")
How does the presence of this gene (which presumably is as old as humanity) explain the near 100% religiousity of our ancestors? Were a large number of them just going through the motions?
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### Author:  [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)
#### Post date: [January 4, 2005, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientist-finds-god-gene/283027/20 "2005-01-04T18:44:27Z")
I predict this will go the way of that virus that makes you fat.
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