# Scientology - what rock have I been under? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 10, 2012, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807 "2012-07-10T16:49:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![MikeF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@MikeF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeF)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/1 "2012-07-10T16:49:26Z")
I always knew/heard that Scientology was an oddball religion of some sort but I never really cared enough to look into the details. I still don’t care but, with all this Tom Cruise stuff in the news, curiosity got the best of me. :eek: Aliens, hydrogen bombs, volcanoes? Really? That has got to be the most whacked out stuff I’ve ever heard. Way crazier than candles that don’t burn out or bottomless baskets of fish and bread. I guess if you’re going to tell a lie you might as well make it a whopper. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/2 "2012-07-10T16:56:49Z")
What’s the debate? The rock you’ve been under? I agree, scientology is absurd on the face of it and it doesn’t take much detective work to learn about things like Operation Snow White or the Fair Game policy which should make any rational person want to run far, far away, but dude, preaching to the choir, man. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/3 "2012-07-10T17:01:52Z")
Yes, you’ve been under a rock. Xenu put your soul there 75M years ago. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/4 "2012-07-10T17:11:12Z")
Scientology is fun to mock, but despite their collection of captive celebrities it’s not like the group is particularly relevant. The details of their loony beliefs are not something you need to know, really, so I don’t think it qualifies for Living Under a Rock status. But anyway, yes, this is what happens when you have a religion founded by a guy who is holed up on a boat and gobbling drugs like they are candy. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/5 "2012-07-10T19:09:12Z")
It’s not the loony beliefs that you have to worry about. They were caught trying to break into government offices and steal secrets. A raid on their HQ turned up all sorts of illegal doings, and details on how they framed journalist Paulette Cooper, who’d published _The Scandal of Scientology_. The papers weren’t Looney Tunes idea-spinning – Cooper was doing time because they’d managed to frame her for a bomb threat, having gotten her fingerprints on paper they’d later used to type up the supposed threat letter from her. They’re litigious as hell, and if that’s unsuccessful wil indulge in such Dirty Tricks. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/6 "2012-07-10T19:32:38Z")
If you accept the premise ‘that sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic’ (from Arther C Clarke) then scientology is very much in line with many faiths. ---
**Author:** ![Kinthalis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kinthalis/32/16084_2.png) [@Kinthalis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kinthalis)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/7 "2012-07-10T19:34:08Z")
I have a feeling the whole alien/ hydrogen bomb crapola has a lot to do with the time at which the religion was founded. I’m pretty sure the whole crapola about walking on water, conquering Canaan, Coming back to life, being god and the son and the holy spirit, etc, etc is probably equivalent nuttery back in 0 AD Judea. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/8 "2012-07-10T19:36:33Z")
Plus, Mary Magdalen _totally_ looked like Katie Holmes! ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/9 "2012-07-10T19:38:16Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > It’s not the loony beliefs that you have to worry about. They were caught trying to break into government offices and steal secrets. A raid on their HQ turned up all sorts of illegal doings, and details on how they framed journalist Paulette Cooper, who’d published _The Scandal of Scientology_. The papers weren’t Looney Tunes idea-spinning – Cooper was doing time because they’d managed to frame her for a bomb threat, having gotten her fingerprints on paper they’d later used to type up the supposed threat letter from her. They’re litigious as hell, and if that’s unsuccessful wil indulge in such Dirty Tricks. That’s true- it’s a thoroughly scummy organization. But do you think anybody who doesn’t join Scientology or have a friend or relative join Scientology really needs to worry about them as a threat? I can’t say I do. I enjoy the teasing and the bad press and ridicule this organization so richly deserves, but it’s not because I see them as a threat to anybody who isn’t very gullible and (usually) very rich. ---
**Author:** ![Kinthalis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kinthalis/32/16084_2.png) [@Kinthalis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kinthalis)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/10 "2012-07-10T19:53:58Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Plus, Mary Magdalen _totally_ looked like Katie Holmes! Are you saying what I think you’re saying? Tom Cruise is the Messiah! Prepare for rapture peoples! Quick, somebody call Phelps! ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/11 "2012-07-10T20:14:45Z")
Yeah, but the have a Super Power Building! [![](http://www.hangthebankers.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Inside-scientology-1.jpg) ](http://www.hangthebankers.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Inside-scientology-1.jpg) (Anyone think a Star Trek fan was involved in designing that?) > **[Flag Building](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Power_Building)** > > The Flag Building, also referred to as the Super Power Building, is the largest building in Clearwater, Florida. It is owned by the Church of Scientology and was built principally to deliver the Super Power Rundown, a high-level Scientology training course intended to train Scientologists to use what Scientology describes as all of their 57 "perceptics" or senses. The interior of the building contains training suites, course rooms, theaters and various devices intended to test these "perceptics... Check out the super power training equipment on that wiki page. These people are definitely whacked. ---
**Author:** ![Kinthalis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kinthalis/32/16084_2.png) [@Kinthalis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kinthalis)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/12 "2012-07-10T20:21:31Z")
Uh no, I’m sorry but I’ve changed my mind about them. That building looks KICK-@SS. I want to work there. How Do I join them? I don’t have to slice my wiener do I? ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/13 "2012-07-10T20:22:41Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > That’s true- it’s a thoroughly scummy organization. But do you think anybody who doesn’t join Scientology or have a friend or relative join Scientology really needs to worry about them as a threat? I can’t say I do. I enjoy the teasing and the bad press and ridicule this organization so richly deserves, but it’s not because I see them as a threat to anybody who isn’t very gullible and (usually) very rich. They’ve demonstrably been a threat to investigative reporters – not just Paulette Cooper, but the guy who wrote **Bare-Faced Messiah** and the guy from _The Gauntlet_ who was investigating them. They had designs on politicians who had crossed them or were fristrating their agenda (again, shown by theor own documents), and were spiriting stuff out of US Government offices. They’ve had a long-time vendetta gainst psychiatrists, as well. So, yeah – they’re not just a harmless side show, providing us with entertainment from the Rich and Gullible. They react with legal and “dirty tricks” against anyone they perceive as a threat or an obstracle, and that has spilled over into the public arena more than once.This is the reason the South Park people put their names as obvious aliases at the end of that “Scientology” episode (although it ought to be possible to dig out their real names easily enough.) ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/14 "2012-07-10T20:40:35Z")
> [@MikeF](#): > > :eek: Aliens, hydrogen bombs, volcanoes? Really? That has got to be the most whacked out stuff I’ve ever heard. Way crazier than candles that don’t burn out or bottomless baskets of fish and bread. I guess if you’re going to tell a lie you might as well make it a whopper. I’ve always had this idea that no one in the organization actually believes this story to be true - it’s like the Jews and the Garden of Eden. Most modern Jews don’t think there really was an Adam and Eve, it’s just a nice just-so story from their ancestors. My hunch has always been that Elron made up this creation myth so they’d look more like a religion, and therefore be able to qualify as a religion for tax purposes. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/15 "2012-07-10T20:43:09Z")
Wasn’t Anonymous supposed to have destroyed them by now? What happened with that? ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/16 "2012-07-10T20:45:36Z")
Anonymous a) has the attention span of a goldfish on crack and b) consists mostly of losers. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/17 "2012-07-10T20:45:50Z")
> [@CurtC](#): > > I’ve always had this idea that no one in the organization actually believes this story to be true - it’s like the Jews and the Garden of Eden. Most modern Jews don’t think there really was an Adam and Eve, it’s just a nice just-so story from their ancestors. Most Scientologists don’t know about the Xenu nonsense. You have to be in the organization a long time and give them a lot of money and personal secrets and let them screw with your head extensively before they’ll tell you about it. Scientology was very angry when the Xenu stuff was made public. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/18 "2012-07-10T20:48:07Z")
> [@CurtC](#): > > I’ve always had this idea that no one in the organization actually believes this story to be true - it’s like the Jews and the Garden of Eden. Most modern Jews don’t think there really was an Adam and Eve, it’s just a nice just-so story from their ancestors. Well, supposedly you’re supposed to have all kinds of amazing super-duper abilities once you’re “clear” and there are claims that certain individuals have reached “clear” so certainly those individuals must know it’s a scam. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/19 "2012-07-10T21:41:43Z")
Considering their history of having children sign billion year contracts, I’d say they aren’t a benign organization. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2012, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807/20 "2012-07-10T21:51:24Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Most Scientologists don’t know about the Xenu nonsense. You have to be in the organization a long time and give them a lot of money and personal secrets and let them screw with your head extensively before they’ll tell you about it. Scientology was very angry when the Xenu stuff was made public. Everyone else knows about it, so it seems unlikely that they don’t. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scientology-what-rock-have-i-been-under/627807.md?page=2)