# Scooter: G-U-I-L-T-Y **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 6, 2007, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820 "2007-03-06T17:13:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![i\_am\_a\_scientist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f07891/32.png) [@i\_am\_a\_scientist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/i_am_a_scientist)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/1 "2007-03-06T17:13:27Z")
So now what? Specifically, does this lead to more investigation(s) or does Libby just take the bullet and get a show on fox in 10 years? http://apnews.myway.com/article/20070306/D8NMQ0E02.html ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/2 "2007-03-06T17:14:40Z")
Fitz!!! ---
**Author:** ![randwill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a3d4f5/32.png) [@randwill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/randwill)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/3 "2007-03-06T17:16:37Z")
Well, Skippy, eh, Biffy, no Scooter, is headed up the river, to the pokey, the ol’ Gray Bar Hotel. So who fucked up here? It’s unusual in America for the right-hand man of a rich and powerful person to actually be found guilty of anything. The jury certainly should have been fixed, the judge bought off, ect. I’m not optimistic that goverment liars and crooks are going to start falling anytime soon, but this seems to be a major aberration in the “justice system”. How the heck could this have happened? Oh, of course, _the appeal_. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/4 "2007-03-06T17:17:56Z")
Working link: [4 Outa 5 Ain’t Bad](http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070306/ap_on_go_pr_wh/cia_leak_trial_18) > [@](#): > > obstruction, perjury and lying to the > FBI ---
**Author:** ![i\_am\_a\_scientist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f07891/32.png) [@i\_am\_a\_scientist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/i_am_a_scientist)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/5 "2007-03-06T17:22:22Z")
[QUOTE=Squink] Working link: [4 Outa 5 Ain’t Bad](http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070306/ap_on_go_pr_wh/cia_leak_trial_18) [/QUOTE] thanks. I bet W pardons him. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/6 "2007-03-06T17:26:28Z")
Two counts of perjury. One of lying. One of obstruction. He was Cheneys number one. Strange how VP didn’t know what was going on. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/7 "2007-03-06T17:27:24Z")
[QUOTE=i am a scientist] thanks. I bet W pardons him. [/QUOTE] I bet you don’t bet that. Let’s see… OK, I’ll take your bet. $100 says President Bush does NOT pardon him. Bet’s payable to you when the pardon is issued or to me at noon on January 20th, 2009. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/8 "2007-03-06T17:28:34Z")
No way does he get a pardon. That would be an admission of guilt, plus he’d be free to testify against others without self-incrimination. If he did testify against Deadeye Dick, I’d give him a get out of jail free card and a pension. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/9 "2007-03-06T17:29:45Z")
Merged duplicate threads. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/10 "2007-03-06T17:31:03Z")
You think it’ll get overturned, **Bricker**? Because, frankly, if the conviction is still standing, I have no problem picturing Libby being included in the last minute pardon flurry. No, I won’t bet - I’ve already got an outstanding one with you. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/11 "2007-03-06T17:34:37Z")
[QUOTE=randwill] It’s unusual in America for the right-hand man of a rich and powerful person to actually be found guilty of anything. The jury certainly should have been fixed, the judge bought off, ect. I’m not optimistic that goverment liars and crooks are going to start falling anytime soon, but this seems to be a major aberration in the “justice system”. How the heck could this have happened? [/QUOTE] I suspect that you get most of your news and history from B movies. On the other hand, even in the movies the “right hand man” frequently takes the fall for his boss. However, the U.S. has a pretty long history of bringing in the sort of conviction that was delivered, here. Lot of crimes result in no actual trial on the events, but some indeterminate number of perjury convictions for the supporting cast for having either covered their butts or protected someone else by lying to investigators. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/12 "2007-03-06T17:40:20Z")
When he appeals it gives him a delay.Perhaps til Sept. Then 3 months court time. Then appeal to higher courts even Supreme. He now is in 2008. presidential pardon screws justice system perfectly. No time at all. It stinks . ---
**Author:** ![i\_am\_a\_scientist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f07891/32.png) [@i\_am\_a\_scientist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/i_am_a_scientist)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/13 "2007-03-06T17:40:50Z")
[QUOTE=Bricker] I bet you don’t bet that. [/QUOTE] I bet I do. I win! In all seriousness, what makes you think W won’t pardon him? ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/14 "2007-03-06T18:30:56Z")
When my favorite baseball team wins, I fly the Cardinals flag. When my country does something smart, I fly Old Glory, as I did just now. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/15 "2007-03-06T19:11:48Z")
[QUOTE=i am a scientist] I bet W pardons him. [/QUOTE] Interesting bit of trivia. When Bill Clinton left office, he caught a lot of flack for pardoning billionaire financier Marc Rich. Guess who Rich’s attorney was… [Lewis “Scooter” Libby!](http://archives.cnn.com/2001/ALLPOLITICS/03/02/clinton.library/) And now you know the rest… of the story. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/16 "2007-03-06T19:31:23Z")
[QUOTE=i am a scientist] thanks. I bet W pardons him. [/QUOTE] I’ve got $100 bucks that says he doesn’t. Are we on? ---
**Author:** ![Gadarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Gadarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gadarene)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/17 "2007-03-06T20:07:43Z")
> [@](#): > > I’ve got $100 bucks that says he doesn’t. Are we on? What’s your reasoning, **John**? ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/18 "2007-03-06T20:13:25Z")
[QUOTE=Gadarene] What’s your reasoning, **John**? [/QUOTE] Not to speak for John, but it’s likely along these lines: > [@BobLibDem](#): > > No way does he get a pardon. That would be an admission of guilt, plus he’d be free to testify against others without self-incrimination. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/19 "2007-03-06T20:15:57Z")
[QUOTE=Gadarene] What’s your reasoning, **John**? [/QUOTE] I’ll post that once I’ve closed on whether the bet is on or not with the OP and anyone else who wants in. ---
**Author:** ![Tastes\_of\_Chocolate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tastes_of_chocolate/32/3232_2.png) [@Tastes\_of\_Chocolate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tastes_of_Chocolate)\ **Post date:** [March 6, 2007, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820/20 "2007-03-06T20:29:36Z")
Libby’s lawyer has already said that they are going to push to have a new trial. If that fails, they will appeal. What’s to stop: Keeping that going until, say, November of 2008 shouldn’t be hard. Then a late night, no fanfare, pardon. With the short attention span of the US news, a lame duck president, and the flurry of a new incoming president, I don’t think that there would be much of an uproar. Maybe a short spat of indignation from parts of the media, but that’s about it. Slight sidetracking - Last week, one of the jurors was removed from the case, because she had seen something about the case outside the courtroom. The case went on with 11 jurors. Why wasn’t one of the alternate jurors substutued in? Isn’t that why they are there? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-g-u-i-l-t-y/394820.md?page=2)