# Scooter Libby skates free **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 3, 2007, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296 "2007-07-03T00:18:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2007, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/201 "2007-07-07T09:19:05Z")
[QUOTE=bob\_co] Can you make the point then against my competive society? One that would declare war only when war was declared on it? Can you make a point for freedom in a society that uses force for your health care? OH that isn’n’t force, is it? You took their gun away. [/QUOTE] Sticking with the with the Libbi and Iraq context (Oh no, not the subject of the thread! Horrors!) A better reason then to condemn what the administration did. To turns us from a nation that did respond to attacks into a nation that would attack preemptively. It is made worse when the evidence now shows it was a phony reason to invade. And if powerful contractors are going to suffer now if we leave, well too bad. The money of the USA should not be used to make a few producers overseas happy. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2007, 9:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/202 "2007-07-07T09:36:01Z")
[QUOTE=bob\_co] Can you make a point for freedom in a society that uses force for your health care? OH that isn’n’t force, is it? You took their gun away. [/QUOTE] Well, I coud get forced to take a vacation overseas with the current health care in the USA. [http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/health/2006-07-26-travel-surgery-usat\_x.htm](http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/health/2006-07-26-travel-surgery-usat_x.htm) > [@](#): > > Would you travel to India for a cut-rate heart bypass? How about Thailand for a hip replacement? Some uninsured and those with skimpy insurance have taken the risk, leading to what promoters say is a growing trade in “medical tourism.” > Now, companies that help arrange such travel are eying a far bigger market: U.S. employers who want to save money on their health care costs. > > The appeal is obvious: Heart surgeries and hip replacements in such countries as India, Thailand and Mexico can be had for less than one-third the cost in the USA. > > At the same time, medical costs in the USA are rising rapidly, with no end in sight. > > “Companies have reached that point of being pinned to the wall faster than we thought,” says Rajesh Rao, CEO of IndUShealth, which helps arrange travel and medical care abroad. > > Don’t look for major health insurers to offer such a plan nationally yet. But several small companies that arrange medical travel have recently launched programs aimed at employers, and one Florida health plan administrator has one, too: > [@](#): > > “For small incentives, Americans are not going to get on a plane and fly to a strange country and interact with a physician they don’t know,” he says. “The incentives will need to be in the $5,000 to $10,000 range, plus travel and hotel for the employee and spouse.” > > But caution is needed with incentives, as well, says Taylor at Perrin. **“If you’re not careful, it isn’t voluntary: The incentives are so strong that you force people over there,” he says.** I do remember many producers not considering putting manufacturing shops (jobs) in the USA because of the health care cost, I guess they prefer to be forced into going overseas to produce in countries with “evil” “socialistic” health care. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2007, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/203 "2007-07-07T19:12:20Z")
[QUOTE=bob\_co] Mob rules, or producers rule. [/QUOTE] 😕 The mob **are** the producers. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2007, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/204 "2007-07-07T19:13:46Z")
[QUOTE=bob\_co] What Joe Wilson did was wrong . . . [/QUOTE] How so? ---
**Author:** ![bob\_co](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b3f665/32.png) [@bob\_co](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_co)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2007, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/205 "2007-07-07T22:32:44Z")
Joe Wilson was wrong. Like it or not. That is a fact. I’d rather get esoteric than argue the facts here simply beacuse the facts go way way back. My sources run a little bit deeper than Ann Coulter. He was there, and it was his job to find this out. It probably happened under his nose and he defended his position that he was not asleep at the wheel. He defended himself and there was retaliation from his defense that said that Bush lied and people died. If you run this through the moonbats on this thread, it was all honest mistakes. If you run the Scooter Libby case by a wingnut, you would see the exact same line of thinking. Did Wilson lie? You be the judge. There is UN documented reports that Iraq was trying to buy uranium from Nigerial while Wilson was there to investigate. He said no. Did Scooter lie. Same diff They most likely both knew the tangled web that they were weaving. I jumped into the BBQ with a “Can’t we all just get along” attitude less than 24 hours ago but I have found a moonbat to wingnut ratio of about 10:1. The fish do not know they are wet. I don’t watch the news, and only get my information from the internet. I get the information that I want to. Maybe I am all wet and don’t know it. This is just another waste of taxpayers money for political purposes. That is the way we like it. Take the powers away from the presidency that are abused at this point in the term. Take away the political gerrymandering. The fact is that it’s not going to happen becuase you don’t wan’t those powers gone when you and I get a turn at the wheel. There were a few wingnuts crying in thier persrciption drugs over the clinton deal, but nothing like the SWEET SWEET SORROW of the leftie tears over this one. Tasty. It will be back and forth for a while, don’t worry. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2007, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/206 "2007-07-07T23:06:29Z")
[QUOTE=bob\_co] Joe Wilson was wrong. Like it or not. That is a fact. . . .There is UN documented reports that Iraq was trying to buy uranium from Nigerial while Wilson was there to investigate. [/QUOTE] Cite? ---
**Author:** ![bob\_co](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b3f665/32.png) [@bob\_co](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_co)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/207 "2007-07-08T00:36:17Z")
Cite – with a pill [http://www.mrc.org/cyberalerts/2005/cyb20050714.asp#1](http://www.mrc.org/cyberalerts/2005/cyb20050714.asp#1) ---
**Author:** ![bob\_co](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b3f665/32.png) [@bob\_co](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_co)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/208 "2007-07-08T00:38:29Z")
LOL wingnuts [http://boortz.com/nuze/200507/07182005.html#wilson](http://boortz.com/nuze/200507/07182005.html#wilson) ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/209 "2007-07-08T00:42:07Z")
[QUOTE=bob\_co] Joe Wilson was wrong. Like it or not. That is a fact. I’d rather get esoteric than argue the facts here simply beacuse the facts go way way back. My sources run a little bit deeper than Ann Coulter. He was there, and it was his job to find this out. It probably happened under his nose and he defended his position that he was not asleep at the wheel. He defended himself and there was retaliation from his defense that said that Bush lied and people died. If you run this through the moonbats on this thread, it was all honest mistakes. If you run the Scooter Libby case by a wingnut, you would see the exact same line of thinking. Did Wilson lie? You be the judge. There is UN documented reports that Iraq was trying to buy uranium from Nigerial while Wilson was there to investigate. He said no. Did Scooter lie. Same diff They most likely both knew the tangled web that they were weaving. I jumped into the BBQ with a “Can’t we all just get along” attitude less than 24 hours ago but I have found a moonbat to wingnut ratio of about 10:1. The fish do not know they are wet. I don’t watch the news, and only get my information from the internet. I get the information that I want to. Maybe I am all wet and don’t know it. This is just another waste of taxpayers money for political purposes. That is the way we like it. Take the powers away from the presidency that are abused at this point in the term. Take away the political gerrymandering. The fact is that it’s not going to happen becuase you don’t wan’t those powers gone when you and I get a turn at the wheel. There were a few wingnuts crying in thier persrciption drugs over the clinton deal, but nothing like the SWEET SWEET SORROW of the leftie tears over this one. Tasty. It will be back and forth for a while, don’t worry. [/QUOTE] In other words, call me a waaaaambulance! Repeating what what you can not support outside right wingnut places is indeed being all wet. And I mentioned before that I crushed guys like you in the University debates, I meant to say that I did mop the floor with guys like you. Hence my remark that I needed to clean the kitchen floor. And good to know that you are a glutton for punishment, I needed punching bag like that for a long time, was getting rusty. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/210 "2007-07-08T00:53:14Z")
And they are all wet sources, claiming that: “Joe Wilson also lied and said the Vice President sent him to Africa. Dick Cheney doesn’t even know Joe Wilson.” Was a bit that was debunked many times already, in the SDMB too no less. [http://mediamatters.org/items/200607150003](http://mediamatters.org/items/200607150003) > [@](#): > > During his discussion with Kagan, King stated that the matter of “who decided Joe Wilson goes to Niger” was a “thing in contention” and “an open question,” and that Wilson “did say in one television interview, and he intimated in some others, that the vice president had sent him to Niger.” But as Media Matters has noted, **Wilson did not claim that Cheney sent him to Niger**. King’s assertion appears to echo a Republican National Committee (RNC) talking points memo made public on July 12, 2005, which accused Wilson of falsely claiming “that it was Vice President Cheney who sent him to Niger.” To support this accusation, the RNC misrepresented Wilson’s July 6, 2003, op-ed in The New York Times, in which he criticized the Bush administration’s use of intelligence to suggest that Iraq had sought to purchase yellowcake uranium in Africa. Additionally, the RNC distorted a remark Wilson made in an August 3, 2003, interview on CNN’s Late Edition with Wolf Blitzer. Contrary to the allegations advanced by the RNC – and apparently adopted by King – Wilson clearly stated in the op-ed that “agency officials” at the CIA had requested he travel to Niger. Further, in the CNN appearance, he stated it was “absolutely true” that Cheney was unaware he went on the trip. > > King’s remark was first noted by Joshua Micah Marshall on his Talking Points Memo weblog. So your sources are the “evil” sorry, I meant to say evil republican sources that you claim to despise too. As I have seen, even the mainstream media has been caught repeating those false bits. What an spectacular way to demonstrate how wet you are. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/211 "2007-07-08T00:56:13Z")
So, in the end you continue to base your say so’s on ignorance, Like it or not. **That** is a fact. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/212 "2007-07-08T01:16:09Z")
[QUOTE=GIGObuster] And they are all wet sources, claiming that: “Joe Wilson also lied and said the Vice President sent him to Africa. Dick Cheney doesn’t even know Joe Wilson.” Was a bit that was debunked many times already, in the SDMB too no less. [/QUOTE] Seems like that meme was developed from a very lose reading of this paragraph in his famous Op Ed piece: > [@Joe Wilson](#): > > In February 2002, I was informed by officials at the Central Intelligence Agency that Vice President Dick Cheney’s office had questions about a particular intelligence report. While I never saw the report, I was told that it referred to a memorandum of agreement that documented the sale of uranium yellowcake — a form of lightly processed ore — by Niger to Iraq in the late 1990’s. The agency officials asked if I would travel to Niger to check out the story so they could provide a response to the vice president’s office. So it’s not even clear that [the office of] Dick Cheney asked anyone to go to Niger-- it seems as though that visit was thought up by the CIA as a way of getting the answer to a question from [the office of] Dick Cheney. One might interpret that as claiming that Cheney sent him on the mission, but I think that’s stretching the meaning well beyond what is reasonable. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/213 "2007-07-08T01:45:30Z")
[QUOTE=bob\_co] Cite – with a pill [http://www.mrc.org/cyberalerts/2005/cyb20050714.asp#1](http://www.mrc.org/cyberalerts/2005/cyb20050714.asp#1) [/QUOTE] [QUOTE=bob\_co] LOL wingnuts > **[UFABOMB เว็บตรง เดิมพันกีฬาออนไลน์มาแรง ครบจบในเว็บเดียวเท่านั้น](https://ufabomb.tech/)** > > เดิมพันกีฬาเว็บ UFABOMB เว็บตรงยูฟ่า ค่าน้ำดีที่สุด มีครบทุกกีฬาให้เลือกเล่น ฟุตบอล บาส เทนนิส มวย ฝากถอนออโต้ ไม่มีขั้นต่ำ สมัครฟรี 24 ชม. [/quote] Neither of those “cites” contains any proof Hussein was trying to acquire yellowcake uranium from Nigeria. But, you knew that. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/214 "2007-07-08T02:25:31Z")
[QUOTE=bob\_co] LOL wingnuts > **[UFABOMB เว็บตรง เดิมพันกีฬาออนไลน์มาแรง ครบจบในเว็บเดียวเท่านั้น](https://ufabomb.tech/)** > > เดิมพันกีฬาเว็บ UFABOMB เว็บตรงยูฟ่า ค่าน้ำดีที่สุด มีครบทุกกีฬาให้เลือกเล่น ฟุตบอล บาส เทนนิส มวย ฝากถอนออโต้ ไม่มีขั้นต่ำ สมัครฟรี 24 ชม. [/QUOTE] Well, there’s your problem, listening to Neal Boortz, [a known baldfaced liar](http://mediamatters.org/items/200707050005): > [@](#): > > On the July 5 broadcast of his nationally syndicated radio show, while discussing President Bush’s commutation of former vice presidential chief of staff I. Lewis “Scooter” Libby’s jail sentence, Neal Boortz falsely claimed that “Scooter Libby and Bill Clinton got sentenced and convicted for exactly the same crime.” As Media Matters for America has previously noted, Clinton was not indicted on criminal charges of perjury by independent counsel Robert Ray or his predecessor, Kenneth Starr. By contrast, a federal jury convicted Libby on four counts of perjury, obstruction of justice, and making false statements. U.S. District Judge Reggie B. Walton subsequently sentenced him to 30 months in federal prison. > > After Boortz made his false statement, a caller responded, “I don’t remember Bill Clinton actually being convicted for perjury.” Boortz told the caller: “I’m sorry, he was.” When the caller stated that the Senate had acquitted Clinton on impeachment charges, Boortz repeated the falsehood a third time, saying: “We’re talking about a criminal trial, sir. The verdict was guilty.” The man is a liar, and he isn’t even very good at it. You really need to take a grapefruit spoon and dig out of your brain anything he ever said that lodged in there. ---
**Author:** ![bob\_co](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b3f665/32.png) [@bob\_co](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_co)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/215 "2007-07-08T02:48:04Z")
Geeeeze. The political jabs go back ad-infinitum. THAT IS MY POINT!!! Joe Wilson lied and peopled died … er something. er he forgot. er he was framed into this whole thing by aliens. WHO ---
**Author:** ![bob\_co](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b3f665/32.png) [@bob\_co](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_co)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/216 "2007-07-08T02:59:42Z")
I’m going to say it again. Take the pardon powers from the president then. Won’t happen because your guy / gal will be there next. Your guy was there before and you were outside the barrell. Give me more of those sweet sweet tears of sorrow that I’m feeling here. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/217 "2007-07-08T03:03:00Z")
[QUOTE=bob\_co] Joe Wilson lied and peopled died .. er something. [/QUOTE] But, he did not lie. ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/218 "2007-07-08T03:03:26Z")
Nice dodge there, sir! How about you address other people’s arguments? Or would that be interrupting your delicious meal of tears and foot? ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/219 "2007-07-08T03:26:28Z")
[QUOTE=bob\_co] I’m going to say it again. [/quote] And again with the face on the floor. > [@](#): > > Take the pardon powers from the president then. > Won’t happen because your guy / gal will be there next. Spectacularly missing the point is your forte, pardons powers are there as a check to the other branches of the government, the problem right now is that the government is controled by right wingers (The democratic mayority in congress does have conservative democrats), and corrupted by them. > [@](#): > > Your guy was there before and you were outside the barrell. And that is your last refuge, any democratic candidate will not be my guy because he/she will be mostly a centrist, but you want to ignore that there is really no serious leftist candidate because it would dawn on you what idiotic ideas you have. > [@](#): > > Give me more of those sweet sweet tears of sorrow that I’m feeling here. Bwa Haa haaa! Sure there are tears, I grant you that, we are laughing so hard! ---
**Author:** ![bob\_co](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b3f665/32.png) [@bob\_co](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_co)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296/220 "2007-07-08T03:29:03Z")
I provided the cites that you all didn’t like for a reason. It really doesn’t matter where they come from, if they were in favor of my argument they would be from wingnuts and therefore discredited in a moonbat argument. Tit for tat the arguments are the same on either side. There is no reason is hell to take an oath and tell the truth in this political environment and nooobody is about to unload this gun because it is working. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scooter-libby-skates-free/410296.md?page=12)