# Scores killed in explosions and shootout in Paris. Hostages being held **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 13, 2015, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499 "2015-11-13T21:55:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 16
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/301 "2015-11-14T16:50:19Z")
> [@truthSeeker2](#): > > Once USA cross a threshold population %age, you won’t be able to ban it anyways. So ban it now when the population %age is still low. Care to expand on the details of how to accomplish a ban on Islam? The Romans banned Christianity, and we can see how that turned out, and they weren’t constrained by any pesky democratic principles. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/302 "2015-11-14T17:11:33Z")
> [@WolfpackJeep](#): > > This explains why we recently had presidential candidates attending a “Christian” conference that featured a pastor who advocates killing gay folks…they must be secret Muslims. > > :dubious: Bingo. Christianity _should_ be a religion of peace, but it’s far too often been a warrior religion in the hands of many of its proponents. And today’s evangelicals demonstrate that it’s not just some historical artifact, like the Crusades or the Thirty Years’ War. So I guess we’d better throw out the Christians while we’re getting rid of the Muslims. Excuse me while I throw myself out! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/303 "2015-11-14T17:18:32Z")
Whenever I really want to get the radical Christians (sacrificial) goat, I point out that they believe so much of what radical Muslims do that they should go live under the Taliban, where they ban abortion, subjugate woman, kill homosexuals, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/304 "2015-11-14T17:20:12Z")
> [@truthSeeker2](#): > > …All other religions except Islam live with harmony in 21st century . his [harmony](http://pressreleases.religionnews.com/2015/05/28/indian-christian-and-muslim-victims-of-forced-conversions-approach-us-court-against-hindu-supremacist-group/)is [selective](http://www.straitstimes.com/asia/south-asia/new-recruits-to-indias-hindu-supremacist-group-hearing-anti-muslim-messages). ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/305 "2015-11-14T17:29:17Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > That’s hysterical. Past attempts at banning various religions over the millennia have shown just how successful that strategy would be. Actually, it was very successful. How many ancient religions survive in Muslim or Christian lands? Not that it would succeed today in a digital world. ---
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a8b319/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_wuzzy)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/306 "2015-11-14T17:32:47Z")
Reports that one of the terrorists did come into the EU as a registered refugee from Syria. [http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/14/syrian-greece-refugee-paris-attacks-killers](http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/14/syrian-greece-refugee-paris-attacks-killers) Im willing to admit this is an early report. What is a report today may be an untruth tomorrow. ---
**Author:** ![truthSeeker2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7cd45c/32.png) [@truthSeeker2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/truthSeeker2)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/307 "2015-11-14T17:36:30Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Care to expand on the details of how to accomplish a ban on Islam? The Romans banned Christianity, and we can see how that turned out, and they weren’t constrained by any pesky democratic principles. Rest of the world frankly does not matter for the reasons mentioned earlier. The opposition from American Muslims would be far from unmanageable. Convincing Americans is the only thing that matters. Majority of Americans would support the ban IMO. But work hard to build support base of 80-90% population. Present to them the bigger picture, the massive effect it will have on the world. Only the weight of a big majority can make it happen. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/308 "2015-11-14T17:42:25Z")
> [@Fuzzy\_wuzzy](#): > > Reports that one of the terrorists did come into the EU as a registered refugee from Syria. > > [http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/14/syrian-greece-refugee-paris-attacks-killers](http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/14/syrian-greece-refugee-paris-attacks-killers) > > Im willing to admit this is an early report. What is a report today may be an untruth tomorrow. You must have missed that > [@](#): > > a known French extremist and an Egyptian were said to be among a cell of eight Islamist gunmen… ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/309 "2015-11-14T17:43:57Z")
> [@truthSeeker2](#): > > Convincing Americans is the only thing that matters. Majority of Americans would support the ban IMO. As long as these Americans want to dismantle the Constitution, what other parts should they get rid of? ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/310 "2015-11-14T17:43:59Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Actually, it was very successful. How many ancient religions survive in Muslim or Christian lands? Not that it would succeed today in a digital world. None in the christian, but in the Muslim lands many, it is why there are the current minorities even in the old core middle east, like the Iraq, more than one thousand years after the territories of this modern country became majority muslim from the slow drip drip of conversion. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/311 "2015-11-14T17:44:55Z")
> [@truthSeeker2](#): > > Rest of the world frankly does not matter for the reasons mentioned earlier. > > The opposition from American Muslims would be far from unmanageable. > > Convincing Americans is the only thing that matters. Majority of Americans would support the ban IMO. But work hard to build support base of 80-90% population. Present to them the bigger picture, the massive effect it will have on the world. Only the weight of a big majority can make it happen. Still no specifics? What would a ban entail? ---
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a8b319/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_wuzzy)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/312 "2015-11-14T17:50:11Z")
> [@running\_coach](#): > > You must have missed that No, I didn’t miss that. I singled out the Syrian refugee as some on here earlier were trying to argue that Syrian refugees would be grateful for their welcome into Europe; that Syrian refugees were not a threat. It’s an argument I have also seen elsewhere today. The reported refugee status of one of the terrorists was therefore particularly relevent. ---
**Author:** ![truthSeeker2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7cd45c/32.png) [@truthSeeker2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/truthSeeker2)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/313 "2015-11-14T17:50:25Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Still no specifics? What would a ban entail? Entail in USA you mean? Once you have 80-90% population-base supporting the ban, it will be smooth. Worldwide, it will be few USA flags burned, some leaders of some nations showing fake outrage and that’s it. In the longer run, it will be very very positive IMO. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/314 "2015-11-14T17:52:58Z")
> [@truthSeeker2](#): > > Entail in USA you mean? Once you have 80-90% population-base supporting the ban, it will be smooth. What will be smooth? What do you propose to accomplish a ban on Islam? ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/315 "2015-11-14T17:54:27Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Actually, it was very successful. How many ancient religions survive in Muslim or Christian lands? Not that it would succeed today in a digital world. I don’t doubt you could terrorize them into hiding or abandoning their religion. The strategy I was referring to is that they’ll simply stop practicing because we tell them to. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/316 "2015-11-14T17:54:49Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > None in the christian, but in the Muslim lands many, it is why there are the current minorities even in the old core middle east, like the Iraq, more than one thousand years after the territories of this modern country became majority muslim from the slow drip drip of conversion. Many?? What would they be? ---
**Author:** ![Iggy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iggy/32/3364_2.png) [@Iggy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Iggy)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/317 "2015-11-14T17:57:02Z")
This attack in Paris reminded me of an article published in the satirical paper \*The Onion \*shortly after the 9/11 attacks. It’s worth a re-read. [God Angrily Clarifies ‘Don’t Kill’ Rule](http://www.theonion.com/article/god-angrily-clarifies-dont-kill-rule-222) published Sept 26, 2001. In more recent times _The Onion_ has begun to reuse an article about mass shooting events, tweaking it slightly each time to reflect the shoot du’jour. This has become [something of a meme](http://www.npr.org/sections/itsallpolitics/2015/10/03/445266632/-memeoftheweek-that-article-from-the-onion-about-mass-shootings). I couldn’t help but realize that the 9/11 article could be used in much the same way. Just change New York to Paris and make a couple other changes and article is done. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/318 "2015-11-14T17:57:36Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > Well, if he means those people should be included AMONG the victims of this attack as people we need to care about and watch out for, I absolutely agree. > > And if I thought for a second anyone would look twice at a Caucasian practitioner of that ideology, or assume that people of a certain skin tone were anything but, that would be more compelling. > > But either way, since according to you it’s not racist to oppose Islam, you should have no problem describing in frank detail exactly what you think should be done to Muslims here and abroad, right? Done to Muslims? The ideology is what needs undermining. The West doesn’t have to accept those who fervently believe and act upon violent and archaic ramblings. So accept the believers at face value and unapologetically engage them in serious debate about how their ideology is incompatible with the ideals of classical liberalism. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/319 "2015-11-14T18:00:52Z")
Yazidi, the various Christian sects, some of which only survived in the Iraq as they were suppressed by the Byzantines, the Zoroastrians, etc. And this is the Iraq. Since you do not know the history, try not to comment on it. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2015, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499/320 "2015-11-14T18:02:42Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > I still wish conservatives would just flat out state that they hate Islam and everything it stands for, and think its practitioners should be wiped off the face of the Earth or forced to abandon their religion and culture for Christianity (or atheism or whatever). > > “Waah,” they say, “but if I didn’t pussyfoot and use euphemisms and sarcasm, people might call me racist!” Well, if you really think you’re right, and that your path is the best or only way to save countless lives, what the hell does that matter? Show you’re braver than the liberals you accuse all the time of being pants-wettingly afraid of everything! > > Just state what you believe and why flat out already. And this applies to SO many topics I can think of (gay marriage, racial issues, etc). Abortion may be the only topic on which a good number of conservatives actually do this. Lol. A belief system of nutty fairy tales is not a race so calm down and leave that poor straw man and worn out RaceCardtm alone. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499.md?page=15) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scores-killed-in-explosions-and-shootout-in-paris-hostages-being-held/737499.md?page=17)