# Scott Plaid, Stand Up or Shut Up **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 2, 2005, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794 "2005-07-02T03:22:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 25
**Author:** ![Ponder\_Stibbons](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponder_stibbons/32/343_2.png) [@Ponder\_Stibbons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponder_Stibbons)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/481 "2005-07-07T14:26:48Z")
> [@Excalibre](#): > > Where was that thread about how many five-year-olds you could take on? Wan’t that one of the Michael Jackson threads? Ouch! Stop hitting me! ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/482 "2005-07-07T14:47:41Z")
> [@Ponder Stibbons](#): > > Wan’t that one of the Michael Jackson threads? > > Ouch! Stop hitting me! Ha ha, the last line wasn’t a question, so I win - don’t I? Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/483 "2005-07-07T14:54:10Z")
**Shodan** : Is the pledge now off? I haven’t heard seen nor heard from \*\*Scott \*\*for awhile. Seems like he just threw in the towel. ---
**Author:** ![Monstre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@Monstre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monstre)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/484 "2005-07-07T15:00:19Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > **Shodan** : Is the pledge now off? I haven’t heard seen nor heard from \*\*Scott \*\*for awhile. Seems like he just threw in the towel. Maybe that’s how he will fulfill his end of the bargain. Disappear for a week. “See, I didnt argue any, points in GD lats week! I win and so therefour all my past present, and future points are correct.” ---
**Author:** ![Crotalus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crotalus/32/41_2.png) [@Crotalus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crotalus)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/485 "2005-07-07T15:00:35Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > I haven’t heard seen nor heard from \*\*Scott \*\*for awhile. Seems like he just threw in the towel. He’s online now, but hasn’t posted anything since 11:31 AM yesterday. Perhaps he’s reading. ---
**Author:** ![Mollie\_Magill](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mollie_magill/32/20882_2.png) [@Mollie\_Magill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mollie_Magill)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/486 "2005-07-07T15:03:09Z")
> [@Tim Staab](#): > > He’s online now, but hasn’t posted anything since 11:31 AM yesterday. Perhaps he’s reading. I think he had mentioned that he would take the time to read and not post for a while. Bravo, **Scott**. ---
**Author:** ![Scott\_Plaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Scott\_Plaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scott_Plaid)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/487 "2005-07-07T15:03:59Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > **Shodan** : Is the pledge now off? I haven’t heard seen nor heard from \*\*Scott \*\*for awhile. Seems like he just threw in the towel. No, last post here, I promised that I would continue posting only question in Gd from now on. However, what with the bombings, I have been paying more attention to those then the board. I will still continue a question only format when I return to GD. Now, I have an incomplete post I have waiting on the back burner. Since you are wondering what has happened to me, I will post the first half. It contains responces to the posts made so far. The second half, will I expect to post in an hour, contains links to past threads. Some of these threads I believe I have won. However, if I am the only who believes I won, they are useless, so I am sorting out those in which I was the only one advocating my side. ---
**Author:** ![Scott\_Plaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Scott\_Plaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scott_Plaid)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/488 "2005-07-07T15:06:04Z")
> [@Maus Magill](#): > > And yet, you continue to argue as if you’re in the GD thread. > > Read more. Post Less. > > To paraphrase Gandalf: Most of us are not trying to hurt you, we’re trying to help you. I heard you, and yet… > [@John Mace](#): > > I haven’t checked those cites, but I didn’t think this was a contest to see who broke down first. My thoughts were you’d go for a week just asking Qs in GD, and if either of you went off track, I’d guide you back on track. Got it. Thank you for the clarification. > [@Monstre](#): > > In those two posts, it looked to me like Shodan was just asking questions. Which parts did you object to? Yes, there were some sentences that didn’t end in question marks, if you want to be literalistic about it, but they were statements in which **Shodan** was trying to clarify for himself what he thought the other person was saying, then asking, “Is this correct?” The part when he said things like “Well, I feel that you are saying… Is this right” kinda things, or where he stated how he believed the system worked. However, I was reading them over too quickly, and I now see how they work in the correct format. Oh, and while I fully realize you are having a lot of fun mocking my posting style, well, at least you are having fun. 😃 > [@RobuSensei](#): > > Y’know, I waited far too long to add my two cents in… > > **Scott,** on the VERY off chance that you’re still reading this, I’d like to bring a few things to your attention. Although, considering that many others have already said these exact same things, and you seem to not give a damn, I don’t know why I’m trying, but what the hell. > > First, if YOU and YOU ALONE are declaring yourself the “victor” in a debate, odds are you aren’t. It’s FAR more likely that you’ve won if OTHER people are saying, “wow, good point,” or “I see where you’re coming from.” It isn’t so much that I don’t give a damn, as I want to defend past posts. Also, I looked over the thread that Shodan linked to, and realized to myself last night, that you aren’t winning unless people are agreeing with you. Same conclusion you reached, I see. Oh, and by the way, I have lurked. > [@Rubystreak](#): > > **Scott** , you said, “at least I held out longer without making statements _then_ **Shodan**.” > > :smack: > > Held out longer **THAN** Shodan. Alright, “than Shodan.”, not “then.” > [@John Mace](#): > > I count ZERO question marks in that post. Not even close to being in the spirit of the agreement. > > **Scott** : Have you given up sticking to the agreement? The idea was, people at the tine were asking about how best to frame the debate. Since I was one of the participants, I thought it seemed unfair that I would have my voice ignored. Thus, I voted against changing the format. At the time, I felt it was ok, since it was a hijack in that thread. I see now how it was wrong, however. It was a statement, hijack or not. > [@Excalibre](#): > > **Scott** referred to “social morays”. He linked to a page with that title, and presumed to tell **Sauron** what “social morays” are. _The very page he linked to_ was a page about “eggcorns”, common _misinterpretations_ of spoken language. That page that **Scott** found was nothing more than an explanation of the fact that “social morays” is a misspelling of “social mores”. Actually, what the link said was that it was now **socially acceptable** to misspell it in that way. Thus, I was acknowledging, via my link, that I misspelled it, but it was no big deal. After all, everyone else jumped off the bridge. > [@](#): > > I don’t know how old he is. I’ve been working on the assumption that he’s about fourteen, which (coupled with a learning disability affecting his ability to read and write) would explain his behavior. If that’s the case, then maybe he’ll one day grow up enough to participate here. But if he’s older than that, then his performance in that debate is a sign of just how unable he is to comprehend what he looks like in an argument and just how far below the average for the SDMB his understanding and knowledge are. Personally, I think I am pretty damn smart. However, I while I may be delusional about that, I am not fourteen years old. Remember my teaching experience I mentioned, way back in the thread? Summer School, back in college. Well, that was not just some kinda “Man pretending to be a woman on the internet” thing. No, that was a statement that, should I come to a doperfest, I can physically remove the I.D. card from my wallet, and show it to anyone who thinks I am “14”. > [@](#): > > The thread ended pretty soon after that. I bet **Scott Plaid** is under the mistaken impression that **Sauron** ’s giving up on him is some sort of sign that he “won”. Actually, I was under the impression I won, due to the other people on the thread agreeing with me. Re:Your analogy : Perhaps you are right. Perhaps you are wrong. I will have to think about it. ---
**Author:** ![Monstre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@Monstre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monstre)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/489 "2005-07-07T15:07:51Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Ha ha, the last line wasn’t a question, so I win - > don’t I? Do you see somebody handing you a trophy? ---
**Author:** ![Scott\_Plaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Scott\_Plaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scott_Plaid)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/490 "2005-07-07T15:10:08Z")
> [@Maus Magill](#): > > I think he had mentioned that he would take the time to read and not post for a while. Correct. > [@](#): > > Bravo, **Scott**. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/491 "2005-07-07T15:21:30Z")
I too am taking the time to read rather than post, which this post proves. If you do not believe me, read it again. ---
**Author:** ![Uvula\_Donor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e19adc/32.png) [@Uvula\_Donor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uvula_Donor)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/492 "2005-07-07T15:26:05Z")
> [@Scott Plaid](#): > > Personally, I think I am pretty damn smart. You need to recalibrate. ---
**Author:** ![Scott\_Plaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Scott\_Plaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scott_Plaid)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/493 "2005-07-07T15:26:51Z")
Nah, I just want you to take it on faith that I really am reading past articles. **Liberal** : :dubious: Yeah, I know how likely it is that you will. ---
**Author:** ![Sauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce7236/32.png) [@Sauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sauron)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/494 "2005-07-07T15:29:42Z")
> [@Scott Plaid](#): > > Actually, I was under the impression I won, due to the other people on the thread agreeing with me. There were other posters agreeing with me, too … so how do we decide who “wins”? **Scott Plaid** , I saw no reason to continue that debate – you began to change my own words around to fit what you wanted them to say, and refused to acknowledge any of my points. It was a waste of my time to attempt to converse with you on that subject. So I stopped. If you want to claim “victory” based on that, that’s your choice. However, you did absolutely nothing to sway me to your interpretation of the issue; in fact, all you did was convince me that it was pointless to even try to understand your position. That could have been an interesting debate/conversation with the appropriate person, but in my eyes you were not that person. It’s been said before, but I’ll take this opportunity to say it again: Don’t go into a debate with a preconceived notion that you’ll “win.” View it as an attempt to see an issue from another perspective. That attitude (which I had to learn; I was quite pigheaded early on, and can still be at times, unfortunately) has helped me numerous times on this board. I may never agree with another poster on an issue, but I can broaden my understanding of why they would feel differently than I do. You seem to refuse to do that (both in that thread and in general), which is why I quit trying to explain my position. ---
**Author:** ![Monstre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@Monstre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monstre)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/495 "2005-07-07T15:52:31Z")
> [@Scott Plaid](#): > > Actually, what the link said was that it was now **socially acceptable** to misspell it in that way. Thus, I was acknowledging, via my link, that I misspelled it, but it was no big deal. After all, everyone else jumped off the bridge. Hey, you’ve got to admit – **Sauron** ’s comment about eels that liked to talk to each other (social morays) was pretty funny. And I don’t really think that joking comment counts as jumping off the bridge. The rest of the discussion seemed to be more about whether social mores and “morals” were equivalent concepts or different concepts. > [@Scott Plaid](#): > > No, that was a statement that, should I come to a doperfest, I can physically remove the I.D. card from my wallet, and show it to anyone who thinks I am “14”. Just for the record (to others in the thread), Scott did post a picture in one of the recent photo threads. Assuming that was him (and I had no reason to believe it wasn’t), he looked to be in his mid-20s to me, if I recall correctly. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/496 "2005-07-07T16:11:54Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > **Shodan** : Is the pledge now off? I haven’t heard seen nor heard from \*\*Scott \*\*for awhile. Seems like he just threw in the towel. Not from this end, regardless of what **Scott** decides to do. I’m now counting down two deadlines - next Monday at 3:24pm, and a week from Saturday at whenever HPatHBP arrives. 😃 Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Scott\_Plaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Scott\_Plaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scott_Plaid)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/497 "2005-07-07T16:26:04Z")
> [@Excalibre](#): > > Just for shits ‘n’ giggles, though, **Scott** , which debates did you think you won? Before I do so, I believe this bears repeating: > [@RobuSensei](#): > > First, if YOU and YOU ALONE are declaring yourself the “victor” in a debate, odds are you aren’t. Well, you asked for it. Before I begin, a note. I have carefully looked through past threads, and have picked out those in which I thought I was the only one who was right, period. Instead, the following contains people chiming in, and agreeing I am correct. In addition, I have looked through the threads, and made sure that the points I made were not proved wrong later in the thread. This has reduced many threads from my mental estimation of one I have most definitely “won”. I have also realized that many of the “debates” I recall winning were about a poster disagreeing with me about the definition of a word, till I proved them wrong. However, I still believe I am right, more often then I am wrong. Now, I have only posted links below to four debates. It is not a complete list, because I have a summer job to get to, and I need to split. I will post more threads I think I have “won” later. [Why the Pubbies Are Trying To Muzzle NPR](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=321859) > [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > As **Scott Plaid** said I think there are more good reasons to keep NPR around than “bad” reasons to let it disappear as a not worthwhile thing. [For fuck’s sake, the flag burning amendment AGAIN?!](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=322349) > [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > To me, the distinction between making it criminal to burn a cross and keeping the freedom to burn a flag is that the former meets such a definition of assault and the latter does not (as **Diogenes** and **Scott Plaid** have noted). [Is NPR biased?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=6321578) > [@magellan01](#): > > Scott Plaid: I agree. \ The next one was a real dozy. [Hacker vs Cracker](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=322456) I believe I was 100% right on the issues. tomndebb and Excalibre and others don’t agree. However, rfgdxm and agreed with me. Since I seriously doubt tom will ever agree with the claim I made, regardless of who advocates it, I counted this one as being as close to a victory as possible. > [@rfgdxm](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > Originally Posted by Scott Plaid > > Historically, people used the term Hacker to mean what a geek would like you to use it as first, before Hollywood started using it to mean “Cracker.” They invented the word, thus, it means what it mean > > .Yep. And more accurately, the word “hacker” meant “programmer” or “a person knowledgeable about computer systems.” Thus, a programmer confronted with a software bug might say to his boss “I’ll hack some code to fix that, and have it for you by tomorrow.” > > **tomndebb** : Note that the concept of “hacking code” predates the times when a “hostile invader” really became an issue. (Which is in the mid-1970s as you say.) Way back in the early days, computers were rarely connected remotely. Thus way back in the early 1960s, “hacker” could only mean “programmer”. I suspect the reason that “hacker” came to mean “hostile invader” is that “hacking code” usually meant crude programming. A “hack” was a “quick and dirty fix” to a bug. In theory programmers would like to write elegant, bug free code. However, when the system went down and the boss was screaming about it, a “code hack” would have to do. Also, I claimed that tom’s cites didn’t say what he thought they said. **InvisibleWombat** agreed with me, while not ruling on the other issues at hand. So, there you have it. Four comments, each from debates which I believe ended with my side proving their case, and not the other side. This is not to say that this is the best way to win a debate, just one. Others have pointed out the usefulness of having the other side see your point, but sometimes, I believe that is not possible. ---
**Author:** ![Scott\_Plaid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Scott\_Plaid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scott_Plaid)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/498 "2005-07-07T16:28:44Z")
> [@Monstre](#): > > Hey, you’ve got to admit – **Sauron** ’s comment about eels that liked to talk to each other (social morays) was pretty funny. Quite true. However, the end result seems to have been just what I think it was. > [@](#): > > Just for the record (to others in the thread), Scott did post a picture in one of the recent photo threads. Assuming that was him (and I had no reason to believe it wasn’t), he looked to be in his mid-20s to me, if I recall correctly. Thank you for pointing this out. Yup, it’s me. ---
**Author:** ![Uvula\_Donor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e19adc/32.png) [@Uvula\_Donor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uvula_Donor)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/499 "2005-07-07T17:12:56Z")
[OMFG!!!111! **Sc0t pLaID** is t3h WINNAR!!!111one!!!](http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/index.php/Image:Winnar.JPG) ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2005, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794/500 "2005-07-07T17:26:27Z")
> [@Scott Plaid](#): > > Thank you for pointing this out. Yup, it’s me. You’re a really nice looking guy, Scott. Nice, as in friendly. If you’d just be yourself, you’d probably be okay. I know you don’t like the Bible, but there are some pretty good life-lessons in it, and one of them is this: ========== Jesus saw how the guests had tried to take the best seats. So he told them: When you are invited to a wedding feast, don’t sit in the best place. Someone more important may have been invited. Then the one who invited you will come and say, “Give your place to this other guest!” You will be embarrassed and will have to sit in the worst place. When you are invited to be a guest, go and sit in the worst place. Then the one who invited you may come and say, “My friend, take a better seat!” You will then be honored in front of all the other guests. If you put yourself above others, you will be put down. But if you humble yourself, you will be honored. Luke 14:7-11 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794.md?page=24) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scott-plaid-stand-up-or-shut-up/310794.md?page=26)