# SCOTUS declines voter ID challenge **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [March 23, 2015, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811 "2015-03-23T20:24:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/41 "2015-03-24T15:32:43Z")
> [@RickG](#): > > Why bother, though? Local precincts, IME, cover very small areas and a few hundred voters. It would be ridiculous (and risky) to go in and lie about who you are, since chances are high that the _real_ person of that name would come in and protest. So when that happened to me - someone used my name and signed next to my name at the polls one year - what risk is there that the fraudster would be caught? The people there didn’t care that I could prove I was me. The fraudster clearly did not provide a name, address or any other identifying information. How do you propose to catch people committing fraud if they never have to show ID? ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/42 "2015-03-24T15:37:48Z")
> [@RickG](#): > > Construct me a voter ID law that includes funding for a corps of “ID enablers” to reach out to every citizen, check whether they have ID, and actively help them get one if they lack it. Then I’d feel more comfortable about requiring everyone to show ID at the polls. I have advocated this since the beginning (interesting many of the Dems are starting to come around to this as a compromise) BUT if we do this I also favor that the Voting Rights Act be amended so that you need to prove eligibility to vote in order to register rather than the current “Under penalty of perjury I pinkie-promise I’m a citizen.” signature. ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/43 "2015-03-24T15:38:06Z")
In every presidential election I can recall there were stories about some precinct somewhere where the number of votes cast exceeded the number of registered voters. You can’t do that by accident; it’s caused by someone (or more likely, a group of people) stuffing the ballot box. In a close election, this might make a difference. Perhaps not in the presidential race, but it could affect who wins a closely-contested congressional seat, or any number of local issues. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/44 "2015-03-24T15:41:01Z")
About this: > [@](#): > > …97.6% of whites, 95.5% of blacks, and 94.1% of Latinos possess qualifying IDs or the documents that would permit Wisconsin to issue them… Where did these numbers come from? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/45 "2015-03-24T15:44:46Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > [Supreme Court Won’t Consider Challenge To Wisconsin Voter ID Law](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/23/supreme-court-wisconsin_n_6923170.html) > > Of all the issues dear to the left, I find this one of the most ridiculous. The idea that getting a form of ID is an extreme hardship is completely absurd. I’m actually surprised that providing proper ID to show you are who you say you are when voting hasn’t always been a requirement. It typically is in most countries. And although it could cause some short term disruption in the US, it should be a non-issue once we’ve made it SOP here, too. I think it’s important, if we are going to have such laws, to make sure they are not enacted right before an election-- give at least a couple years notice to let people adjust. BTW, there is a Pit thread of about a billion pages on this subject, and although there is much vitriol being thrown, it still has pretty much every argument anyone is ever going to make in it. Did you not see it? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/46 "2015-03-24T15:47:20Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > A free voter ID is not a poll tax, as the Supreme Court explicitly decided in _Crawford v. Marion County_. “A free voter ID” is not a thing that exists. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/47 "2015-03-24T15:51:24Z")
Both sides prefer to accuse the other of having ulterior motives. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/48 "2015-03-24T15:51:26Z")
It could be done. It could have _been_ done. They didn’t want to. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/49 "2015-03-24T15:52:37Z")
An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/50 "2015-03-24T15:54:52Z")
Rather depends, doesn’t it, on whether you are vaccinating against smallpox, or working to prevent the public being gored by a unicorn stampede? ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/51 "2015-03-24T15:56:53Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > “A free voter ID” is not a thing that exists. What is the cost of a voter ID in Wisconsin? To whom would money be paid and for what? [You are wrong.](http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/drivers/drivers/apply/idcard.htm) > [@](#): > > FREE Wisconsin ID cards for voting > If you are a U.S. citizen, will be at least 18 years of age by the next election, and would like a Wisconsin ID card to vote, please check the ID for FREE box when completing the MV3004 (Wisconsin Identification Card (ID) application) or when applying online. > > A Document Verification Petition Process is available if fees arise in order to obtain a free ID card for voting. This petition process is available if any of the following applies: > > Applicant is unable to provide documents for proof of name and date of birth as required by Wis. Admin. Code § Trans 102.15(3)(a) but which require a fee to a government agency to obtain. This includes documentation needed for proof of legal name change. > Applicant is unable to provide documents for proof of United States citizenship as required by Wis. Admin. Code § Trans 102.15(3m) but which require a fee to a government agency to obtain. > > A free ID card is NOT available under the following circumstances: > > If you currently have a valid, unexpired driver license (DL), you are not eligible under Wisconsin law to obtain an ID. > If you will not be at least 18 years of age on the date of the next election. > If you are not eligible to vote in Wisconsin. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/52 "2015-03-24T16:03:35Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > What is the cost of a voter ID in Wisconsin? To whom would money be paid and for what? > > [You are wrong.](http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/drivers/drivers/apply/idcard.htm) The “Document Verification Petition Process” required to waive the fee still requires the applicant to provide a Social Security Number and proof of identity and residency. It’s a Catch-22 - you need to spend money to acquire the documents you need in order to be exempted from having to spend money. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/53 "2015-03-24T16:05:12Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > “A free voter ID” is not a thing that exists. I beg to differ. It used to be that in Los Angeles County, when you registered to vote, the county sent you a voter ID card. For free. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/54 "2015-03-24T16:15:04Z")
And wherever that is the case, good! Wherever it is _not_ the case, _not_ good. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/55 "2015-03-24T16:24:40Z")
You need such documents to work. Are you saying there is no constitutional problem or justice problem with requiring people to spend money to get a job as a matter of law? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/56 "2015-03-24T16:26:48Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Are you saying there is no constitutional problem or justice problem with requiring people to spend money to get a job as a matter of law? The Constitution does not guarantee a right to work, so no. It _does_ guarantee a right to vote that cannot be denied on the basis of inability to pay a poll tax, which is exactly what the GOP is up to here. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/57 "2015-03-24T16:27:39Z")
> [@](#): > > You need such documents to work. Are you saying there is no constitutional problem or justice problem with requiring people to spend money to get a job as a matter of law? If its all the same to you, I would prefer that the words that come out of my mouth be placed there by me. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/58 "2015-03-24T16:30:11Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > The Constitution does not guarantee a right to work, so no. It _does_ guarantee a right to vote that cannot be denied on the basis of inability to pay a poll tax, which is exactly what the GOP is up to here. Actually, no. Forbidding votes, disenfranchising, is not the plan. That would be wrong. Making it more difficult, more troublesome, _that_ is the plan. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/59 "2015-03-24T16:33:25Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > The Constitution does not guarantee a right to work, so no. It _does_ guarantee a right to vote that cannot be denied on the basis of inability to pay a poll tax, which is exactly what the GOP is up to here. Neither does it guarantee a right to vote. Like the right to earn a living, it is implied, and also like the right to earn a living, you can’t be discriminated against. However, since we already require people to have this documentation as a condition for being an independent human being, it should be assumed that people will already have these documents. Whether voter ID is justified depends on whether the conditions attached are arduous or not. In a country where people by law have to prove they have f\*#\*!ng HEALTH INSURANCE as as condition of living, we can require a Social Security card and birth certificate to register to vote. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2015, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811/60 "2015-03-24T16:34:30Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Actually, no. Forbidding votes, disenfranchising, is not the plan. That would be wrong. Making it more difficult, more troublesome, _that_ is the plan. If we wanted to make it difficult, we’d start by, you know, making it difficult. Requiring ID to vote to prevent voting is akin to putting cigarettes behind the counter to prevent smoking. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-declines-voter-id-challenge/715811.md?page=4)