# SCOTUS to hear case of praying ex-football coach (yet another "religious liberty" case) **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 16, 2022, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891 "2022-01-16T11:02:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2022, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/181 "2022-06-29T16:31:06Z")
I don’t know that it would be that blatant, but the point regarding the power dynamic does ring true. While a coach likely would not cut a player for not joining in the prayer, the coach could have that player ride the bench more during games, while allowing the joiners to get more play time. Someone would have to be keeping close track of a player’s time on the field both before and after the decision not to join-in, I suppose, to make a case. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2022, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/182 "2022-06-29T18:09:55Z")
Ummmmmm … > [@Omnibus Stupid MFers in the news thread](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-stupid-mfers-in-the-news-thread/931945/3545): > > The EEOC is suing a company in North Carolina for firing two employees for refusing to take part in prayer meetings. I’m sure the Supreme Court will rule that the firings were appropriate. [https://abc11.com/nc-workers-fired-not-joining-aurora-pro-services-daily-prayer-devotion-eeoc-atheist/12001573/](https://abc11.com/nc-workers-fired-not-joining-aurora-pro-services-daily-prayer-devotion-eeoc-atheist/12001573/) You could knock me over with a feather /s ---
**Author:** ![CurtC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce73a5/32.png) [@CurtC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CurtC)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2022, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/183 "2022-06-29T20:11:34Z")
> [@snowthx](#): > > While a coach likely would not cut a player for not joining in the prayer, the coach could have that player ride the bench more during games, while allowing the joiners to get more play time. Someone would have to be keeping close track of a player’s time on the field both before and after the decision… That’s one issue, but another (and I think larger) issue is that a player who doesn’t want to be part of the coach’s religion will feel coerced to participate in the coach’s prayer, because he thinks it will get him more play time, or he wants to be included in the team event, or whatever. You don’t need measurable differences in play time for this decision to be a problem, because we already have the plain fact that players could feel coerced. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2022, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/184 "2022-06-29T20:23:57Z")
Very true. Agree. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/185 "2022-06-30T18:03:04Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Expect them to go after _Engel_ next. I think the coach (who is a 4-star asshole IMO) was on semi-solid ground when he just prayed by himself. It’s when he started “leading” prayers that he stepped over the Constitutional line. And this is why the “How would they like it if satanists did this” fall flat. The response from the court would be, “Sure, they can do that, and if they get a large crowd of supporters to pray with them it would also be just as fine” realizing that that will never happen. This is the way the Christians get around the Separation of Church and state. The government didn’t choose promote Christianity over other religions, they just set up the system such that the most popular one has dominance, which coincidentally always seems to be Christianity. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/186 "2022-06-30T19:11:51Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > The response from the court would be, “Sure, they can do that, and if they get a large crowd of supporters to pray with them it would also be just as fine” realizing that that will never happen. Might get a crowd if it is a proper celebration to Dionysus. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/187 "2022-06-30T19:18:10Z")
Hold my beer. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/188 "2022-06-30T21:51:29Z")
Shouldn’t that be « Hold my retsina! » ? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2022, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/189 "2022-06-30T23:48:43Z")
My boy embraces alcohol in ALL its forms. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2022, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/190 "2022-10-27T21:22:14Z")
Bumping this thread due to updates: > **[High school football coach who led prayers on the field will get his job back](https://www.npr.org/2022/10/27/1131880548/football-coach-prayers-reinstated)** > > Joseph Kennedy will be reinstated to his previous position with the Bremerton High School football team, after the Supreme Court ruled in his favor. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2022, 2:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/191 "2022-10-28T02:50:40Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > This is the way the Christians get around the Separation of Church and state. I’ll have to disagree with you on this. The way the Christians "get around SOCAS is quite simple: they flat out ignore it. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2022, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/192 "2022-10-28T12:29:08Z")
I’ll go a step further and suggest many of them don’t acknowledge it at all, and behave such that church and state are one-in-the-same, and always have been. I doubt the man at the center of this story even considered that he might be crossing some line. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2022, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/193 "2022-10-28T15:04:17Z")
> [@snowthx](#): > > I doubt the man at the center of this story even considered that he might be crossing some line. Ironic considering his job. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2022, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/194 "2022-10-28T15:20:41Z")
> [@snowthx](#): > > [High school football coach who led prayers on the field will get his job back : NPR](https://www.npr.org/2022/10/27/1131880548/football-coach-prayers-reinstated) As a Bremerton resident (outside city limits though) I’m not surprised. But I do take comfort in the fact it’s a shitty job at a shitty school in a shitty town. Hopefully he’ll be fired again soon. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2022, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/195 "2022-10-28T15:41:38Z")
Yeah, that’s the problem I would have with it. The coach could have very easily just prayed in private and gave thanks that few players were injured/nobody was killed or seriously injured, and for the benefits of the players, etc… and it would have been _every_ bit as acceptable to God. Maybe even more so, because it would be more sincere. But this clown is out there on the 50 yard line grandstanding to show off his religiosity and by virtue of his position, his geographic position, and the temporal positioning, making it seem more official than it really was, or should have been. I imagine the question is going to come down to whether something the coach does like that is _always_ associated with his position as coach and employee of the school system. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2022, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/196 "2022-10-28T15:42:34Z")
BTW… I went to Bremerton this last July to see the USS Turner Joy and the Puget Sound Naval Museum. Nice place! I was very pleasantly surprised by the town. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2022, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/197 "2022-10-28T15:48:49Z")
> [@bump](#): > > I went to Bremerton this last July to see the USS Turner Joy and the Puget Sound Naval Museum. Nice place! I was very pleasantly surprised by the town. Yeah, I like it here. Especially in the summer. I probably shouldn’t have called it “shitty.” It is a backwater though. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2022, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/198 "2022-10-28T15:51:05Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > “By taking this important case, the Supreme Court can protect the right of every American to engage in private religious expression, including praying in public, without fear of punishment,” Shackelford said. Quiz: What is absurd about this statement? 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2022, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/199 "2022-10-28T15:57:00Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > > [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > > > “By taking this important case, the Supreme Court can protect the right of every American to engage in private religious expression, including praying in public, without fear of punishment,” Shackelford said. > > Quiz: What is absurd about this statement? 🙄 - Short answer: What’s _not_ absurd? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2022, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891/200 "2022-10-28T16:33:30Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > Quiz: What is absurd about this statement? 🙄 > [@](#): > > private religious expression is the opposite of > [@](#): > > praying in public [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-to-hear-case-of-praying-ex-football-coach-yet-another-religious-liberty-case/957891.md?page=11)