# SCOTUS Wife Virginia Thomas asks Anita Hill to apologize - WTF? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 20, 2010, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798 "2010-10-20T16:56:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 26
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2010, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/501 "2010-10-23T21:28:29Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > A woman scorned? > > Any other female co-workers that defended Anita Hill? > Ex-dataing partners don’t count. Pure speculation. The most logical conclusion is ,as she said, about doing the right thing for the country. She felt the pols should know what the guy they were pushing for Supreme Court was really like. He was a porn loving harasser . He maltreated the women he worked with. She was trying to do the right thing. She did not make a cent off her testimony. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2010, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/502 "2010-10-23T21:36:08Z")
[http://www.salon.com/news/politics/war\_room/2010/10/22/clarence\_thomas\_anita\_hill](http://www.salon.com/news/politics/war_room/2010/10/22/clarence_thomas_anita_hill) So when does Anita Hill get an apology from Thomas and the pols that called her a liar? She has corroboration. Thomas has nothing. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2010, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/503 "2010-10-23T22:49:25Z")
> [@gonzomax](#): > > [Will anyone apologize to Anita Hill now? - Salon.com](http://www.salon.com/news/politics/war_room/2010/10/22/clarence_thomas_anita_hill) So when does Anita Hill get an apology from Thomas and the pols that called her a liar? She has corroboration. Thomas has nothing. She has no corroboration and Thomas has numerous character witnesses . ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2010, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/504 "2010-10-23T23:08:10Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > This is precisely my point. Remove “his shitty pigggish behaviour” and the equation changes. So do you believe that Virginia Thomas comported herself well, or do you think she should have framed her statement with an implicit recognition that Thomas _might_ have behaved badly. Was it appropriate to leave a telephone message that _assumed_ the recipient was lying, or was it at least somewhat rude? Do you believe that Mrs. Thomas’ behavior was prudent? I’m not sure I know precisely what “Tone deaf” means here. Based on the olive branch characterization, I’m willing to say that Mrs. Thomas acted neither appropriately nor prudently. I tend to extend forgiveness however. It’s not like she robbed a bank. Anyway there are some distinctions here, which those of sharp legal intellect might be inclined to advance. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 23, 2010, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/505 "2010-10-23T23:56:17Z")
Oh, fine! So, the rest of us are just so much chopped liver! I see how it is… ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/506 "2010-10-24T00:27:33Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > A woman scorned? I have my doubts that someone crazy enough to commit perjury (before the Senate no less) out of spite could maintain a career as low-key and (by many accounts I’ve read) professional in the decades that follow. Now, if Hill had shown some erratic behaviour, I might be inclined to give your hypothesis some consideration. Until such time said behaviour is brought to my attention, I see no reason to. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/507 "2010-10-24T00:51:17Z")
I don’t get the need to pass along the incident to anyone authority wise. Shirley, she didn’t imagine she was under some threat? Or did she? “Shit, that rhinoceros size white bitch coming to kick my ass, and I quit the Tae-Bo after the third video!” This is all so Jerry Springer meets _Washington Week_. None of this should have happened, its not worthy of our attention. Even if we had absolute, rock solid proof that everything she said was true, it wouldn’t matter, we’re stuck with him. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/508 "2010-10-24T02:31:11Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > This is all so Jerry Springer meets _Washington Week_. None of this should have happened, its not worthy of our attention. Even if we had absolute, rock solid proof that everything she said was true, it wouldn’t matter, we’re stuck with him. It’s kind of creepy that somebody would perjure themselves in order to sit on the highest court of the land. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/509 "2010-10-24T02:41:00Z")
> [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](#): > > She has no corroboration and Thomas has numerous character witnesses . Yes she does, as has been pointed out. The new book will be lots of fun when it comes out. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/977dab/32.png) [@Captain\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/510 "2010-10-24T05:41:24Z")
> [@Captain\_Midnight](#): > > What is he doing with that ugly white woman? Clarence doesn’t like black ckicks? Nobody gave me love for my statement, so I will ask again, what is he doing with a white wife? Is he “too good” for a wife of his own race? Does this ever upset anyone in the black community, especially black women? ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/511 "2010-10-24T05:54:01Z")
> [@Captain\_Midnight](#): > > Nobody gave me love for my statement, so I will ask again, what is he doing with a white wife? Is he “too good” for a wife of his own race? Does this ever upset anyone in the black community, especially black women? Frankly, I’m just glad two twits found one another. I don’t see the relevance of their races. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/512 "2010-10-24T13:03:00Z")
> [@Captain\_Midnight](#): > > Nobody gave me love for my statement, so I will ask again, what is he doing with a white wife? Is he “too good” for a wife of his own race? Does this ever upset anyone in the black community, especially black women? You were most likely ignored because your statement is inherently racist. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/513 "2010-10-24T13:08:12Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > It’s kind of creepy that somebody would perjure themselves in order to sit on the highest court of the land. And yet \*every \*recent nominee claims, straightfacedly, to have no prejudged opinion on abortion, or any other political hot potato topic. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/514 "2010-10-24T13:11:41Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > This is precisely my point. Remove “his shitty pigggish behaviour” and the equation changes. Yes, it changes from reality to just another of your childish “hypothetical” gotchas. Helluva point to make in public. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/515 "2010-10-24T13:25:15Z")
> [@Captain\_Midnight](#): > > Nobody gave me love for my statement, so I will ask again, what is he doing with a white wife? Is he “too good” for a wife of his own race? Does this ever upset anyone in the black community, especially black women? It takes a special kind of mind to post a question like that. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/516 "2010-10-24T14:45:55Z")
Well, he probably had a special education. ---
**Author:** ![margin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/65b543/32.png) [@margin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/margin)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/517 "2010-10-24T23:21:18Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > It seems to me she’s only “tone deaf” if you begin the analysis by assuming Ms. Hill was telling the truth. > > Let’s not. Let assume, instead, that Ms. Hill completely fabricated her accusations, made them up out of whole cloth, in an effort to derail Thomas’ nomination, without caring what effect her lies might have on Thomas personally, or on Thomas’ family. > > And, having failed to prevent Thomas’ confirmation, she has for nearly 20 years refused to acknowledge that her testimony was fabricated. > > Why is it “tone deaf” for Mrs. Thomas to ask for an apology under those circumstances? This is revolting and disgusting even for a goal post shifter like you, Bricker. Christ on a pony. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 24, 2010, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/518 "2010-10-24T23:58:36Z")
Hypothetical. “Let’s assume”. He even offers both main hypothetical, though one gets about six words and the other fifty. But the trap door is built in, and he can look you right in the face, bat big brown innocent eyes, and say, correctly, hypothetical. Arguing with The Counselor is like trying to pick up an earthworm out of a vat of motor oil with chopsticks. ---
**Author:** ![margin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/65b543/32.png) [@margin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/margin)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2010, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/519 "2010-10-25T00:11:13Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Whether Hill told the truth, exaggerated or fabricated her testimony about Thomas is known only to Hill and Thomas. The rest of us must accept that her confirmation hearing testimony was held to be not credible. That being the case, how is a request for an apology or an explanation unwarranted? Her evidence—supported by several other women, witnesses, and Thomas’ own acquaintances—was held to be not credible by a bunch of white guys who leered at her, trotted out every sexist stereotype of women there was, and finally came down on the side of the man. Thomas is, despite what apologists on this thread say, a mediocrity whose most notable characteristic is his boundless rage and complete lack of compassion. What he did to his sister, for example, was striking—and horrifying. Finally, arguing the case out of context is ludicrous. The inquisitors at the hearings subjected Hill to extraordinary sexist tropes—‘a little bit nutty and a little bit slutty’ says more about them and their perceptions than it does about _her._ David Brock, one of her chief accusers, has since recanted when the lies he told wore him down. A book by a pair of Wall Street Journal reporters—not exactly a bastion of liberal feminism—found that it was likely that Hill’s allegations were true, especially as they were supported by other allegations and supporting testimony, again, from Thomas’ own friends. There’s no excuse, at this late date, to be as ignorant about this case as some people have displayed themselves to be. Hill’s written an excellent book on the case and maintained her silence since then. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2010, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798/520 "2010-10-25T00:35:25Z")
> [@margin](#): > > David Brock, one of her chief accusers, has since recanted when the lies he told wore him down. A book by a pair of Wall Street Journal reporters—not exactly a bastion of liberal feminism—found that it was likely that Hill’s allegations were true, especially as they were supported by other allegations and supporting testimony, again, from Thomas’ own friends. Right. But somehow I doubt whether Virginia Thomas has read any of those works. So from her perspective, it is plausible (and subjectively likely) that her husband is telling the truth. After all, spouses are lousy judges of their beloved’s character, though they believe otherwise. (I can’t find the cite, which involved lie detection and had a different focus.) Nonetheless, phone machine messages that assume lying recipients are rude and bad form when you are aware that the evidence is in fact mixed. Which Mrs. Thomas knows. AFAIK, **Bricker** did not address this possibility on pages 1-3 or 10-11 of this thread. > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > And yet \*every \*recent nominee claims, straightfacedly, to have no prejudged opinion on abortion, or any other political hot potato topic. Ok, but factual perjury is different than sworn disingenuous. It’s true that judges can’t predict how they will rule on abortion without reviewing the facts of the particular case, right? And should detailed facts be provided… well, I’m not going to debate hypotheticals, Senator. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798.md?page=25) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scotus-wife-virginia-thomas-asks-anita-hill-to-apologize-wtf/557798.md?page=27)