# Screamers Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [September 21, 2009, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938 "2009-09-21T13:16:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 139
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2009, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2761 "2009-11-18T19:16:53Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > What happens if there’s a tie for the leader vote? > [@Mahaloth](#): > > Whomever got to the top vote total first would be the leader. I knew that had been addressed early. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2009, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2762 "2009-11-18T19:27:20Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > So anyway, as I see it: lynch the hell out of Guiri tomorrow; if he flips Town then either > > (1) USCDiver is the last scum > > or > > (2) one of USC, AllWalker, or Normal is a Serial Killer and has nerves of steel; either having sussed out that OneAndOnly was scum (and there were indications: iffy choices of investigation targets, falling for Gryff’s trap earlier, proposing the blow-up-the-bomb scheme), or just taking the risk and hoping for a mislynch. One possible answer if it came to this is to force Diver to lynch Normal; obvious downside being that it hands AllWalker the win regardless of whether he’s Town, SK, or (unlikely) scum. ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2009, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2763 "2009-11-18T19:35:26Z")
> [@Normal\_Phase](#): > > Well obviously Scum couldn’t target OAOW. For a hypothetical SK NOT to target him, they’d have to have been pretty confident he represented no threat for that night. That should leave out me as a potential SK, because I could never have been sure of that given how OAOW was acting toward me the previous Day. The claimed vanillas (save Tom, who is confirmed by the Music Box) had nothing to fear (and would have known very well OAOW was lying, too boot); and a SK AllWalker may have taken that risk hoping a) Scum would take OAOW out, or b) he could get a mislynch the following Day based on OAOW’s survival. Which is what happened, although it wasn’t a mislynch. This doesn’t apply to me however, because \*\*OAOW \*\*didn’t ‘investigate’ me until last Night. If I were the SK, I wouldn’t have known she was lying about her investigations until Yesterday and would have certainly wanted her dead the Night before on the off chance she was indeed a role cop. That pretty much leaves \*\*Guiri, Allwalker \*\*and **Normal** , despite his attestations to the contrary. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2009, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2764 "2009-11-18T19:45:55Z")
> [@USCDiver](#): > > That pretty much leaves \*\*Guiri, Allwalker \*\*and **Normal** , despite his attestations to the contrary. I’d say all 3 of you (ETA Diver, AllWalker, and Normal) have equally strong alibis; only Drain’s is better (the Daphne investigation). ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2009, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2765 "2009-11-18T19:50:47Z")
Agreed. I can envision a three way game with me, AllWalker and Normal pretty soon. Any ideas on how we should approach that? ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2009, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2766 "2009-11-18T19:52:38Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > One possible answer if it came to this is to force Diver to lynch Normal; obvious downside being that it hands AllWalker the win regardless of whether he’s Town, SK, or (unlikely) scum. Incidentally, the mechanics of this option, if you choose to take it: Elect Normal as leader; Normal votes for Diver and AllWalker votes for Normal. If Diver does not vote for Normal, he dies to the tiebreaker; if Diver tries to sneak his vote on Normal in ahead of AllWalker’s, AllWalker can switch his vote to Diver. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2009, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2767 "2009-11-18T19:56:49Z")
(My reason for choosing Diver for the last-day explosion: Diver is more likely to be the last Screamer; AllWalker, less so. If you choose to go for AllWalker instead, the procedure would be similar). ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2009, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2768 "2009-11-18T20:02:06Z")
**If the end game came down to a Town Bomb and a Screamer or a Serial Killer, who would win?** **Also, who would win in a fight, Superman or Thor?** ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2009, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2769 "2009-11-18T20:08:04Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > So anyway, as I see it: lynch the hell out of Guiri tomorrow; if he flips Town then either… /snipped _ **When** _ I flip town. For those of you remaining tomorrow, please keep in mind that while **Tom** has been by far the most active and chatty player here, he’s been correct in about 10% of his scenarios, 20% in his votes, and has made numerous statements based on false logic (that **AllWalker** can’t be a bad guy because he misread his PM - that’s what **AllWalker** would want us to think if he’d lied to us about his role; that **OaOW** couldn’t be scum as scum would never claim role cop and so must be Town or the SK - well he flipped scum, didn’t he?). If I’m still around and you think I’m scummy, fine, but if it’s just based on these scenarios please skip the first step and vote for **USC** or, preferably **AllWalker**. I still think **Normal** and **Drain** are town and we’re all quite sure **Tom** is Town (although that intentional mod-defying edit could cost us another Townie). ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2009, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2770 "2009-11-18T20:11:48Z")
Dude, if the mods killed for edits, they would have killed you on day 1. ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [November 18, 2009, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2771 "2009-11-18T20:16:45Z")
This is by far the longest I’ve ever lasted in a Mafia game. It’s fascinating. ---
**Author:** ![Trepa\_Mayfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Trepa\_Mayfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trepa_Mayfield)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2009, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2772 "2009-11-19T01:10:45Z")
> [@Normal\_Phase](#): > > Tom, we can still win with two killers left if they double-kill or if there is a crosskill. The former case yields > > 3-1-1 in the morning, which is a win if no mislynches thereafter (but we need to get it right twice). (3-1, then 2-1, then 2-0). > > The latter case is > > 3-1 in the morning, which is a win if we get it right. > > I’m having trouble reconciling six Scum _and_ a SK (even with the Scum on different teams), so hopefully that’s not the case. > > **Pedescribe, what happens if the vote for leader is tied?** I’ve probably addressed the issue somewhere…if it comes up I’ll search for it. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > **If the end game came down to a Town Bomb and a Screamer or a Serial Killer, who would win?** > > **Also, who would win in a fight, Superman or Thor?** a) Alka Seltzer b) I’d put my money on Thor. I know Superman is ridiculously powerful and all, but Thor is a _god_, so I figure he could probably miracle up some sort of red light source mid-fight. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2009, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2773 "2009-11-19T02:39:59Z")
> [@Normal\_Phase](#): > > **Pedescribe, what happens if the vote for leader is tied?** Again, whomever had the lead first is leader. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2009, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2774 "2009-11-19T03:54:20Z")
Plus, Superman is vulnerable to magic (well, as vulnerable as a normal Earthling), and Thor’s powers count as magical. As does nightly haunting by ghosts, of course. Wait, is there such a thing as a robot ghost? ---
**Author:** ![AllWalker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/db5fbb/32.png) [@AllWalker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AllWalker)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2009, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2775 "2009-11-19T05:24:14Z")
Damn, that is good. I mean, I was expecting a SK, but I’ll take a Screamer. In other news I am still confused, partly because a) I haven’t been updating my notes and b) I don’t have my notes with me. This game has been nothing short of epic, and a lot of fun, but it has strained my noggin more than once. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2009, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2776 "2009-11-19T13:28:32Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Wait, is there such a thing as a robot ghost? Only if they dream of electric sheep. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2009, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2777 "2009-11-19T14:36:55Z")
> [@USCDiver](#): > > Agreed. I can envision a three way game with me, AllWalker and Normal pretty soon. Any ideas on how we should approach that? Right. Having noodled about it, I think the right approach would be to elect Normal as Leader, and let her choose which of the other two she’s going to take with her. If she’s Town, I think she’s been sensible enough about weighing evidence et cetera to be trusted with the choice; if she’s scum or SK, then it doesn’t matter. If the designated bomb target doesn’t cooperate, then you just lynch him. Not perfect, but probably the best we can do if it gets down to it. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2009, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2778 "2009-11-19T15:32:06Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Wait, is there such a thing as a robot ghost? If there were, it would be documented in Hitherby Dragons. But the best I could find were [teenagers controlling giant robots named Death, Pestilence, and Famine](http://imago.hitherby.com/?p=87) ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2009, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2779 "2009-11-19T17:27:05Z")
Got a few things straight, sorry for earlier mistakes: Tom: Confirmed town by Oredigger, vanilla. Drain Bead: NOT a serial killer (Daphne’s “vanilla” investigation result.) Not Scum in any 2-team scenario that makes sense to me. Six Scum on one team unlikely in itself, but also not my top suspect in that case. Can only be Goon, if Scum. Diver: OAOW a threat to him last Night unless Diver is Scum with OAOW. If SK, has strong nerves. If Scum, could be practically any role. Guiri: OAOW not a threat in any scenario. Strongest candidate to be SK or remaining Scum. If Scum, could be practically any role. AllWalker: OAOW a threat unless AllWalker is Scum with OAOW. If SK, has strong nerves. One-shot (at least) survival confirmed. Normal Phase: OAOW a threat unless NP is Scum with OAOW. If SK, is completely roaring reckless. If Scum, could be practically any role. Tom’s two-scum-team scenario is looking far-fetched, IMO. Here’s the breakdown: Team 1: Cat, Chronos, tilt (investigator, roleblocker, hider) Team 2: Jimmy, OAOW, ? (investigator, priest, ?) I’m having trouble coming up with any role at all that, when paired with the negative of a priest, could match up with the strength of role-blocker plus hider. Redirector is the only thing even halfway close, and there’s been no evidence of such a role in the game, Gryff’s item excepted. This option is pretty much impossible, IMO. The other possibilities with Cat and Chronos on the same team both have OAOW on one team and the remaining Scum on the other team. Another option: Team 1: Cat, Chronos, ? Team 2: Jimmy, OAOW, tilt. This is horrible balance again, despite that OAOW pushing my death the Day before yesterday is somewhat suggestive that OAOW and tilt were Scum together. (Scum motive: Try for anyone-but-AllWalker, fall back to tilt if necessary.) However, he never did vote for Tilt, IIRC. If this is nevertheless the case, then Diver, AllWalker and I were in the same positions we would have been if serial killers. Guiri or Drain would be sitting pretty due to Jimmy’s death Night One. They’d be positive they were in no danger, and would have motive to kill OAOW only if they decided they were better off with one kill rather than two. Not likely with so many better targets than them around. I think the balance issue makes this option unlikely. Last option: Team 1: Cat, Chronos, OAOW Team 2: Jimmy, tilt, ? This one balances best by far; any reasonable Scum power would fit, maybe even Goon. “Nerves of steel/completely insane” again applies to Diver, AllWalker and me in this case. Drain would be sitting pretty, but her late move to AllWalker a couple of days ago speaks well for her. (As does my own promotion of an AllWalker lynch.) Guiri’s a bit more complicated – he had to consider OAOW a danger if he thought OAOW was Scum at all (consider Cat actually fingering Guiri in that last “I’m totally a Town investigator” post of his). But considering all OAOW would have had to do to cement himself as Town at that point would be to claim to be able to detect Screamers and finger Guiri as one of them, it’s likely a Scum Guiri in this setup would conclude OAOW actually was not a threat. As for the previous Day, Guiri started out voting for tilt and never moved that vote, though he did put himself on the hook to do it if necessary. Wouldn’t be the first time Town inadvertently got Scum out an awkward situation, though. Diver was strongly against the AllWalker lynch, preferring Guiri instead; it’s unlikely a Scum Hider would choose to hide behind their teammate. Summary of my conclusions in the case of two Scum teams performing the kills: Guiri = Diver \>\> AllWalker ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2009, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/2780 "2009-11-19T17:39:16Z")
Any combo featuring Jimmy and OaOW also has to contend with the question of when OaOW got the investigation results. I suppose Jimmy could have investigated on Night 0. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938.md?page=138) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938.md?page=140)