# Screamers Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [September 21, 2009, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938 "2009-09-21T13:16:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 14
**Author:** ![Trepa\_Mayfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Trepa\_Mayfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trepa_Mayfield)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/261 "2009-09-25T16:27:03Z")
And, as of right now, Allwalker is the leader for Day 1. Huzzah! ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/262 "2009-09-25T16:27:54Z")
> [@pedescribe](#): > > Boozahol(2): Peeker, Chronos > > Tom Scud(9): Freudian Slit, Drain Bead, Alkaseltzer, tiltawhirl, DaphneBlack, USCDiver, allwalker, Tom Scud, Coca-Cola (Nanook) > > AllWalker(11): Tom Scud, CatInSuit, Normalphase, Jimmy, Boozahol, AllWalker, TF, coldphoneix, Gryff, OaOW, Oredigger77 > The voting for leader ends Friday at 12:22 PM Eastern **This post is slightly inaccurate. Neither AllWalker nor myself voted for ourselves, but TexCat voted for AllWalker and amrussell voted for me.** ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/263 "2009-09-25T16:29:17Z")
> [@pedescribe](#): > > 1. jpei > 2. BillMC Preliminary inactivity check. The above 2 did not vote on leadership, according to the most recent vote check (by Pedescribe in #254, which I don’t think was entirely accurate). jpei has one post since check-in, speculating (wildly by his/her own admission) about a possible exposure of people voting in the leadership election to some kind of attack; BillMC doesn’t seem to have posted since his check-in post. No accusations implied, but with 24 people I want to keep some kind of tabs on who has/hasn’t been participating. Oh, and congratulations to **AllWalker** and thanks to everyone who voted for me and for all the kind words. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/264 "2009-09-25T16:41:54Z")
yaknow, i’ve decided to be a cantankerous old fuck. i think we all agree that a leader could potentially have some ramifications, primarily negative. so we want to put a confirmed town in that role. mitigates badness. not sure. if it’s confirmed townie then any bad decision is oh heck. if non confirmed then justify it? just saying it would be enlightening to put a fence sitter on the pole and see which way they fall, is all. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/265 "2009-09-25T17:00:29Z")
Now that we’ve got our leader let’s have a little more discussion or possibly a vote on when we want the Day to end. Like I’ve said before I think it needs to be on Thursday or Friday. But I think we need to come to some consensus. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/266 "2009-09-25T17:00:30Z")
> [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](#): > > My thoughts around me claiming > > In general part claims are bad, viewed as the claimee hedging until they have thought up their cover. The difference here is that I have been part claimed by _the game mechanics_ I am known to be non vanilla by all and sundry. I (being in full possession of the facts of my role) am trying to decide what is best to do here. Input from all you guys is great to help me come to a decision. magic bags are generally very bad. but kind of like ltl and lal they are all case specific. so do what you think best. ---
**Author:** ![jpei](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a3d4f5/32.png) [@jpei](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jpei)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/267 "2009-09-25T17:01:42Z")
I know neither Tom Scud nor AllWalker, so I opted not to vote. There’s still something “evilish” about these roles, and, roleplaying here, voting for a Leader implies an element of trust which I do not agree with. A character’s role which would not fit in as a possible leader could be a Convict (Vigilante), child (Watcher or other investigative role), or Social Outcast (?). I don’t think roleclaiming here would be of particular use. And I would prefer a Tuesday vote to a Thursday vote, FWIW. On preview: or Friday, just not a Thursday. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/268 "2009-09-25T17:02:43Z")
[QUOTE=peekercpa] just saying it would be enlightening to put a fence sitter on the pole and see which way they fall, is all. [/QUOTE] It’s an interesting point, **peeker.** In practice, I wonder whether the Leader’s choice is going to end up being that telling, though. The primary features of the leader’s vote are that 1. it starts the countdown and 2. it’s set in stone. The question would be whether a difficult-to-read player’s vote is going to be especially telling given those features. I’m thinking maybe not - a slippery player, if they’re hiding something, is going to probably just join a bandwagon and vote right on schedule, right? And if they aren’t hiding anything, then they’re probably just not playing an especially pro-town game, in which case maybe we don’t want them at the wheel. It might end up being the case that the Leader is one player each Day who we don’t get any meaningful data from. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/269 "2009-09-25T17:03:04Z")
Thurs or Friday is fine with me. Sometime late afternoon would be better, I think. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/270 "2009-09-25T17:04:27Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > **This post is slightly inaccurate. Neither AllWalker nor myself voted for ourselves, but TexCat voted for AllWalker and amrussell voted for me.** Ah, I see. Anyway, looks like **AllWalker is the leader for day One, which begins now.** Begin! ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/271 "2009-09-25T17:07:01Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > Another thing not mentioned yet that maybe should be obvious: as I understand it, the rule of thumb for Mafia games is that scum should be (# of players)/4 or sqrt(# of players), which would work out to 6 and 5, respectively. Which gives us 6 or 7 mislynches, all else being equal, which of course it won’t be. But just as a baseline assumption until we get better information. so no third parties in your world, apparently. yikes. does someone know something they shouldn’t or is there obfuscation or is it just whoops? ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/272 "2009-09-25T17:12:43Z")
> [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > It’s an interesting point, **peeker.** In practice, I wonder whether the Leader’s choice is going to end up being that telling, though. The primary features of the leader’s vote are that 1. it starts the countdown and 2. it’s set in stone. The question would be whether a difficult-to-read player’s vote is going to be especially telling given those features. > > I’m thinking maybe not - a slippery player, if they’re hiding something, is going to probably just join a bandwagon and vote right on schedule, right? And if they aren’t hiding anything, then they’re probably just not playing an especially pro-town game, in which case maybe we don’t want them at the wheel. > > It might end up being the case that the Leader is one player each Day who we don’t get any meaningful data from. and i agree **hoosier**. i was just trying to make the point that placing folks in higher visibility situations can lead to some certainly interesting observations. ---
**Author:** ![DaphneBlack](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/daphneblack/32/5389_2.png) [@DaphneBlack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DaphneBlack)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/273 "2009-09-25T17:30:16Z")
I think it’s inevitable that the Leader is going to be highly scrutinised. So later on (though of course not at potential LyLo), if there’s a player who’s pinging radars but there’s not hard evidence, it might be worth taking a chance on them for Leader, to see what happens. But I say again, I think it would be very unlikely for someone to take a bold pro-scum move whilst leader, simply because we’ll all be watching! ---
**Author:** ![Thing\_Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@Thing\_Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing_Fish)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/274 "2009-09-25T17:30:23Z")
I agree that One and Only should not claim; we know all we need to about him for now. If he isn’t scum (or PFK), then he is the likeliest scum target for tonight, and thus the logical target for Doctor protection Tonight. If he dies, that sucks, but at least it gives us the information that we probably don’t have a Doc. Or if we do have a Doc, we could potentially not have a Scum kill Tonight, which would be great. With regard to the timing of the Leader’s vote, I think that \*\*AllWalker \*\*should review the various arguments that have been made, weigh them against his own judgment, and announce his decision soon. Otherwise I could see this discussion going on and on and not helping us catch scum. ---
**Author:** ![Thing\_Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@Thing\_Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing_Fish)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/275 "2009-09-25T17:33:21Z")
NETA: The third possibility, of course, is that the scum could target somebody else, either in order to avoid the risk of having their kill blocked or because they don’t want to kill **OAOW**. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/276 "2009-09-25T17:38:00Z")
Well, we don’t have to wait for **AllWalker** to go about our scum-finding business. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/277 "2009-09-25T17:42:08Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > Another thing not mentioned yet that maybe should be obvious: as I understand it, the rule of thumb for Mafia games is that scum should be (# of players)/4 or sqrt(# of players), which would work out to 6 and 5, respectively. Which gives us 6 or 7 mislynches, all else being equal, which of course it won’t be. But just as a baseline assumption until we get better information. > [@peekercpa](#): > > so no third parties in your world, apparently. > > yikes. > > does someone know something they shouldn’t or is there obfuscation or is it just whoops? That’s why I said “all else being equal, which of course it won’t be.” We don’t KNOW that there are third parties, although the mods have been very coy about kinda-sorta not answering our queries about that. ---
**Author:** ![Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d9b06d/32.png) [@Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boozahol_Squid_P.I)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/278 "2009-09-25T17:43:55Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > and i agree **hoosier**. > > i was just trying to make the point that placing folks in higher visibility situations can lead to some certainly interesting observations. The problem with your line of thinking is that you assume that well-intentioned townies won’t make horrendous, anti-town moves, and scum that try to do so will out themselves. Experience has shown me that neither of these things are reliable. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/279 "2009-09-25T18:07:51Z")
> [@Oredigger77](#): > > I think the Day should end as close to the weekend as possible our discussion is more important for finding scum then the use of Town powers. If we are really worried about powers being forgotten maybe we should end the Day on Thursday as opposed to Friday but I think that losing two days of conversation every Day will end up hurting the town. I see nothing wrong with a Tuesday countdown leading into a Wednesday end-of-day as a basic rule … that’s still rather a lot of time for discussion. And from that spot, both lengthening and shortening the day can be reasonable options. That’s not the case if you move the default day earlier or later in the week. > [@jpei](#): > > I know neither Tom Scud nor AllWalker, so I opted not to vote. There’s still something “evilish” about these roles, and, roleplaying here, voting for a Leader implies an element of trust which I do not agree with. Really? I find this very questionable. We’ve been described as having a few “evilish” roles, not that they all are; and there’s been no hint that there’s anything bizarre about the leadership position. Is there some other reason you don’t want your vote on record along with everyone else’s? > [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > It’s an interesting point, **peeker.** In practice, I wonder whether the Leader’s choice is going to end up being that telling, though. The primary features of the leader’s vote are that 1. it starts the countdown and 2. it’s set in stone. The question would be whether a difficult-to-read player’s vote is going to be especially telling given those features. > > I’m thinking maybe not - a slippery player, if they’re hiding something, is going to probably just join a bandwagon and vote right on schedule, right? And if they aren’t hiding anything, then they’re probably just not playing an especially pro-town game, in which case maybe we don’t want them at the wheel. > > It might end up being the case that the Leader is one player each Day who we don’t get any meaningful data from. That’s what I think; another reason the position should go to a trusted player should we ever have one; and to a player whose normal style fits decently with what the leader has to do in any case, in the meantime. > [@peekercpa](#): > > so no third parties in your world, apparently. > > yikes. > > does someone know something they shouldn’t or is there obfuscation or is it just whoops? Can’t imagine how someone could know for sure there are no 3rd party players, so if this wasn’t just **Tom** being **Tom** , the only realistic non-Town motivation would be that he is one (a third party player), and was trying just a little too hard not to betray that he was more than aware of the possibility. On the face of it, it doesn’t seem like him. ---
**Author:** ![Trepa\_Mayfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Trepa\_Mayfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trepa_Mayfield)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2009, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/280 "2009-09-25T19:17:14Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > and i agree **hoosier**. > > i was just trying to make the point that placing folks in higher visibility situations can lead to some certainly interesting observations. Why is Jimmy Chitwood hooiser? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938.md?page=13) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938.md?page=15)