# Screamers Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [September 21, 2009, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938 "2009-09-21T13:16:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2009, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/321 "2009-09-26T19:16:06Z")
[quote=“Alka\_Seltzer, post:315, topic:510938”] I’m a little suspicious of Normal Phase right now. He brought up the PFK Jester idea, which struck me as possible scum blowing smoke. He also hasn’t explained this, which Jimmy brought up in #164: > [@](#): > > **@Normal Phase** - what you say makes sense, but where did you get the idea from? I can’t see that anyone said that before you in the thread, so I’m considering the possibility that you slipped up and posted an idea you read on the scum board. **Normal Phase** did respond at [171](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11592346&postcount=171), indicating that he or she was talking about this in post 150 from **Boozahol** : > [@](#): > > And just to weigh in once more on the Governor issue, any player who becomes confirmed via cop or masonry or whatever should really be given strong consideration as governor in the future, regardless of time zone or experience: the governor’s going to lack the same sort of voting record that we can expect of every other player, just because their vote does cause the countdown. Which is an answer, and I was comfortable to leave it at that for the moment. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2009, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/322 "2009-09-26T19:34:28Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > The reason I’m not voting for him, though, is that I have another candidate in mind. I’m always strongly opposed to soft-claims, since Scum doesn’t need to know what powers someone has, they just need to know who has them. Saying that you’re special but not saying how doesn’t help Town, but does help Scum. For that reason, I’ll > **Vote One and Only Wanderers** Bleached. I disagree with the reasoning here, because there were so many posts telling **One and Only** not to claim. At least some of those posts were by town members. I don’t think it’s fair to go after **One and Only** on the grounds of a soft claim when the claim was made by the moderator, and when **One and Only** solicited the rest of our opinions about how to handle the situation. Why not just tell him to claim if you want him to claim? ---
**Author:** ![Alka\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@Alka\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alka_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2009, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/323 "2009-09-26T19:47:51Z")
Apologies Normal Phase, I missed post #171. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2009, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/324 "2009-09-26T19:59:14Z")
Alka Seltzer (1): Boozy Squid jpei (3): Normal Phase, OaOW, Fruedian Tom Scud(1): peeker One and Only(1): Chronos ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2009, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/325 "2009-09-26T20:44:47Z")
> [@](#): > > Why not just tell him to claim if you want him to claim? Because I wanted to be emphatic about it, and because I believe soft-claiming is significantly anti-Town, even if others apparently disagree here. If **Wanderers** finishes his claim and it’s plausible or confirmable, I’ll move my vote. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2009, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/326 "2009-09-26T21:00:48Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > So just to be clear, you first suspected me because my post implied that there were no third parties. > > Now you suspect me because THE SAME POST implies that I’m certain there ARE third parties. > > Day 1, grasping at straws, yadda yadda but that’s pretty weak. bzzzzttt. wrong. obviously subtlety is lost. the whole point of my first post is that someone who is third party would like to intimate that there are no third parties. and who would know for a fact about the presence of third parties. well a third party of course. you then follow it up with a have it both ways type of post which strongly leans to knowledge regarding the presence of third parties. so you either know something (which in and of itself is just that) or you want to be able to say opposites and dance (which is troubling). ---
**Author:** ![DaphneBlack](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/daphneblack/32/5389_2.png) [@DaphneBlack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DaphneBlack)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/327 "2009-09-27T00:32:44Z")
**Chronos** , I appreciate your desire to take a strong stance against soft-claiming. Would you feel the same way if you had seen the OaOW had been ineligible in the first post of the day, ie opening colour? As for **jpei** , I’m not happy with his choice not to vote, but not ready to vote to lynch him yet. I think if his problem is caution, that’s understandable, but I think town in these games has lately been playing too cautiously. And getting too bogged down about the set-up. On day one of a closed game I find a lot of the speculation (such as about a miller, or about the third-party situation) seems like it is very useful but could also be a great way for scum to participate with a way to have an out ie that they were just speculating. Very wishy-washy of me, I know… ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/328 "2009-09-27T02:32:10Z")
> [@](#): > > Chronos, I appreciate your desire to take a strong stance against soft-claiming. Would you feel the same way if you had seen the OaOW had been ineligible in the first post of the day, ie opening colour? Obviously this case is a little different, in that **Wanderers** didn’t have any choice in us finding out that there’s something special about him. But he did have a choice whether to tell us what that something was. That’s what I’m holding him accountable for. > [@](#): > > And getting too bogged down about the set-up. On day one of a closed game I find a lot of the speculation (such as about a miller, or about the third-party situation) seems like it is very useful but could also be a great way for scum to participate with a way to have an out ie that they were just speculating. Very wishy-washy of me, I know… The thing is, on the first Day, everyone, Scum and Town alike, are trying to find a topic of conversation to get things started, and speculating about the possible roles is as good a topic as any. We need discussion to have any hope of finding Scum, and the game starts without much that can be discussed. What else is there? ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/329 "2009-09-27T02:42:33Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > The reason I’m not voting for him, though, is that I have another candidate in mind. I’m always strongly opposed to soft-claims, since Scum doesn’t need to know what powers someone has, they just need to know who has them. Saying that you’re special but not saying how doesn’t help Town, but does help Scum. For that reason, I’ll > **Vote One and Only Wanderers** But role claiming right away is also a dangerous thing. I think One and Only did the best he could–he was sort of kind of outed but didn’t want to go into details. I think he did the smart thing. Do you want him to role claim? That might make him a sitting duck for scum. ---
**Author:** ![Thing\_Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@Thing\_Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing_Fish)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/330 "2009-09-27T04:00:03Z")
I agree that what **One and Only** has done shouldn’t really be considered a soft claim. It is not out of the question that his role could be more useful to Town if its details are not fully publicized. ---
**Author:** ![AllWalker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/db5fbb/32.png) [@AllWalker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AllWalker)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/331 "2009-09-27T04:35:11Z")
First, to business: Based on what everyone has said so far, I will **cast my vote** and thus begin the 24 hour countdown **Thursday 1st Oct, 10 am EST** for a Day end Friday 2nd. That seems to suit most, though not all people. **Chronos** , I really have to disagree with your vote. **OaOW** was forced into soft claiming by the colour, and then didn’t fully claim because the Town advised him not to. Assuming he is telling the truth, his only options were ignore the questions, soft claim, or lie. I know which of those is the least anti-Town. **peeker** , every game someone points out the balance rule - assuming no 3rd parties, Scum are usually about 1/4 of the players. This balance assumes no 3rd parties and minimal power roles on both sides, which is how I interpret the “all things being equal” line. It’s the sort of thing that shows up every Mafia game - why is it worthy of a vote? ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 12:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/332 "2009-09-27T12:04:35Z")
> [@AllWalker](#): > > **Chronos** , I really have to disagree with your vote. **OaOW** was forced into soft claiming by the colour, and then didn’t fully claim because the Town advised him not to. Assuming he is telling the truth, his only options were ignore the questions, soft claim, or lie. I know which of those is the least anti-Town. Was **OaOW** forced into claiming, though? I mean, we knew he couldn’t be leader, but we didn’t know _why_ until he told us it was role-based and not power-based. In fact, up until the soft-claim, I was assuming he had been blocked by someone else. Now, maybe it was a good idea to clear up that misconception, or maybe it was a bit of early panic on **OaOW** ’s part, or maybe **OaOW** is scum who is spreading discord and confusion. Perhaps it was a mistake on our part to direct questions to **OaOW** and not the mods, but we really don’t know if soft-claiming was something that **OaOW** truly needed to do _at the moment that he did it_. I don’t think he was drawing suspicion, and while some of us may have misconstrued what was going on, I’m not sure if clearing that up was something that needed to happen right then. I agree with you that he needed to claim eventually, but it did seem a bit premature. ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/333 "2009-09-27T12:46:45Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > Was **OaOW** forced into claiming, though? I mean, we knew he couldn’t be leader, but we didn’t know _why_ until he told us it was role-based and not power-based. In fact, up until the soft-claim, I was assuming he had been blocked by someone else. Now, maybe it was a good idea to clear up that misconception, or maybe it was a bit of early panic on **OaOW** ’s part, or maybe **OaOW** is scum who is spreading discord and confusion. > > Perhaps it was a mistake on our part to direct questions to **OaOW** and not the mods, but we really don’t know if soft-claiming was something that **OaOW** truly needed to do _at the moment that he did it_. I don’t think he was drawing suspicion, and while some of us may have misconstrued what was going on, I’m not sure if clearing that up was something that needed to happen right then. I agree with you that he needed to claim eventually, but it did seem a bit premature. Don’t fprget though, I will also be ineligible tomorrow, and the say after etc etc. It made more sense to me to admit this now. ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/334 "2009-09-27T12:51:37Z")
I disagree; I see what he did as the very opposite of spreading discord and confusion. We were in the process of going down a bunch of blind alleys with regards to what happened, and he put a stop to it. I see that as a good thing. I’m not against speculation, but when it’s based on a false premise, it only amounts to so much noise. ---
**Author:** ![AllWalker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/db5fbb/32.png) [@AllWalker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AllWalker)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/335 "2009-09-27T13:18:15Z")
Exactly. Town was confused, but we would have found out toMorrow when the same thing happened. Soft claiming helped clear it up. This is a perfect example of something that is usually antiTown being okay in certain cases. Knowing there isn’t a power that can block candidates is useful. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/336 "2009-09-27T13:21:46Z")
[quote=“AllWalker, post:331, topic:510938”] **Chronos** , I really have to disagree with your vote. **OaOW** was forced into soft claiming by the colour, and then didn’t fully claim because the Town advised him not to. Assuming he is telling the truth, his only options were ignore the questions, soft claim, or lie. I know which of those is the least anti-Town.QUOTE] \ agreed. it might have been better if he would have just left it without the dangling participle of there being more but, meh, semantics. and now that he has said that this stays with him for the duration we can see what the future brings. regarding my vote. i believe that there was an inherrant inconsistency in his post. it got worse on his follow up. now i guess this could mean a couple of things. one, he messed up or mis spoke. his response has led me to believe that it wasn’t a typo and was intentional. second he wants to say something without meaning anything. there could be others, i guess, but those pop up first and neither is pro town. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/337 "2009-09-27T13:39:28Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Obviously this case is a little different, in that **Wanderers** didn’t have any choice in us finding out that there’s something special about him. But he did have a choice whether to tell us what that something was. That’s what I’m holding him accountable for. \ agree, agree and strogly disagree. he didn’t have a choice. he does have a choice to elaborate or not. choosing not to do so and getting voted infers that his decision is anti town or wrong, in your opinion. since i have no fracking clue what he may or may not be able to do i have no way in determining, at this time, whether that was the right decision or not. magic bags are universally frowned upon but when the mod basically drops it in your lap, what you gonna do? i mean, because of the odd voting mechanism in this game maybe his role has something to do with vote manipulation or maybe he’s a one shot or crap, he could be in charge of passing out the evening meds or tending bar for all we know. so while i agree with your observations i don’t arrive at the same conclusion. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/338 "2009-09-27T13:40:57Z")
and a quick question from an old guy. how do you do multiple quotes on this board? it took me about a year and half to figure it out on **idle** ’s board but i have no clue here. ---
**Author:** ![AllWalker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/db5fbb/32.png) [@AllWalker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AllWalker)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/339 "2009-09-27T15:26:27Z")
Next to the quote button is a "+ button. Click the relevant posts then click Post Reply - it brings up all the requested posts. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2009, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/340 "2009-09-27T15:31:00Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > and a quick question from an old guy. > > how do you do multiple quotes on this board? it took me about a year and half to figure it out on **idle** ’s board but i have no clue here. > [@AllWalker](#): > > Next to the quote button is a "+ button. Click the relevant posts then click Post Reply - it brings up all the requested posts. test ok, thanks. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938.md?page=18)