# Screamers Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [September 21, 2009, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938 "2009-09-21T13:16:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 27
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/521 "2009-09-30T14:21:30Z")
I think it’s really weird that Peeker claimed when he wasn’t in the vote lead especially when the Day is going to end in 3 days but there is no way we can risk lynching a Doc on Day 1. **Unvote Peeker** I don’t have a good place to transfer my vote to so I’ll be back later to try and figure out where I want to vote now. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/522 "2009-09-30T14:28:16Z")
> [@Gryff](#): > > What does INC mean? Ah, also. I guess being from the Old Country you might not have the same school grading conventions as we do here in the colonies. INC means “Incomplete”. What I meant by “Incomplete” I already explained. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/523 "2009-09-30T14:51:16Z")
I didn’t even see there was a page 11 when I made that last post so let me respond to the case. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > Could be town expressing opinion - could be scum trying to keep Town from getting any information if they’re lucky enough to take down the Cop before the Cop has claimed. You’re right here it could be either one and it’s just how I feel. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > Could be town or scum trying to get more info. Again it is just how I feel I don’t like soft claims and now we’ve managed to have two power roles exposed, in theory, but still have no idea on the game mechanics. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > Middle paragraph is a “me too” in response to amrussell’s finding of the apparent contradiction by Drain Bead, which Jimmy went into in detail somewhere in the last 50 posts. I’m getting a funny vibe from that last paragraph. Yes, there are more claims than a lie detector could fully check, but what if the detector decides that you in particular are questionable? First of all I don’t believe there is a lie detector I think it’s an idea that has gotten too much air time in this game. The only reason I even bothered with the I am town statement was it is sure to be used later in the game against people and I see no reason to hand out extra ammo for free. Heck, even if there is a lie detector wouldn’t they be better served looking at the two power roles we’ve had claim I think people naturally make definitive statements during the Day that are worth checking out without needing to insure that everyone has a back up just in case the probably nonexistent lie detector gets curious. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > Mixing it up with Drain Bead, poking some holes in some pretty weak arguments. At this point the DB wagon was just getting rolling, with 3 on board. I had some questions about what Drain was saying so I figured I’d get the situation clarified before I voted. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > More mixing it up with DB; again I think mainly Digger has the better of it here. Wagon still at 3. At this point I was thinking that she was scum and I was probably going to vote for her but she explained her ’inconsistency’ in her first statement. So now there was only one reason to vote for her and I figured that I dig in a bit further. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > starts wondering if the wagon (now at 5) he’s been helping push is picking up too many scum. At this point she has already explained away half of the case against her but is still picking up votes, how is that not strange to anyone else. Ya, I was still asking questions but really when half the case disappears the number of votes should at least slow down. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > Kind of whiny about being left off of BD’s list. Having tried it myself, I’m not surprised she missed a few. I don’t like list of potential scum especially when I’m wrongly put into the scum category but yes I was being a whinny bitch. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > More whineage. Still basically focusing on BD. See above. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > After spending a full day sparring with BD, he thinks the BD wagon is all about peeker’s scummy friends. Oh, and again with the scumfight idea. It bothered me that a case that I saw a falling apart, half of it becoming invalid and I bought the tone of Drain’s claim of vanilla town, was picking up people. As I saw the best they had her for was an inconsistency in saying that Chronos was fishing when really she thought he was leading either the scum to third parties or town power roles away from scum, which is weird but I don’t think vote worthy. > [@Tom\_Scud](#): > > So Digger’s posts are consistent with him being a townie picking at inconsistencies in BD’s story but ultimately deciding that BD is town, her wagon is a bit suspicious, and that he was more worried by peeker’s odd case against me and sudden silence. By the way I enjoy trimming quotes so it looks like you agree with me but this really does sum up what happened. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/524 "2009-09-30T15:24:04Z")
jpeg (2): OAoW, TxtKitty Mot Scud(1): peekra The One and Only(1): Da’Chronic Pecear(3): Gruff, Nook, Oredigger, Brainbleed The Dread Bean (4): amrussett, Abnormal Phase, Freudian Skit, UPSDriver Borerigger(2): Boozy, Scuddy Please, check for accuracy. ---
**Author:** ![Alka\_Seltzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c89c15/32.png) [@Alka\_Seltzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alka_Seltzer)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/525 "2009-09-30T15:28:51Z")
Catching up a bit here: > [@Thing\_Fish](#): > > I have never seen a game where the voting was this extremely bandwagony. Of the last nine votes cast, the first four were for **peeker** and then the next five were all for **Drain Bead.** I have no idea what this means, but I think it may mean something; the most obvious possibility would be some sort of organized effort to save **peeker.** > > …However, I think the case against **Drain Bead** also seems reasonable, so I’ll want to go back over that and possibly reconsider. I find this a bit suspicious, Thing Fish says the case against Drain Bead has merit but seems to be expecting her to flip town. Could be scum trying to set-up the next mislynch. From my perspective, I don’t find the voting pattern suspicious. I found myself agreeing with a lot of the points Normal Phase made back in #392. I didn’t find any of the early cases very compelling either, so it’s not that suprising some votes came in a bunch when something a bit better came along. Normally my suspicions would be a lot more focused at this stage, so I’m wondering if we have a cautious scum team. > [@Oredigger77](#): > > But everyone jumping onto your train looks like scum trying to save Peeker. Similar to Thing Fish, pushing the idea that scum are trying to save Peeker. **@Tom Scud** - Why are you looking at the Peeker bandwagon in particular? Do you believe Peeker’s claim? ---
**Author:** ![Normal\_Phase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Normal\_Phase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Normal_Phase)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/526 "2009-09-30T16:10:48Z")
I don’t know **Alka Seltzer** , I went back and checked just now and **peeker** had four votes to **jpei** ’s three when the first vote on **Drain Bead** came in – it is possible that was a motivation behind some of the votes, _if_ **peeker** is Scum and **Drain Bead** not. I’m not moving my vote, though. ---
**Author:** ![Trepa\_Mayfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Trepa\_Mayfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trepa_Mayfield)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/527 "2009-09-30T16:14:24Z")
Attention, all! GuiriEnEspana is subbing in for Nanook! Give him all a warm welcome. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/528 "2009-09-30T16:39:03Z")
Quoth **Alka Seltzer** : > [@](#): > > I find this a bit suspicious, Thing Fish says the case against Drain Bead has merit but seems to be expecting her to flip town. Even if that is what **Thing Fish** is saying, it’s not necessarily unreasonable. Until we get more information, any given player is more likely to be Town than Scum, just by virtue of sheer numbers. On Day 1, you’re not looking for someone who’s probably (that is, more than 50% likely) Scum; you pretty much have to settle for whomever you think has the highest probability of being Scum, which will typically still be under 50%. ---
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/529 "2009-09-30T16:41:28Z")
> [@pedescribe](#): > > Attention, all! > > GuiriEnEspana is subbing in for Nanook! Give him all a warm welcome. Thanks for the introduction and thanks everyone for having me! I hope my low post count doesn’t go against me tonight 😉 FTR I am town aligned - can’t stand the countryside - too much scum 😉 I had been following the game from day 1 (or is it still day 1?) but as a player I’ll need to re-read with a little more attention. BRB. (Too much humor?) ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/530 "2009-09-30T17:39:37Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > jpeg (2): OAoW, TxtKitty > Mot Scud(1): peekra > The One and Only(1): Da’Chronic > Pecear(3): Gruff, Nook, Oredigger, Brainbleed > The Dread Bean (4): amrussett, Abnormal Phase, Freudian Skit, UPSDriver > Borerigger(2): Boozy, Scuddy > > Please, check for accuracy. I’m voting for Oredigger, not peeker. ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/531 "2009-09-30T17:44:55Z")
To move the convo in a different direction– **Chronos** , you still have your early one-off vote on **OAOW** , which, IIRC, was placed in order to try to get him to explain the soft claim in a bit more detail. Do you still think that’s necessary at this point, and if so, can you explain why? ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/532 "2009-09-30T17:54:17Z")
> [@Alka\_Seltzer](#): > > **@Tom Scud** - Why are you looking at the Peeker bandwagon in particular? Do you believe Peeker’s claim? Basically, I didn’t have time to look at both. I hope someone can look at the DB wagon and I’ll definitely be interested to see what comes out of that. In general I think the wagons are a better place to look for scum than instigators. I don’t 100% believe peeker’s claim, but the case against him was never better than “Good enough for Day One”. Incidentally, on the scumfight thing, the two games I’ve played in (not counting the Gasterd game) have featured multiple town vs. town fights on Day 1, with some scum piling on, and zero scum vs. scum fights. ---
**Author:** ![Thing\_Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@Thing\_Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing_Fish)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/533 "2009-09-30T18:07:23Z")
Good question, **Drain,** I too await \*\*Chronos’ \*\*response. Not sure what \*\*Alka \*\*is seeing suspicious (in 527 above) in my 423, or how it implied that I was “expecting **Drain Bead** to flip Town”. In fact, I said that the case against **Drain seemed to have some merit but needed to be reviewed more. After said review, as I stated in 519, I found the case less convincing than it had seemed at first glance, which would seem to undermine the possibility that I was trying to set up a Drain** wagon for tomorrow. I would also point out that (s?)he is lumping me in with **Oredigger** ; where I only pointed out that a scum effort to save **peeker** was one possible explanation for the odd voting pattern, \*\*Oredigger \*\*rather aggressively (almost…suspiciously…so) asserted that that was the case. And as usual, I have little idea who to vote for. I think this long Day One doesn’t help us find scum and only gives us more time to force our power roles to claim…boo. I will need to review the case against **Oredigger** , but for now… ---
**Author:** ![Thing\_Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@Thing\_Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing_Fish)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/534 "2009-09-30T18:11:32Z")
> [@Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](#): > > And because I think this Drain Bead wagon is completely bullshit, and I want to have some sort of vote in, I’ll go with the next best argument (that being **Peeker** ’s) > > B]vote: Tom Scud\*\* > [@Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](#): > > Check that. Actually, Scuddy’s got a better argument. (And, yes, I know how silly this looks, but it’s Day One) > > unvote: Scuddy > vote: Oredigger (quotes bleached) Something happened between 2:34 and 2:36 AM to make you change your mind? Really? :dubious: **vote Boozy** ---
**Author:** ![Thing\_Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@Thing\_Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing_Fish)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/535 "2009-09-30T18:47:49Z")
So, the case against **Oredigger** seems to boil down to him pushing the \*\*Drain \*\*bandwagon, but then voting for **peeker**. I think his posts are consistent with the simple explanation that he was pushing Drain hard to explain herself, and was ultimately satisfied with her explanation. Not seeing an obvious scum motivation for his actions: If both peeker and Drain are Town, that’s great for scum. Why would he bother drawing attention to himself by jumping into the middle of things? If peeker is scum and Drain is town, he went through all that to end up voting for a teammate? If peeker is town and Drain is scum…_maybe_ an attempt to gain cred, but it sure seemed like he was pushing Drain in earnest. If they’re both scum, he would have been pushing another candidate entirely. ---
**Author:** ![Thing\_Fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ecb155/32.png) [@Thing\_Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing_Fish)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/536 "2009-09-30T18:53:13Z")
> [@AllWalker](#): > > One thing to keep in mind, if there are multiple Docs, we would be less hurt if we were to lose one than if we only had the one. Not that I am advocating this, but lynching the claimed Doc on Day 1 should not be ruled off entirely because of this. Either peeker is lying, so LAL, or he is honest, so we have backup Docs. > > Also something to consider - if Town has 2 Docs and they are both capable of protecting right now (ie, no backup Doc to take over if Doc dies) then the Scum would almost certainly have a roleblocker. Otherwise it is potentially game breaking. OK, although I’ve expressed grave doubts about **peeker’s** claim, I absolutely think we should categorically rule out lynching a claimed Doc on Day One! There are other scum we can be hunting for while waiting to see if more information on peeker manifests itself. Even if we do have backup Docs, as **AllWalker** points out in his next paragraph, we can’t afford to waste any because the Scum surely have extra powers to compensate. This, combined with his “accidentally” misremembering the expressed opinions of Town in order to give us a long Day One, which, as I said, I think just gives us more time to shoot ourselves in the foot, has me starting to feel suspicious of AllWalker. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/537 "2009-09-30T19:17:48Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > jpeg (2): OAoW, TxtKitty > Mot Scud(1): peekra > The One and Only(1): Da’Chronic > Pecear(3): Gruff, Nook, Oredigger, Brainbleed > The Dread Bean (4): amrussett, Abnormal Phase, Freudian Skit, UPSDriver > Borerigger(2): Boozy, Scuddy > > Please, check for accuracy. I missed this earlier but I have unvoted peeker ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/538 "2009-09-30T19:36:37Z")
> [@](#): > > To move the convo in a different direction–Chronos, you still have your early one-off vote on OAOW, which, IIRC, was placed in order to try to get him to explain the soft claim in a bit more detail. Do you still think that’s necessary at this point, and if so, can you explain why? I prefer to base decisions on objective data rather than subjective, whenever possible, and objective data is hard to come by on Day 1. But it’s objectively known that there’s something special about **Wanderers** , and it’s also objectively true that he hasn’t told us what. I still think that the proper pro-Town play would be for **Wanderers** to tell us what he is, so I’m voting for what appears to me to be objectively anti-Town behavior. Now, toMorrow, we’ll have more information (if nothing else, the alignments of he dead), so I’ll be hopefully be able to draw some other conclusions then. ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/539 "2009-09-30T19:42:42Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > I prefer to base decisions on objective data rather than subjective, whenever possible, and objective data is hard to come by on Day 1. But it’s objectively known that there’s something special about **Wanderers** , and it’s also objectively true that he hasn’t told us what. I still think that the proper pro-Town play would be for **Wanderers** to tell us what he is, so I’m voting for what appears to me to be objectively anti-Town behavior. Now, toMorrow, we’ll have more information (if nothing else, the alignments of he dead), so I’ll be hopefully be able to draw some other conclusions then. What would you say to those who contend that **OAOW** has the best knowledge of whether or not full disclosure would be pro-Town? ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Scud](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2009, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938/540 "2009-09-30T20:36:33Z")
I poked at AllWalker’s other posts to see if anything scummy fell out, and nothing did. His participation in the peeker bandwagon looks the least suspicious of the bunch, IMO; he was questioning peeker’s reasoning before I placed my vote. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938.md?page=26) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screamers-mafia/510938.md?page=28)