# "Screw" is always a swear word. Really? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 2, 2009, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511 "2009-06-02T21:53:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/41 "2009-06-03T16:30:23Z")
> [@AskNott](#): > > Until recently, that was true. Now that Whoopi Goldberg told Glenn Beck he was “a lying sack of dog mess,” maybe a page has been turned. Allow me to take another stab at it. If further defense of messed. Imagine a room in disarray. Nobody says “Look at this big screw (or fuck)”. “Who made this big fuck (or screw)”. “This is soooo fucky (or screwy)”. ---
**Author:** ![Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimmy_Gibbler)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/42 "2009-06-03T16:30:37Z")
One has to wonder what she calls a pork chop. Whatever happened to that, anyway? We used to use “pork” for “fuck” all the time. I say: Time for a renaissance! ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/43 "2009-06-03T16:44:52Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > And that form of usage is defined as vulgar in ever dictionary I looked at. > > In my usage it was a euphemism for botched. Had I said “he botched this up” they could have complained that botched was a euphemism for fuck because they were being over sensitive and ridiculous!!! I’m agreeing with you. I am NOT agreeing with the claim that it is always vulgar. If a kid says, “Mom I was working on a puzzle and Billy screwed up all the pieces” that ANYONE in their right mind would consider that vulgar. It’s not. Not even close. ---
**Author:** ![cjepson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a9adbd/32.png) [@cjepson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cjepson)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/44 "2009-06-03T16:50:22Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > While helping someone fix something today I uttered “whomever put this together kind of screwed it up”. > > Which resulted in a mini lecture that I might as well have used the “F” word in front of their children [who were in another room] as the word screw is just an euphemism for it. > > :rolleyes: Um, yes, sometimes it is. But not in the manner I used it in. > > From [Dictionary.com](http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/screw): > > \*31.screw up, Slang. > a.to ruin through bungling or stupidity: Somehow the engineers screwed up the entire construction project. > b.to make a botch of something; blunder. > \* But that’s just the definition. If you look up “snafu” on [Dictionary.com](http://Dictionary.com), you get this definition: sna⋅fu –noun 1. a badly confused or ridiculously muddled situation. –adjective 2. in disorder; out of control; chaotic. –verb (used with object) 3. to throw into disorder; muddle. This definition is as innocent-sounding as the definition of “screw up”. Does this mean that “snafu” has no source in any vulgar word? No, because in that same entry, the definition of “snafu” is followed by this: Origin: 1940–45; s(ituation) n(ormal): a(ll) f(ucked) u(p); sometimes euphemistically construed as f(ouled) u(p) With regard to the verb phrase “screw up”, [Dictionary.com](http://Dictionary.com) does not provide any origin information either way; thus, it is an open question as to whether or not the phrase is a euphemism for “fuck up”. In all honesty, it had never occurred to me before that “screw up” was anything but a euphemism for “fuck up”. I guess that this was because I was thinking that there were only two definitions of “screw” as a verb – to have intercourse, and to insert a screw – and I couldn’t see what inserting a screw had to do with making a mess of something. (The question of what having intercourse has to do with making a mess of something could be the subject of a long discussion.) However, upon consulting my dictionary, I see that there is another, less common definition of “screw” – to twist out of shape or contort – so I can see how “screw up” could come from that definition. But I still don’t feel that any convincing evidence that it definitely did arise in that way has been presented. ---
**Author:** ![DiosaBellissima](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@DiosaBellissima](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DiosaBellissima)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/45 "2009-06-03T18:22:30Z")
[The President says it here.](http://www.thetonightshowwithconanobrien.com/video/clips/obama-endorses-conan-060209/1116843/) So, I’m going to say it can’t be that bad. ---
**Author:** ![PetW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d2c977/32.png) [@PetW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PetW)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/46 "2009-06-03T19:02:29Z")
> [@cjepson](#): > > However, upon consulting my dictionary, I see that there is another, less common definition of “screw” – to twist out of shape or contort – so I can see how “screw up” could come from that definition. I’ve heard it used to describe a facial gesture, “she screwed up her face.” In that context it obviously doesn’t mean “she fucked up her face.” ---
**Author:** ![Rhodes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rhodes/32/273_2.png) [@Rhodes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhodes)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/47 "2009-06-03T19:12:23Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > You’d think so, maybe, but I was once babysitting a kid (I think he was around 8 or 9 at the time), and used the word “jerk” in front of him and his mother. He had never heard that usage of the word before (he did know it as a sharp tug or pull), and I had to explain to him what it meant. I don’t think that his mom was _too_ upset, given that that was the worst word I ever used in his presence, but clearly she’d been doing a pretty good job of keeping him sheltered. My 4-year-old daughter is obsessed with pointing out words that she’s not supposed to say: sucks, hate, shut up, stupid. So when a friend says “that sucks” and my kid says “it’s not nice to say sucks,” I follow up with “we’d appreciate if you don’t teach that shit to my daughter.” Ironically ‘shit’ hasn’t made it into her vocabulary yet. ---
**Author:** ![Rhodes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rhodes/32/273_2.png) [@Rhodes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhodes)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/48 "2009-06-03T19:15:47Z")
> [@DiosaBellissima](#): > > [The President says it here.](http://www.thetonightshowwithconanobrien.com/video/clips/obama-endorses-conan-060209/1116843/) So, I’m going to say it can’t be that bad. Didn’t Dick Cheney get recorded telling a congressman to “fuck off” a couple years ago? I could be wrong about the details. So, I’m going to say it can’t be that bad. ---
**Author:** ![cjepson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a9adbd/32.png) [@cjepson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cjepson)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/49 "2009-06-03T19:30:12Z")
> [@PetW](#): > > I’ve heard it used to describe a facial gesture, “she screwed up her face.” In that context it obviously doesn’t mean “she fucked up her face.” Unless she did a really bad job of putting on her makeup 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/50 "2009-06-03T19:56:38Z")
> [@Rhodes](#): > > My 4-year-old daughter is obsessed with pointing out words that she’s not supposed to say: sucks, hate, shut up, stupid. So when a friend says “that sucks” and my kid says “it’s not nice to say sucks,” I follow up with “we’d appreciate if you don’t teach that shit to my daughter.” Ironically ‘shit’ hasn’t made it into her vocabulary yet. My niece was the same way. “Mom, you said fuck. Seriously! SHe said it! She said FUCK! I thought we weren’t supposed to say FUCK!” ---
**Author:** ![Sternvogel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bc79bd/32.png) [@Sternvogel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sternvogel)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/51 "2009-06-03T21:13:04Z")
> [@Q.E.D](#): > > Except, perhaps, on [this very board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10915121&postcount=17). Short answer: you’re wrong. I don’t recall reading the linked thread when it first appeared, but I noticed the following just now: In Post #2, **RealityChuck** gives an example from 1631 of “scrued vp” used to mean “raised prices”. In Post #17, **samclem** claims that the OED traces the “sexual intercourse” meaning to “as early as 1625”, which “predates” **RealityChuck** ’s example. Yet in the cite **samclem** supplies, the _New Canting Dict._ definition is attributed to the year 1725, ninety-four years after 1631. Although this doesn’t establish the etymology of the phrase, it appears that **samclem** ’s chronology is – dare I say it? – screwed up. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2009, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/52 "2009-06-03T22:42:24Z")
> [@Sternvogel](#): > > I don’t recall reading the linked thread when it first appeared, but I noticed the following just now: > > In Post #2, **RealityChuck** gives an example from 1631 of “scrued vp” used to mean “raised prices”. > > In Post #17, **samclem** claims that the OED traces the “sexual intercourse” meaning to “as early as 1625”, which “predates” **RealityChuck** ’s example. Yet in the cite **samclem** supplies, the _New Canting Dict._ definition is attributed to the year 1725, ninety-four years after 1631. > > Although this doesn’t establish the etymology of the phrase, it appears that **samclem** ’s chronology is – dare I say it? – screwed up. Now that I look back, I think you’re right. When volume III(and IV?) of The Historical Dictionary of American Slang appears sometime in the next few years, we’ll have the benefit of all the research that has been done the last 20 years on letters P-Z. I dare say that Jon Lighter, the editor, has plenty of cites which will confirm that “screw up,” at least since the 1930s-40s is directly derived as a euphemism for “fuck up.” Proving it will always be hard. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/53 "2009-06-05T15:16:20Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > So, was this person being stupid and over sensitive, looking for something to be offended by (by the person who was helping them out:mad: ) or am I out of touch with modern mores? This morning the CNN news anchor was quoting someone who said “…screwed up…”. So apparently the CNN censor staff doesn’t think “screwed up” is offensive. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/54 "2009-06-05T19:27:08Z")
> [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](#): > > Compare: > > _Better check the sales figures again; those numbers seem pretty screwy._ > > \*_Better check the sales figures again; those numbers seem pretty fucky._ Compare: Better check the sales figures again; those numbers seem pretty fucked. \*Fucky \*isn’t the adjective form of _fuck_; \*fucked \*is. > [@Arkcon](#): > > I once said that the setup at work had left us totally “boned.” You’ll often see snips posted online from an old Batman comic that involve the word _boner_–in its now deprecated meaning of _mistake_. > [@](#): > > Years ago, during the TV series titled “Uncle Buck”, based, in a very lame TV neutered way, on the movie, there was controversy that the child star used the term “sucks.” Keven Meany made the point that the term is now neutral – everyone, even kids, says “sucks” without sexual overtones. I still remember a time when I was in grade school when I said that something “sucks” in front of my grandparents and everyone got all shocked. I couldn’t figure out why, of course. They all told me it was “inappropriate,” but wouldn’t explain when I asked, “But it’s just sucking! How is it inappropriate?” > [@NDP](#): > > Well, I’m going to stick up for “crap.” Even though it’s regarded as being less offensive than “shit,” “crap” begins with a hard-C and that makes it sound more emphatic than the more passive “sh” in “shit.” When I’m swearing in a public place where I can’t actually swear in the way that I’d like, I’ll often go with くそ (_kuso_, a Japanese word that falls somewhere between \*crap \*and _shit_) for that exact reason–it’s very good for spitting out with vitriol. ---
**Author:** ![Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimmy_Gibbler)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/55 "2009-06-05T19:31:31Z")
> [@Shot\_From\_Guns](#): > > Compare: > > Better check the sales figures again; those numbers seem pretty fucked. > > \*Fucky \*isn’t the adjective form of _fuck_; \*fucked \*is. Compare: _Oh noes! An avalanche! We’re fucked!_ _Oh noes! An avalanche! We’re screwed!_ \*_Oh noes! An avalanche! We’re screwy!_ Here is an inflected form of “screw” that has no counterpart form with “fuck.” This completes the proof. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/56 "2009-06-05T20:39:47Z")
> [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](#): > > Compare: > > _Oh noes! An avalanche! We’re fucked!_ > > _Oh noes! An avalanche! We’re screwed!_ > > \*_Oh noes! An avalanche! We’re screwy!_ > > Here is an inflected form of “screw” that has no counterpart form with “fuck.” > > This completes the proof. 1.) I wasn’t arguing that \*screwy \*was interchangeable with _fucked_, simply that you couldn’t make the point using the nonexistant word _fucky_. 2.) I’m reasonably sure that this is a different \*fucked \*than in the previous example. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2009, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511/57 "2009-06-06T01:47:46Z")
Even if screwed up is a euphemism for fucked up, how does that make it bad to use around kids? That’s part of what euphemisms are _for_. Would a kid really get in trouble for using the sentence ‘I screwed it up’ at school? (I know you didn’t use that word around the kids, but I guess she could say she was just trying to establish a general principle). Sounds like she was just annoyed at someone else and took it out on you. Guess you won’t be doing her any more favours for a while. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screw-is-always-a-swear-word-really/498511.md?page=2)