# Screwup In "The Godfather"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 3, 2011, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361 "2011-08-03T19:51:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2011, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/1 "2011-08-03T19:51:12Z")
AMC is running "Mob Week"and I happened to tune in. I think I have spotted a set problem with the Godfather. When Tom Hagen is out Christmas shopping (and is kidnapped by the Turk), it is snowing in midtown Manahttan. In the next scene (the attempted murder of Don Corleone), the streets are bare. Now, I belive that the Don’s bsiness was located in the Bronx-but why the sno in Manhattan? ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2011, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/2 "2011-08-03T21:01:17Z")
Just a couple of guesses… First, was the attempted hit on Don Corleone explicitly given as happening at the same time, or on the same day? Second, depending on what the temp had been like before the snowfall, the snow might not have stuck. Especially in an urban area like Manhattan which tends to trap more heat in the streets/sidewalks/etc. The snow could have just melted before the next scene. My guess is they were on separate days, but I’d have to go re-watch. ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2011, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/3 "2011-08-03T21:23:47Z")
> [@Bob Ducca](#): > > First, was the attempted hit on Don Corleone explicitly given as happening at the same time, or on the same day? Yes. The Turk tells Tom that Vito has been hit, and that the reason they’ve collared him is to get him to talk since into Sonny to prevent a war. > [@](#): > > CUT TO: An abandoned diner / Sollozzo with kidnapped Tom Hagen -night > > SOLLOZZO (drinking coffee, to Tom) > > Your boss is dead. I know you’re not in the muscle-end of the family, Tom, so I don’t want > > you to be scared. I want you to help the Corleone’s, and I want you to help me. > > (then, handing Tom a drink) > > Yeah, we got him outside his office just about an hour after we picked you up. > > (then) > > Drink it. > > (then) > > So now it’s up to you to make the peace between me and Sonny. > > (then) > > Sonny was hot for my deal, wasn’t he? And you knew it was the right thing to do. > > TOM > > Sonny’ll come after you with everything he’s got. > > SOLLOZZO > > That’ll be his first reaction, sure. That’s why you gotta talk some sense into him. The > > Tattaglia family is behind me with all their people. The other New York Families will go > > along with anything that will prevent a full-scale war. Let’s face it, Tom, and all due respect, > > the Don, rest in peace, was – slippin’. Ten years ago could I have gotten to him? > > (then) > > Well – now he’s dead. He’s dead, Tom, and nothing can bring him back. So you gotta talk to > > Sonny, you gotta talk to the caporegimes, that Tessio and that Fat Clemenza. > > (then) > > It’s good business, Tom. [Source](http://www.thegodfathertrilogy.com/gf1/transcript/gf1transcript.html) ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2011, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/4 "2011-08-03T21:30:54Z")
Doesn’t answer the question, but was the Christmas shopping scene the one described [here](http://www.thegodfathertrilogy.com/program.txt): > [@](#): > > The first scene was shot on March 24 although the actual start-date was > scheduled for March 30. The one-day setup was moved up because it was a > scene in front of Best & Company on Fifth Avenue the day before > Christmas, 1945. When producer Ruddy heard a weather forecast promising > snow flurries for the following day, he summoned cast, crew and staff to > report to work the next morning. Unfortunately, the forecaster ran true > to form. There was no sign of a snowflake, so enormous snow blowers were > brought in creating artificial snow. Best & Company – which officially > went out of business a year before – was suddenly reactivated. Its > windows were cleaned and dressed with mannequins wearing clothes of the > 40s, the decorations were Christmas-like in flavor and many a passerby > was startled by the Yuletide atmosphere in the middle of the Easter > Season. And > [@](#): > > The most troublesome scenes of all were those which were shot on Mott > Street where Little Italy borders on Chinatown. Mott is a narrow street, > unchanged from the turn of the century when it was designed for > horse-and-wagon transportation, and its narrow sidewalks are cluttered > with stands displaying the wares of local merchants. Windows and fire > escapes in the neighborhood were jammed with spectators elbowing each > other for a better view. It is there that Don Corleone emerges from his > olive oil factory and is gunned down by a rival Family. It was a scene > repeated endlessly during a three-day period. ---
**Author:** ![KneadToKnow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kneadtoknow/32/3999_2.png) [@KneadToKnow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KneadToKnow)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2011, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/5 "2011-08-03T21:32:24Z")
Dang it. Talk _sense_ into him, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2011, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/6 "2011-08-03T22:08:35Z")
The series is being presented with interviews of several interesting personalities accompanying the showing. I was amazed to see Henry Hill, who if you remember, was played by Ray Liotta in _Goodfellas._ I thought he was in the witness protection program? They must have made him an offer he couldn’t refuse. ---
**Author:** ![fiddlesticks](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddlesticks/32/18129_2.png) [@fiddlesticks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fiddlesticks)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2011, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/7 "2011-08-03T22:13:58Z")
Hill got kicked out of the Witness Protection Program in the early 90’s…if the mobsters he was mixed up with were still interested in killing him he’d be long dead. Wikipedia says he lives in Topanga Canyon now. Shhhh! ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2011, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/8 "2011-08-03T22:22:50Z")
> [@fiddlesticks](#): > > Hill got kicked out of the Witness Protection Program in the early 90’s…if the mobsters he was mixed up with were still interested in killing him he’d be long dead. Wikipedia says he lives in Topanga Canyon now. Shhhh! As I recall, he got kicked out because he couldn’t keep his mouth shut about being a mobster. Can’t help folks who don’t want to be helped I guess. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2011, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/9 "2011-08-03T22:55:54Z")
Hmm… I was thinking he purchased oranges from a street vendor just before being gunned down – but of course that wouldn’t be right for a winter scene in NYC. Where did I get that from? ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2011, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/10 "2011-08-03T23:31:25Z")
> [@BrotherCadfael](#): > > Hmm… I was thinking he purchased oranges from a street vendor just before being gunned down – but of course that wouldn’t be right for a winter scene in NYC. Where did I get that from? Yes it would, oranges are a traditional christmas present - tucked into the hanging stockings, or in the case of our family, we got cases of the damned things shipped to us at christmas time from various relatives. One year we had 5 cases of the damned things. I swear we had a gallon of kumquats, and back then we had no idea what to do with kumquats … :smack: ---
**Author:** ![fiddlesticks](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiddlesticks/32/18129_2.png) [@fiddlesticks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fiddlesticks)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2011, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/11 "2011-08-03T23:44:38Z")
Oranges transported up by train to the Northeast from Florida, even back then. Oranges were a “St. Nicholas Day” present in my family. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2011, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/12 "2011-08-03T23:51:34Z")
Thanks-I like the source. ---
**Author:** ![mac\_bolan00](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b3f665/32.png) [@mac\_bolan00](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mac_bolan00)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2011, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/13 "2011-08-04T00:09:05Z")
simple, they cleaned the snow around his office and the fruit stalls (a don might have that privilege,) unlike in the commercial strips where michael and tom were shopping. at least they had a warmer burning. > [@](#): > > CUT TO: An abandoned diner / Sollozzo with kidnapped Tom Hagen -night > > SOLLOZZO (drinking coffee, to Tom) > > Your boss is dead. I know you’re not in the muscle-end of the family, Tom, so I don’t want > > you to be scared. I want you to help the Corleone’s, and I want you to help me. incomplete. “your boss is dead. yeah, we got him an hour before/after we picked you up.” can’t remember if it’s before or after. that’ll set the time context. ---
**Author:** ![DanCorleone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/8edcca/32.png) [@DanCorleone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanCorleone)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2011, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/14 "2011-08-04T00:52:39Z")
Regarding the oranges: I believe they were also used throughout the film to foreshadow a death or violence or somesuch event… can’t find the source but swear I heard Coppola say that somewhere… ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2011, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/15 "2011-08-04T01:21:16Z")
> [@DanCorleone](#): > > Regarding the oranges: I believe they were also used throughout the film to foreshadow a death or violence or somesuch event… can’t find the source but swear I heard Coppola say that somewhere… From [IMDB:](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0068646/trivia) > [@](#): > > The presence of oranges in the Godfather trilogy indicates that a death-related event will soon occur (even though production designer Dean Tavoularis claimed the oranges were simply used to brighten up the darkly shot film). In chronological order of such events: > > Hagen and Woltz negotiate Johnny Fontane’s position at a table with a bowl of oranges on it, and later Woltz discovers his horse’s severed head > > Don Corleone buys oranges right before he is shot > > Sonny drives past an advertisement for Florida Oranges before he is assassinated > > at the Mafioso summit, bowls of oranges are placed on the tables (specifically in front of those Dons who will be assassinated) > > Michael eats an orange while discussing his plans with Hagen > > before Don Corleone dies, he plays with an orange > > Tessio, who is executed for attempting to betray Michael, plays with an orange at Connie’s wedding > > and Carlo Rizzi, who wears an orange suit right before Sonny beats him up, causes Sonny’s death and is himself garrotted in retribution. > > The only deaths in the film that don’t appear to have oranges foreshadowing them are the assassinations of Paulie, Sollozzo, McCluskey and Apollonia. ---
**Author:** ![wedgehed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8edcca/32.png) [@wedgehed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wedgehed)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2011, 7:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/16 "2011-08-04T07:09:02Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > From [IMDB:](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0068646/trivia)The only deaths in the film that don’t appear to have oranges foreshadowing them are the assassinations of Paulie, Sollozzo, McCluskey and Apollonia. I don’t know about that… Paulie - Orange you sorry you called in sick? Sollozzo/McCluskey - Orange you sorry you let Mike go take a leak? Apollonia - Orange you sorry you learned to drive? ---
**Author:** ![mac\_bolan00](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b3f665/32.png) [@mac\_bolan00](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mac_bolan00)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2011, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/17 "2011-08-04T07:21:44Z")
> [@wedgehed](#): > > I don’t know about that… > > Paulie - Orange you sorry you called in sick? > > Sollozzo/McCluskey - Orange you sorry you let Mike go take a leak? > > Apollonia - Orange you sorry you learned to drive? they don’t want it known but canoli, veal, and gnochi will also kill you. ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2011, 9:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/18 "2011-08-04T09:13:28Z")
> [@mac\_bolan00](#): > > they don’t want it known but canoli, veal, and gnochi will also kill you. Well, more to the point, _Mobsters_ will evidently kill you. The orange thing was just anti-Florida propaganda. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![mac\_bolan00](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b3f665/32.png) [@mac\_bolan00](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mac_bolan00)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2011, 9:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/19 "2011-08-04T09:16:08Z")
not anti-LA? it’s mainly in new york, remember? ---
**Author:** ![palacheck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a88e57/32.png) [@palacheck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/palacheck)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2011, 11:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361/20 "2011-08-04T11:47:53Z")
> [@fiddlesticks](#): > > Hill got kicked out of the Witness Protection Program in the early 90’s…if the mobsters he was mixed up with were still interested in killing him he’d be long dead. Wikipedia says he lives in Topanga Canyon now. Shhhh! The mobsters he was mixed up with are all dead. Why Henry the alcoholic isn’t, is anybody’s guess. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/screwup-in-the-godfather/591361.md?page=2)