# Scripps-Howard National Spelling Bee 2009 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 28, 2009, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932 "2009-05-28T15:00:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Rusalka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecd19e/32.png) [@Rusalka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rusalka)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/41 "2009-05-29T18:07:09Z")
> [@Erdosain](#): > > Most of the OED consists of snippets of literature to show the first known usage and how the word has been used through the centuries. Yes, is the Merriam-Webster Third International Dictionary as entertaining as the OED? ---
**Author:** ![Necros](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/necros/32/11086_2.png) [@Necros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Necros)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/42 "2009-05-29T18:09:45Z")
> [@Rusalka](#): > > Yes, is the Merriam-Webster Third International Dictionary as entertaining as the OED? No. ETA: **judikium** , that was my experience with competitive spellers at the lower levels, too. For the most part kids are there because they want to be, not because their parents are making them be. ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/43 "2009-05-29T18:19:52Z")
> [@jsc1953](#): > > One word was not in my Shorter OED – I looked it up because they never provided the definition. Now I can’t remember it, dammit. I dunno about the Shorter OED, but I’ve been composing for nearly 40 years, and I’ve never heard of the alleged musical term “amarevole,” nor does it appear in my musical dictionaries, and certainly not in my Webster’s. ---
**Author:** ![Rusalka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecd19e/32.png) [@Rusalka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rusalka)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/44 "2009-05-29T18:29:29Z")
What struck me is that sometimes when a word was completely unfamiliar, the spellers flubbed it up in odd ways, that indicated they didn’t understand the patterns of the origin languages. For example, Menhir was misspelled Mynheer - that misspelling doesn’t follow the pattern of Welsh or French spelling, neither of those languages commonly have words with “ee” in them (unless of Dutch origin), and the “y” in Welsh is not pronounced the way we pronounce “e”. I had assumed the contestants were versed in lanuage theory, especially how European languages spelled their morphemes. The mispelling of palatschinken was another surprise. The contestant didn’t know how German words are spelled, because he spelled it the way an American with no exposure to German would spell it. (“Ch” instead of “tsch” and “u” instead of “a”). Perhaps these students really do use rote memorization, which would be very sad. To me the spelling bee seems more of a linguistic exercise - the inclusion of the origins of words provide big clues. If you you’re good at picking up patterns and language spelling rules, you have a big advantage. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/45 "2009-05-29T19:03:35Z")
> [@Just\_Some\_Guy](#): > > Come on, they were all perfectly cromulent words. [Case in point.](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=25540) ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/46 "2009-05-29T19:13:07Z")
> [@Rusalka](#): > > To me the spelling bee seems more of a linguistic exercise - the inclusion of the origins of words provide big clues. If you you’re good at picking up patterns and language spelling rules, you have a big advantage. Maybe that’s why the winner won. The commentator commented (heh) several times that she really knew her roots. She’d ask about Greek this and Latin that, using words I’ve never heard. (Not that it’s hard to use words I’ve never heard.) ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/47 "2009-05-29T22:03:00Z")
> [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](#): > > I dunno about the Shorter OED, but I’ve been composing for nearly 40 years, and I’ve never heard of the alleged musical term “amarevole,” nor does it appear in my musical dictionaries, and certainly not in my Webster’s. Amarevole is not in the unabridged OED either. I smell a lawsuit! ---
**Author:** ![Rusalka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecd19e/32.png) [@Rusalka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rusalka)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/48 "2009-05-29T22:07:19Z")
> [@Erdosain](#): > > Amarevole is not in the unabridged OED either. I smell a lawsuit! Is it in the dictionary used for the competition? Mirriam-Webster’s Third International? ---
**Author:** ![Rusalka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecd19e/32.png) [@Rusalka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rusalka)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/49 "2009-05-29T22:16:44Z")
I found “amarevole” in an online music dictionary: > **[Dolmetsch Online - Music Dictionary Am - Am](https://www.dolmetsch.com/defsa6.htm)** > > recorder, beckfluto, blockflauta, blockfleita, blokflojte, Blockflöte, blockflöjt, blockflõték, blokfløyte, blokfluit, flauta de pico, flauta doce, flauta dulce, flauto a becco, flauto diritto, flauto dolce, flétna, fluta de bec, flûte à bec, flûte... ---
**Author:** ![Necros](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/necros/32/11086_2.png) [@Necros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Necros)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/50 "2009-05-29T23:04:06Z")
> [@Rusalka](#): > > Is it in the dictionary used for the competition? Mirriam-Webster’s Third International? I will check tonight and report back. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Obeseus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbce88/32.png) [@Obeseus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Obeseus)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/51 "2009-05-29T23:45:10Z")
In 5th grade, I won my school and beat everyone in 5th-8th grades in city to advance to state, where I finished around 6th. I don’t remember the word I went out on. After being eliminated, we were whisked to a back room where we had all the ice cream and cake we could eat. ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2009, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/52 "2009-05-29T23:58:02Z")
In sixth grade I thought I was a spelling stud and assumed I would at least go to state; and I swaggered as if it were already true. So I get up with a few kids left, and the teacher says “mammary.” Me: Memory? Her: No, _mam_mary. Me: _Mem_ory? Her: No…_mam_mary…MAMmary! At this point I’m just staring at her, so they have a quick whispered conference (she was probably heading me off before asking for a definition) and they substitute another word. I don’t remember what that word was, but I went down in flames and never entered a spelling bee again. ---
**Author:** ![Covered\_In\_Bees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7ab992/32.png) [@Covered\_In\_Bees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Covered_In_Bees)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2009, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/53 "2009-05-30T00:03:34Z")
In elementary school in the early 90s, our spelling bees were only the fourth and fifth graders competing against each other. There were qualifying rounds, where each specific class of students would compete against each other then, then the top few would go against all the other winners of the two grades. When I was in fourth grade, I came in fourth. Fifth grade on the other hand, I’m doing pretty well during a qualifying round and can’t wait to compete in the true spelling bee and improve on my fourth place finish. Then the word “scheme” gets handed to me. I spell it with a K like a dope and am pissed at myself for the rest of day because I knew how to spell it correctly. I just had a brain cramp. Grrr. ---
**Author:** ![judikium](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a9adbd/32.png) [@judikium](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/judikium)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2009, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/54 "2009-05-30T15:25:28Z")
> [@Rusalka](#): > > What struck me is that sometimes when a word was completely unfamiliar, the spellers flubbed it up in odd ways, that indicated they didn’t understand the patterns of the origin languages. For example, Menhir was misspelled Mynheer - that misspelling doesn’t follow the pattern of Welsh or French spelling, neither of those languages commonly have words with “ee” in them (unless of Dutch origin), and the “y” in Welsh is not pronounced the way we pronounce “e”. I had assumed the contestants were versed in lanuage theory, especially how European languages spelled their morphemes. The mispelling of palatschinken was another surprise. The contestant didn’t know how German words are spelled, because he spelled it the way an American with no exposure to German would spell it. (“Ch” instead of “tsch” and “u” instead of “a”). Perhaps these students really do use rote memorization, which would be very sad. [Mynheer](http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/mynheer) is a separate word. I assume the girl heard “menhir,” thought she recognized it, and didn’t try to come up with a more logical spelling. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2009, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/55 "2009-05-30T15:38:18Z")
> [@Erdosain](#): > > You can buy the unabridged OED on CD-ROM, but it’s $200. Also, bear in mind that it takes up 20 volumes in print (you can get the hard copy for $900). Some guy wrote [a book about reading the entire OED in a year,](http://www.amazon.com/Reading-OED-One-Year-Pages/dp/0399533982) but I can’t help but think he started skimming at some point. Most of the OED consists of snippets of literature to show the first known usage and how the word has been used through the centuries. Just in case anyone feels the need to read this guy’s drivel, don’t. The book is pretty terrible and while entertaining for the first few pages, shoots its wad very early. You have been warned. ---
**Author:** ![Rusalka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ecd19e/32.png) [@Rusalka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rusalka)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2009, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/56 "2009-05-30T15:50:54Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > Just in case anyone feels the need to read this guy’s drivel, don’t. The book is pretty terrible and while entertaining for the first few pages, shoots its wad very early. > > You have been warned. Thanks for that! I was actually considering ordering it for $14 yesterday through Amazon, but fortunately, I got distracted and forgot. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![mobo85](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b19c9b/32.png) [@mobo85](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mobo85)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2009, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/57 "2009-05-30T17:52:10Z")
If you want to read an enjoyable book about a man reading an entire reference work, you should read _The Know-It-All_ by A.J. Jacobs, which is about the author’s attempt to read the entire Encyclopædia Britannica. A very entertaining and funny book. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [May 30, 2009, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932/58 "2009-05-30T18:13:12Z")
> [@mobo85](#): > > If you want to read an enjoyable book about a man reading an entire reference work, you should read _The Know-It-All_ by A.J. Jacobs, which is about the author’s attempt to read the entire Encyclopædia Britannica. A very entertaining and funny book. Definitely agreed. It’s why I picked up _Reading the OED_ in the first place, I was hoping for something similar to _The Know-It-All_, which I love. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scripps-howard-national-spelling-bee-2009/497932.md?page=2)