# Scylla, I just gotta say...
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758
**Category:** The BBQ Pit
**Created:** [August 13, 2002, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758 "2002-08-13T22:45:39Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Soul\_Brother\_Number\_Two](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soul_Brother_Number_Two)
#### Post date: [August 13, 2002, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/1 "2002-08-13T22:45:39Z")
In the ‘liberal, not stupid’ thread, Scylla has this to say:
'Yeah, that’s right. No liberal wingnut would actually ever hurt anybody. It’s not like any of them would ever shoot John Lennon, or mail letter bombs from their cabin.
Not to mention the greatest liberal flower child of them, good ole Charlie Manson and his loving family.
Yeah, those liberal wingnuts are such an improvement.’
Scylla, I’ve seen you post some deliberately inflammatory things during my time here, and then shrug them off with a ‘I wuz only kidding, cantcha take a joke.’
I’ve never bothered to respond, but when you classify Mark Chapman, The Unabomber, and Charles Manson as ‘liberal wingnuts,’ well,
that takes the proverbial cake.
You, sir, are a disgusting troll, and you should be ashamed of yourself.
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### Author:  [@Myrnalene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myrnalene)
#### Post date: [August 13, 2002, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/2 "2002-08-13T23:00:11Z")
You don’t seem very clear on the definition of the word **troll**. Of all the things that **Scylla** is not…
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### Author:  [@Giraffe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giraffe)
#### Post date: [August 13, 2002, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/3 "2002-08-13T23:04:50Z")
Here’s [the link](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=130241&pagenumber=3), if you’re into that sort of thing.
I’m confused – are you insulted on behalf of the three individuals mentioned, or on behalf of liberal wingnuts? I don’t know about Mark Chapman or Charles Manson, but the Unabomber was pretty much the textbook definition of a liberal wingnut. Very much left wing (anarchist/luddite), very much out to lunch. His politics factored heavily into his bombing campaign.
I mean, it’s a pretty stupid thing to say, but in the context of that very stupid thread, it’s hardly remarkable.
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### Author:  [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)
#### Post date: [August 13, 2002, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/4 "2002-08-13T23:09:07Z")
well, he **did** leave out John Wayne Gacy, but I suspect that was only 'cause he **knew** I’d have countered w/ Ted Bundy.
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### Author:  [@Kamandi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamandi)
#### Post date: [August 13, 2002, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/5 "2002-08-13T23:09:41Z")
Well, ignoring their infamous acts for a moment, could Mark Chapman, the Unabomber or Charles Manson be classified as “on the loony side of leftist”, “on the crazy side of conservative” or “on the madcap side of moderate”, politically?
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### Author:  [@Soul\_Brother\_Number\_Two](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soul_Brother_Number_Two)
#### Post date: [August 13, 2002, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/6 "2002-08-13T23:37:16Z")
Jane Fonda is a liberal wingnut. The aforementioned three are dangerously insane, and have no place in a ‘liberal/conservative’ discussion.
See the difference? To my mind, Scylla’s choice of examples serves no purpose except to be deliberately provocative.
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### Author:  [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)
#### Post date: [August 13, 2002, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/7 "2002-08-13T23:53:30Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by essvee \*
> \*\*Jane Fonda is a liberal wingnut \*\*
Point of order. Janey **was** a liberal wingnut. I believe of late that she’s traded sides.
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### Author:  [@Kamandi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamandi)
#### Post date: [August 13, 2002, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/8 "2002-08-13T23:56:35Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by essvee \*
> \*\*To my mind, Scylla’s choice of examples serves no purpose except to be deliberately provocative. \*\*
Sure he was being deliberately provocative. That doesn’t mean he was trolling.
To my mind (not having read the thread _because there was no link included in the OP_ - how the fuck are we supposed to figure out what you’re fuming about without a damned link? You want us to work for our peanut and search for the “liberal not stupid thread”?) **Scylla** was using a provocative example to illustrate the fallacy of his opposition’s position. That’s not trolling, that’s making a point.
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### Author:  [@Kamandi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamandi)
#### Post date: [August 13, 2002, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/9 "2002-08-13T23:59:39Z")
And of course, I notice too late that a **Giraffe** has already provided the link to the original crime. Doesn’t let the OP off the hook, though. Put a link in your rant, people!
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### Author:  [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2002, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/10 "2002-08-14T00:42:20Z")
> [@](#):
>
> Jane Fonda is a liberal wingnut. The aforementioned three are dangerously insane, and have no place in a ‘liberal/conservative’ discussion.
A matter of semantics. Those three characters espoused or followed liberal worldviews, and they were nuts. I don’t see anything wrong with Scylla’s characterization.
As Wring pointed out so amusingly, there’re nuts all over the place. Liberals are hardly free of having crazies in their midst.
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### Author:  [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2002, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/11 "2002-08-14T00:49:25Z")
Oh, I should point out that Scylla was directly responding to AceOspades comment, “The Conservative wingnuts blowup Federal buildings and shoot abortion doctors, where ours just burn down empty houses and release lab rats”. Personally, I find that to be far more insulting, as it implies that only conservatives become violent and dangerous.
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### Author:  [@Big\_Kahuna\_Burger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Big_Kahuna_Burger)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2002, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/12 "2002-08-14T01:01:34Z")
> [@](#):
>
> Point of order. Janey was a liberal wingnut. I believe of late that she’s traded sides.
In this election cycle, she has donated to the following candidates/political groups:
Sen. Max Cleland (D-GA) and his PAC: $7,600
Democratic Senatorial Campaign Cmte: $8,700
Tom Daschle’s PAC: $10,000
David Scott (D-Candidate in GA’s new 13th CD): $1,000
Progressive Majority PAC [I don’t remember who runs it]: $5,000
Erskine Bowles (D-NC Senate Candidate): $500, which was returned
NARAL: $5,000
Seems like she’s still with us on the left.
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### Author:  [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2002, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/13 "2002-08-14T01:18:02Z")
Ah, yes, but is she still a wingnut?
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### Author:  [@light\_strand](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/light_strand)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2002, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/14 "2002-08-14T01:18:32Z")
Actually **SPOOF** I said it . And it was in direct respose to this gem;
> [@](#):
>
> Us conservatives get our share of wingnuts, too. But I prefer the conservative brand of nut, myself. I can deal with a selfish, self-motivated and intolerant person, and those people can change. Stupid, naive and self-righteous is usually a fatally self-perpetuating combination.
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### Author:  [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2002, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/15 "2002-08-14T01:28:07Z")
What Spoofe said. Mine were rebuttal examples, and you’ll notice in the post that I cited what I was rebutting.
I consider **essvee’s** failure to notice or remarkable ability to completely ignore this fact and take issue with my post on this basis to show a truly cosmic level of stupidity and blindness.
And now (and thank you for setting the stage **essvee** ) let me requalify my statements re: liberalism.
I had stated earlier in that thread that liberalism seems to attract more than it’s share of the stupid, naive, and self-righteous people than conservatism.
Ladies and gentleman I present you with **essvee**.
My case rests.
I don’t consider this to be a knock on liberals or liberalism in general. I’m just mentioning the fact that liberalism carries its particular burdens. I also mentioned in that thread that conservatism seems to attract, the haters, the self-centered, and the rabid fundamentalists. Just a personal observation, but a valid one, I think. Both sides have what I term as “wingnuts.”
I’ll even go a step further and say that liberalism is the way to go if you are an exceedingly gifted and exceptional person. I know a few.
Anyway **essvee** your efforts are akin to the amorous ant endeavoring up the cow’s leg all the while assuring her that he’ll be gentle\*\*.
In the final analysis you’re just another chucklehead.
\*\*Figure out where I got that one!
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### Author:  [@apotheosis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/apotheosis)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2002, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/16 "2002-08-14T01:29:30Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by wring \*
> \*\*Point of order. Janey **was** a liberal wingnut. I believe of late that she’s traded sides. \*\*
AFIAK, she apologized for her actions and statements during the Vietnam War. As Big Kahuna Burger pointed out, that doesn’t mean she ‘traded sides’.
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### Author:  [@Honey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Honey)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2002, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/17 "2002-08-14T01:30:46Z")
**essvee**
To be fair to Scylla, you should send him an e-mail so that he knows he’s been pitted.
It’s only fair that he be able to defend himself.
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### Author:  [@Beagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beagle)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2002, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/18 "2002-08-14T01:31:44Z")
Here is a nice PDF [put together by the FBI](http://www.fbi.gov/publications/terror/terror99.pdf). This thing goes into some detail. Neither extreme looks very good to me.
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### Author:  [@light\_strand](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/light_strand)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2002, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/19 "2002-08-14T01:48:55Z")
FTR as it was in response to me:
I thought it was a fair exchange (although I question the inclusion of Manson as he was attempting to start a race riot, and I’m not quite sure about Chapmen’s politics, but he was indeed a wingnut).
**esvee** you’re in over head. I think you should quietly slink away.
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### Author:  [@Soul\_Brother\_Number\_Two](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soul_Brother_Number_Two)
#### Post date: [August 14, 2002, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/scylla-i-just-gotta-say/123758/20 "2002-08-14T01:55:06Z")
Meh. I can’t see how Chapman, Ted K, or Manson can realistically be viewed as espousing liberal politics. There’s a world of difference between these guys and Tim McVeigh.
I still think it was a trollish post and that Scylla is a self-congratulatory jerk.
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