# SDMB Bigoted Asshole Omnibus Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 29, 2012, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489 "2012-05-29T22:59:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Blaster\_Master](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/cab0a1/32.png) [@Blaster\_Master](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blaster_Master)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/181 "2012-05-31T18:12:35Z")
Here’s what I don’t get. Let’s assume, for the sake of discussion, that we can meaningfully determine some set of races and we can determine some sort of meaningful statistics about how they perform on some sorts of standardized tests in various types of abilities and that there are some differences. I’m not sure what sort of conclusions we’re supposed to draw from it. For instance, say race X scores a few IQ points higher than race Y on average. What conclusions do we draw from that? If we try to cause that there’s a causal relationship there that gives race X an advantage or race Y a disadvantage, I don’t think we can say that statistically since there are countless other variables involved with race that are not statistically independent, particularly culture and socioeconomic pressures. So maybe it’s a combination of things. But let’s take it a step further, let’s even say that we can control for all of those other variables and can say that there actually is some sort of meaningful difference between races, even if it’s slight… so what? Are we supposed to treat individuals of one race differently because of that? Are we supposed to create social programs or policies to account for these differences? Let’s compare it to sex, where there absolutely is a genetic basis for the differences in the sexes. For instance, on average, a man is stronger than a woman… so what? If I have a task that needs to get done that requires a certain amount of strength and I have a set of several people of both sexes willing to do it, I should pick someone that’s strong enough independent of that person’s sex. To automatically reject a woman would be sexist because she may be strong enough to do it even if statistically an average woman may not be able to; similarly, to automatically choose a man would be sexist because he may not be strong enough even if statistically an average man could. All that statistic tells me is how likely I am to have someone able to do it, it doesn’t tell me the reality of the choices I’m faced with, and it’s the very definition of sexism to come to a conclusion about a person based just on their sex, even if that conclusion is based on some sort of real statistic. So really, even if you can meaningfully say that blacks aren’t as smart as whites… so what? It’s one thing if you’re talking about a difference in a way that can be useful in helping people, like I believe some racial groups are at higher risk of heart disease, so it can save lives to do an extra screening on groups that are identified as being at risk. But when you’re talking about intelligence, and just saying one group is dumber than another, how is that really meaningfully useful other than at an individual level where coming to a conclusion that someone is dumber just because of their race is, by definition, racist. So, don’t you see that without knowing what your motivation is behind why you’re so interested in it, why it comes off as being motivated by racism and why so many people are offended by it? And it’s only made worse that the arguments for it aren’t nearly as convincing as you think they are. So, maybe you can illuminate us on your motivation behind these discussions? ---
**Author:** ![New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/9d8465/32.png) [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Deal_Democrat)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/182 "2012-05-31T18:16:14Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > You are poorly informed, as I showed in post #160. You’re basing your claims on false information that you repeat over and over again. Post #160 made this claim that is preposterously untrue: > [@iiandyiiii](#): > > in many technologies, like iron smelting, forging steel, and brick architecture, some black African populations were way ahead of Asians and Europeans). What is false about this information? SAT scores from 1990-91 to 2009-2010: > **[Fast Facts: SAT scores (171)](https://nces.ed.gov/fastfacts/display.asp?id=171)** > > The NCES Fast Facts Tool provides quick answers to many education questions (National Center for Education Statistics). Get answers on Early Childhood Education, Elementary and Secondary Education and Higher Education here. Black and white murder rates: [http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/homicide/race.cfm](http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/homicide/race.cfm) International school performance - predominantly black countries are not listed, but the only countries that outperform the U.S. have populations that are nearly all white or all Oriental: > **[Who's No. 1? Finland, Japan and Korea, Says OECD Education Study - Site...](https://siteselection.com/ssinsider/snapshot/sf011210.htm)** > > Who's No. 1? Finland, Japan and Korea, Says OECD Education Study International murder rates: > **[List of countries by intentional homicide rate](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate)** > > The list of countries by homicide rate is derived from United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime (UNODC) data, and is expressed in number of deaths per 100,000 population per year. For example, a homicide rate of 30 out of 100,000 is presented in the table as "30", and corresponds to 0.03% of the population dying by homicide. The reliability of underlying national murder rate data may vary. Only UNODC-vetted data is used in the main table to maintain consistency. In some cases, i Homicide rates ... ---
**Author:** ![New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/9d8465/32.png) [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Deal_Democrat)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/183 "2012-05-31T18:21:25Z")
> [@Blaster\_Master](#): > > Here’s what I don’t get. Let’s assume, for the sake of discussion, that we can meaningfully determine some set of races and we can determine some sort of meaningful statistics about how they perform on some sorts of standardized tests in various types of abilities and that there are some differences. I’m not sure what sort of conclusions we’re supposed to draw from it. > > For instance, say race X scores a few IQ points higher than race Y on average. What conclusions do we draw from that? If we try to cause that there’s a causal relationship there that gives race X an advantage or race Y a disadvantage, I don’t think we can say that statistically since there are countless other variables involved with race that are not statistically independent, particularly culture and socioeconomic pressures. So maybe it’s a combination of things. > > But let’s take it a step further, let’s even say that we can control for all of those other variables and can say that there actually is some sort of meaningful difference between races, even if it’s slight… so what? Are we supposed to treat individuals of one race differently because of that? Are we supposed to create social programs or policies to account for these differences? > > Let’s compare it to sex, where there absolutely is a genetic basis for the differences in the sexes. For instance, on average, a man is stronger than a woman… so what? If I have a task that needs to get done that requires a certain amount of strength and I have a set of several people of both sexes willing to do it, I should pick someone that’s strong enough independent of that person’s sex. To automatically reject a woman would be sexist because she may be strong enough to do it even if statistically an average woman may not be able to; similarly, to automatically choose a man would be sexist because he may not be strong enough even if statistically an average man could. All that statistic tells me is how likely I am to have someone able to do it, it doesn’t tell me the reality of the choices I’m faced with, and it’s the very definition of sexism to come to a conclusion about a person based just on their sex, even if that conclusion is based on some sort of real statistic. > > So really, even if you can meaningfully say that blacks aren’t as smart as whites… so what? It’s one thing if you’re talking about a difference in a way that can be useful in helping people, like I believe some racial groups are at higher risk of heart disease, so it can save lives to do an extra screening on groups that are identified as being at risk. But when you’re talking about intelligence, and just saying one group is dumber than another, how is that really meaningfully useful other than at an individual level where coming to a conclusion that someone is dumber just because of their race is, by definition, racist. So, don’t you see that without knowing what your motivation is behind why you’re so interested in it, why it comes off as being motivated by racism and why so many people are offended by it? And it’s only made worse that the arguments for it aren’t nearly as convincing as you think they are. > > So, maybe you can illuminate us on your motivation behind these discussions? I do not think that blacks should be discriminated against. I do not think they should be discriminated in favor of. ---
**Author:** ![drew870mitchell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drew870mitchell/32/3946_2.png) [@drew870mitchell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drew870mitchell)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/184 "2012-05-31T18:22:53Z")
I don’t know what I expected. > [@brazil84](#): > > I’m not sure what you mean by “inferior,” but assuming you mean differences in intelligence, You know damn well what I meant by “inferior,” but you know that that’s negative language that had to be discarded after the civil rights movement, so you started with that. Don’t run away from your position. It makes you look like a coward, especially when the next thing you do is re-assert your claim that different races have different intelligence, with not even any correction or nuance. > [@brazil84](#): > > for the most part it was my learning how to think critically, i.e. learning how to think rationally about issues without letting my own wishes and emotions color my judgment. > > As I learned how to think critically, it became clear that the ridiculous explanations I had been taught for the various racial gaps were just that – ridiculous. You should also know that this is deeply unsatisfying. “I took my position when I learned how to think right.” Please read my questions again and try to speak in more specific terms. You should be able to explain any number of things you read, thoughts you had, maybe places you visited. I’m so nice and bored that I’ll give you an example: I subscribe to the big bang theory. I grew up in a small town in the South, so we didn’t really cover it at all in school, but my church also wasn’t inerrant Word so we didn’t pay much attention to Genesis either. I just got the very basic gist of each creation story trickled down through friends and probably media. When I was a kid, for my birthday, my parents bought me a telescope. I didn’t have enough attention span for finding stars unaided, so at Christmas, I got some stargazing books to help. In 4th grade I checked out a book from my library about astronomical structures like galaxies and black holes which really sparked my interest in space, and I started reading about astronauts, and keeping up with stuff like meteor showers, eclipses, etc. On a recommendation in 11th grade I read “The First Three Minutes” by Steven Weinberg, which recounts that cosmology in plain English with a little history of the field mixed in. It (plus probably some outside reading) gave a convincing account of the beginning of the universe _including_ certain experiments and discoveries which led us to that account, for example, the cosmic microwave background. That was when I “bought in” to the Big Bang. That’s what I am looking for, **brazil84** - how you got interested in racial theories, what your background was, and what led you to where you are today. You actually bothered to reply, so I’ll do you the same: > [@brazil84](#): > > Now I have a couple questions for you: > > First, do you believe in the egalitarian hypothesis? > > Second, if the egalitarian hypothesis were false to a small but significant extent, how would the world be different from the way it is today? > > Third, would you rather live in a world where the egalitarian hypothesis were true or false? [ol] [li]I’ve never heard that term before, but the way you described it elsewhere in the thread, yes. I have never been convinced of a large group-scale link between genetics and intelligence.[/li][li]It’s possible that it wouldn’t be different at all, because you could conflate with the results of colonialism, poverty, and inequality. If it was false, I think the racial stratification would be much worse than it is now by social forces alone.[/li][li]True. I grew up in the detritus of a society where legal discrimination was pervasive. The way it stunted individuals in the oppressed caste is well-documented, but it turned many in the oppressor caste irrationally hateful and narrow-minded. I would rather find out that all the cows I’ve been eating were sentient.[/li][/ol] About #2: Most importantly, if the EH was false, it would be a slam dunk for some up and coming geneticist to consistently classify races and prove a direct link between their different genes and intelligence, get it peer reviewed, and get it published in a respectable academic journal. There’s no indication that the scientific community is too broken to accept something with proof behind it. The big bang theory itself caused a lot of resistance, because it overturned a prior steady-state universe model, but the evidence accumulated, and then people followed. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/185 "2012-05-31T18:26:19Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > Just because you dislike my conclusions does not mean that they are illogical. Observed fact, therefore genetics is not good science. Social program doesn’t produce meaningful effects, therefore genetics is not good science. Genetic explanation in one context, therefore genetic explanation in a wildly different one and absent any supporting evidence is not good science, not good logic, it’s barely fucking coherent. As for the arguments you made in the other thread, and my debunking thereof which you’ve conveniently ignored, they’re just as ill-informed, badly conceived, poorly thought through and just… just overwhelmingly bad. Terrible, in fact. You are not a misunderstood genius. You are not a persecuted truth teller. You are not a gagged prophet. We are not “afraid” to agree with your conclusions. They simply make no sense, internally or externally. But I have a compelling theory to explain that. You, sir, are an idiot. A walking, talking, singing (but not chewing gum at the same time) demonstration and exemplar of the Dunning-Kruger effect. Literally lacking the mental tools to even realize how broken your “arguments” are, the tools to plumb the depths of your dim bulbosity, the means to assess the breadth of your prejudices, or even the self-awareness to acknowledge your own wilful ignorance. So you kinda suck, dude. But there is hope yet, for negros and orientals and caucasians everywhere ! Because you’ll die soon enough. Alone. Unloved. Unmourned. And the whole world will rejoice at the dramatic, precipitous increase of the average IQ. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/186 "2012-05-31T18:27:53Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > Post #160 made this claim that is preposterously untrue: WRONG. I’ll repeat what I posted in one of the GD threads: The Bura culture (in 1500 BC), [around modern-day Niger](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_industry#Indigenous_South_of_the_Saharan_Africa), was one of the first cultures on Earth to have an iron-smelting industry. Kush, a black sub-Saharan African kingdom, [conquered and ruled mighty Egypt for a hundred years](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-fifth_Dynasty_of_Egypt). The [Haya people](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haya_people)of Tanzania were the first to forge carbon steel, centuries before Europe. Nubians developed more advanced brick and quartzite buildings than Egypt. Ancient Nigerians developed some of the earliest canoes more than 8000 years ago. You’re simply ignoring information, like the achievements of the remarkable Haya people, that doesn’t mesh with your views. That’s not science. Your views came first, then you tried to find information to support them. ---
**Author:** ![Gagundathar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gagundathar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gagundathar)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/187 "2012-05-31T18:32:11Z")
**New Deal Democrat** , in failing to provide any substantiation of your expertise in statistics, and based upon your obvious inability to understand the subject at hand, I find that it is very easy to merely dismiss your ravings as the result of a delusional belief in the superiority of your own ‘race’. I therefore must categorize you as a racist asshole who should be socially ostracized. Since the stocks, the pillory and the late unlamented pranger are considered by most cultures to be cruel and unusual punishment, I suggest that being pitted here is the best method of heaping opprobrium upon your virtual head. May you reap the harvest of your hatred. ---
**Author:** ![New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/9d8465/32.png) [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Deal_Democrat)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/188 "2012-05-31T18:36:45Z")
> [@Gagundathar](#): > > **New Deal Democrat** , in failing to provide any substantiation of your expertise in statistics, and based upon your obvious inability to understand the subject at hand, I find that it is very easy to merely dismiss your ravings as the result of a delusional belief in the superiority of your own ‘race’. I therefore must categorize you as a racist asshole who should be socially ostracized. Since the stocks, the pillory and the late unlamented pranger are considered by most cultures to be cruel and unusual punishment, I suggest that being pitted here is the best method of heaping opprobrium upon your virtual head. > > May you reap the harvest of your hatred. An Appeal to Authority is a fallacy with the following form: Person A is (claimed to be) an authority on subject S. Person A makes claim C about subject S. Therefore, C is true. This fallacy is committed when the person in question is not a legitimate authority on the subject. More formally, if person A is not qualified to make reliable claims in subject S, then the argument will be fallacious. This sort of reasoning is fallacious when the person in question is not an expert. In such cases the reasoning is flawed because the fact that an unqualified person makes a claim does not provide any justification for the claim. The claim could be true, but the fact that an unqualified person made the claim does not provide any rational reason to accept the claim as true. When a person falls prey to this fallacy, they are accepting a claim as true without there being adequate evidence to do so. [http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-authority.html](http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-authority.html) I provide evidence for my claims. You seem to want me to think you are a statistician, but you give no evidence of being one. You say that I am unable to “to understand the subject at hand,” but you do not explain how I am not. Then you end by becoming emotional and abusive. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/189 "2012-05-31T18:43:09Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > An Appeal to Authority is a fallacy with the following form: > > Person A is (claimed to be) an authority on subject S. > Person A makes claim C about subject S. > Therefore, C is true. > This fallacy is committed when the person in question is not a legitimate authority on the subject. More formally, if person A is not qualified to make reliable claims in subject S, then the argument will be fallacious. > > This sort of reasoning is fallacious when the person in question is not an expert. In such cases the reasoning is flawed because the fact that an unqualified person makes a claim does not provide any justification for the claim. The claim could be true, but the fact that an unqualified person made the claim does not provide any rational reason to accept the claim as true. > > When a person falls prey to this fallacy, they are accepting a claim as true without there being adequate evidence to do so. > [http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-authority.html](http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-authority.html) > > I provide evidence for my claims. You seem to want me to think you are a statistician, but you give no evidence of being one. Misrepresenting the evidence is how you got here, affirming that you got it right when even many researchers report that their research should not be used for stupid ideas like yours does demonstrate something alright, you are not an expert, and you continue to misrepresent the research you cite, \*\*Gagundathar \*\*and many others are correct about you. ---
**Author:** ![New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/9d8465/32.png) [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Deal_Democrat)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/190 "2012-05-31T18:54:28Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > WRONG. I’ll repeat what I posted in one of the GD threads: The Bura culture (in 1500 BC), [around modern-day Niger](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_industry#Indigenous_South_of_the_Saharan_Africa), was one of the first cultures on Earth to have an iron-smelting industry. Kush, a black sub-Saharan African kingdom, [conquered and ruled mighty Egypt for a hundred years](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-fifth_Dynasty_of_Egypt). The [Haya people](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haya_people)of Tanzania were the first to forge carbon steel, centuries before Europe. Nubians developed more advanced brick and quartzite buildings than Egypt. Ancient Nigerians developed some of the earliest canoes more than 8000 years ago. > > You’re simply ignoring information, like the achievements of the remarkable Haya people, that doesn’t mesh with your views. That’s not science. Your views came first, then you tried to find information to support them. This is what I got from your first link: Inhabitants at Termit, in eastern Niger became the first iron smelting people in West Africa and among the first in the world around 1500 BC. > **[Ferrous metallurgy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_industry#Indigenous_South_of_the_Saharan_Africa)** > > Ferrous metallurgy is the metallurgy of iron and its alloys. The earliest surviving prehistoric iron artifacts, from the 4th millennium BC in Egypt, were made from meteoritic iron-nickel. It is not known when or where the smelting of iron from ores began, but by the end of the 2nd millennium BC iron was being produced from iron ores in the region from Greece to India,\[page needed\] The use of wrought iron (worked iron) was known by the 1st millennium BC, and its spread defi By the 4th century BC s... Everything else I have read about the beginning of the iron age agrees with this: Modern archaeological evidence identifies the start of iron production as taking place in Anatolia around 1200 BC… Sub-Saharan Africa has produced very early instances of carbon steel found to be in production around 2000 years before present. > **[Iron Age](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_Age)** > > The Iron Age (c. 1200 – c. 550 BC) is the final epoch of the three historical Metal Ages, after the Chalcolithic and Bronze Age. It has also been considered as the final age of the three-age division starting with prehistory (before recorded history) and progressing to protohistory (before written history). In this usage, it is preceded by the Stone Age (subdivided into the Paleolithic, Mesolithic and Neolithic) and Bronze Age. These concepts originated for describing Iron Age Europe and the a “years before present” means “years ago.” What I have read is that the Bantu learned the use of iron from the Nubians about 500 BC, who learned it from Egypt. ---
**Author:** ![New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/9d8465/32.png) [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Deal_Democrat)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/191 "2012-05-31T18:57:03Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > Misrepresenting the evidence is how you got here, affirming that you got it right when even many researchers report that their research should not be used for stupid ideas like yours does demonstrate something alright, you are not an expert, and you continue to misrepresent the research you cite, \*\*Gagundathar \*\*and many others are correct about you. “Gagundather and many others” do not do much but should insults at me. Now, how do I misrepresent the evidence?" ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/192 "2012-05-31T18:59:35Z")
N/M ---
**Author:** ![New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/9d8465/32.png) [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Deal_Democrat)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/193 "2012-05-31T19:00:19Z")
> [@Gagundathar](#): > > Oh, and since we are in the Pit (a place where I rarely post) may I also suggest you kindly go fuck yourself. The 21st century has no need for atavistic assholes like you. The 21st century has need of people who recognize facts and draw logical conclusions from them. ---
**Author:** ![New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/9d8465/32.png) [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Deal_Democrat)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/194 "2012-05-31T19:01:36Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > You _do_ realize the two statements are not contradictory, don’t you? Still feeling around for the bottom, here… If iron age technology began 1200 BC in Anatolia, it did not begin earlier in sub Saharan Africa. ---
**Author:** ![New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/9d8465/32.png) [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Deal_Democrat)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/195 "2012-05-31T19:05:47Z")
> [@Gagundathar](#): > > But, I am quite aware that presenting contrary and scientifically supported ideas to your chosen set of beliefs will only result in your dismissal of such. Presenting scientifically supported ideas that are contrary to my beliefs would mean presenting evidence that blacks behave and perform as well as well as whites. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/196 "2012-05-31T19:08:40Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > “Gagundather and many others” do not do much but should insults at me. > > Now, how do I misrepresent the evidence?" By claiming that means it’s genetic. Again, no one has a problem with the idea that there are differences, just that they are inherent, built into the genetics. We all believe they are social and economic, and we’ve provided citations. Again, something is blinding you to this obvious conclusion. You are a smart guy, but for some reason you seem unable to let this go. And racism is one of those things people are generally blind to, since no one wants to admit to themselves that they are a racist. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/197 "2012-05-31T19:10:19Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > Presenting scientifically supported ideas that are contrary to my beliefs would mean presenting evidence that blacks behave and perform as well as well as whites. We have a black man as president of the country. Have \*you \*ever been president of the country? I don’t think so. Mods – close this fucker up! ---
**Author:** ![New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/9d8465/32.png) [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/New_Deal_Democrat)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/198 "2012-05-31T19:11:18Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > By claiming that means it’s genetic. Again, no one has a problem with the idea that there are differences, just that they are inherent, built into the genetics. We all believe they are social and economic, and we’ve provided citations. > > Again, something is blinding you to this obvious conclusion. You are a smart guy, but for some reason you seem unable to let this go. > > And racism is one of those things people are generally blind to, since no one wants to admit to themselves that they are a racist. As I have pointed out several times before, if the differences were environmental they would be more flexible. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/199 "2012-05-31T19:11:30Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > “Gagundather and many others” do not do much but should insults at me. > > Now, how do I misrepresent the evidence?" Like if we did not had this conversation before, must be your memory genes that continually fail. As this is the pit, let me remind you that I found many times that researchers in the cites many times pointed out that they do not support your “solutions” or using their research in the ways you claim, mostly it is applicable to specific medical issues and not intelligence. Continuing to “forget” about those details are indeed showing all that besides misrepresenting the researchers you do indeed think that many forget how stupid you showed to be just recently. [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=602928&page=10](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=602928&page=10) Starting on post #454 my point still stands, " **where are your cites showing the scientists you linked supporting your solutions or verdicts**? Where are the organizations like the Hoover Institute supporting your solutions based on your ideas? Your voices are silent, and not only because of the facts, but because you clearly are so pathetic that you are not even capable of noticing how unlikely is that the people in power would give you even the time of the day." ---
**Author:** ![Who\_me\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/958977/32.png) [@Who\_me\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Who_me_1)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2012, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489/200 "2012-05-31T19:23:04Z")
> [@New\_Deal\_Democrat](#): > > The 21st century has need of people who recognize facts and draw logical conclusions from them. Can you point one out? It sure ain’t you. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-bigoted-asshole-omnibus-thread/623489.md?page=11)