# SDMB Dynasty Fantasy Football League (recruiting) **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 20, 2009, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086 "2009-08-20T16:08:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2009, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/41 "2009-08-25T18:08:57Z")
Well, we’ve got 10 people in the league now. I’m not sure what Justin Bailey is doing, but he hasn’t responded in a while. If he does join us, we’d need to recruit 1 more person to round us out to 12, so recruiting is still open. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2009, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/42 "2009-08-25T18:21:39Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > Well, we’ve got 10 people in the league now. I’m not sure what Justin Bailey is doing, but he hasn’t responded in a while. Sorry. I’m in, I just kept forgetting to go into Yahoo and sign up. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2009, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/43 "2009-08-25T18:35:32Z")
I asked back in post 3 if you wanted to try to work out some mutually agreeable draft date. Would you rather just pre-rank? I’m kind of hesistant about it because auto-draft teams are lame but if you’ll make a legitimate effort to personalize your roster (and it’s a big job, being such a deep league), combined with your posting/FF history, I’m cool with it. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2009, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/44 "2009-08-25T19:08:19Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > I asked back in post 3 if you wanted to try to work out some mutually agreeable draft date. Would you rather just pre-rank? I’m kind of hesistant about it because auto-draft teams are lame but if you’ll make a legitimate effort to personalize your roster (and it’s a big job, being such a deep league), combined with your posting/FF history, I’m cool with it. Pre-ranking is definitely better for me with the dates we have to work with. Between classes and a bunch of family commitments, my social calendar is very full that week. Besides, I was never one much for the draft day. I’ve always preferred pre-ranking. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2009, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/45 "2009-08-25T19:12:28Z")
Alright, as long as you’re willing to as I said give your team a significant amount of personalization (ie you don’t have to rank every player in the draft, but put your preferred sleepers a bit before where you expect them to go, etc… don’t just rank your top 20 or something) I’m cool with it. ---
**Author:** ![VarlosZ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d78d45/32.png) [@VarlosZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VarlosZ)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2009, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/46 "2009-08-25T22:04:51Z")
How do we feel about draft order for the inaugural draft? I’m of the firm opinion that a standard serpentine draft yields a not-insignificant advantage to the teams at the front of Round 1. There are some fairly simple ways to address this (check out the table in the middle of [this page](http://www.dynastyleaguefootball.com/hq/workshop02.php)). I think my preferred way would be to reverse the draft order after the first 2 Rounds, then go with a straight serpentine from there (so the team that picks last in Round 1 would pick first in Rounds 2, 3, 5, 7, 9, etc.). ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2009, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/47 "2009-08-26T00:37:29Z")
I proposed an idea in the general discussion thread of simply having it opposite order of the first round the rest of the way ie: A B C D D C B A D C B A It’s easy to implement - you just order it DCBA in the yahoo options, but set a special exemption for the first round where you manually reverse the order. Then again, serpentine may be better. In this case, we’d be looking at one order for round 1 and then the opposite order for the next 24(+/-) rounds. instead of the next 14. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2009, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/48 "2009-08-26T02:18:59Z")
> [@](#): > > (check out the table in the middle of [this page](http://www.dynastyleaguefootball.com/hq/workshop02.php)) Great page! Looks like they did exactly what I did when making the fantasy draft pick value chart. Love that calculator. Since I have all those values in a database already, you guys let me know if you want me to play around with the numbers to come up with a balanced draft order. Keep in mind that the values stop about halfway through our draft, but the major value-added picks are pretty much in just the first half dozen or so rounds anyway. Reading that whole page, wow, Jimmy’s method for determining draft order is far superior to the one they proposed. At least IMO. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2009, 7:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/49 "2009-08-26T07:27:45Z")
I just made a custom pre-ranking for reference later. Yahoo’s tool is efficient enough - it’s not as much work as I thought to rank 200 players. ---
**Author:** ![VarlosZ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d78d45/32.png) [@VarlosZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VarlosZ)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2009, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/50 "2009-08-26T20:50:55Z")
> [@EllisDee](#): > > Love that calculator. Since I have all those values in a database already, you guys let me know if you want me to play around with the numbers to come up with a balanced draft order. Since you offered, what would the numbers from **Beef** ’s proposed draft order looked like if you were to add them to that table (assuming a 16 Round draft)? ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2009, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/51 "2009-08-26T20:56:33Z")
I’m finally in as The Gusterrhoids. Looking forward to the season. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2009, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/52 "2009-08-26T21:01:00Z")
Personally I’ve always liked the serpentine draft concept and I’ll volunteer for the last pick if necessary. ---
**Author:** ![ministryman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f6c823/32.png) [@ministryman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ministryman)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2009, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/53 "2009-08-26T21:51:56Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > A dynasty fantasy football league is a league where players retain their roster from year to year, and the annual draft is only to acquire rookie players. Rosters are typically large, with a deep bench. > > You really get a feeling of connection to your team, since you can keep all the same players. You also “develop” talent in a sense - your choices now will grow to become your future starters. The draft strategy changes - older, productive players are still valuable but less so. You have to think in the long term. You hunt for gems, young starters, future stars. Because the avenues you have for improving your team are relatively limited from year to year, trading becomes a bigger factor. > > We’ve got several SDMB leagues where most of the same people stay around for years, so I think we can get the right people together to have an enjoyable, long term league. > > You don’t have to be a great fantasy football player to join, but I want everyone to give a legitimate attempt at playing from year to year. If you’ve never tried FF before and you don’t know if you’ll like it, this league isn’t for you. If you tend to get bored in midseason and forget about your leagues, same deal. Replacing owners will be difficult because I’m not sure how many people would be anxious to inherit someone else’s team. > > We had a [thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=527808) discussing the various ups and downs of dynasty leagues, proposed alternate systems, etc. But there didn’t seem to be a strong consensus behind any alternate ideas, so I’m proposing we go ahead with our original idea of a dynasty league. > > Our draft will be held on Wednesday, Sep 9. The time is currently set for 9pm EST. We have some flexibility in timing, but not really on the date - it has to be after the Sep 5 final cuts because we’re having a very deep league, the 5th-6th are a holiday weekend, and the 7th-8th already have drafts for other SDMB leagues. The season starts on 9/10. So if you can’t make the draft at that time, please do not sign up. > > We’re aiming for 12 people, but we could accomodate a different number depending on demand. We’ll be playing on yahoo, unless there are enough people who prefer somewhere else. > > Players who I know to be reliable from year to year will get preference over people I don’t know, if we have more recruits than openings. > > If you’re interested, please post here. I’ll send out PMs with information with joining information on the league. If you still have room, I’d like to join. I’ve been on Yahoo Fantasy Football since its inception, and I like the idea of the Dynasty League ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [August 26, 2009, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/54 "2009-08-26T23:00:36Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Personally I’ve always liked the serpentine draft concept and I’ll volunteer for the last pick if necessary. Can I have second last pick if we do serpentine? Unless you want to give me the first overall pick. I’m cool with that too. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/55 "2009-08-27T00:06:56Z")
> [@VarlosZ](#): > > Since you offered, what would the numbers from **Beef** ’s proposed draft order looked like if you were to add them to that table (assuming a 16 Round draft)? My pleasure. I’ll go through the thread and calculate the total points for each position given all proposed scenarios assuming a 12-team league. This will entail an hour or so of programming in order to automate it, so adding additional ideas won’t impact the workload. If anyone has alternate proposals, by all means post them so I can run them all in one shot. I will, of course, include a standard serpentine draft as the control group. ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/56 "2009-08-27T01:00:43Z")
Like the actual leaked NFL draft value chart, it’s no objective measure of value, so while it’s a probably a decent tool to get a rough idea, we shouldn’t become overly reliant on it. I do wonder if the value of picks changes in a dynasty league. Later picks certainly gain value (by the chart we’ve been using, every pick over 150 or so has a value of 0 IIRC). ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/57 "2009-08-27T01:06:19Z")
If the default assumption is that the first pick in a serpentine draft is best, and each successive pick becomes worse, I wonder if there’s some other way to add value to later picks? Let’s say we have a 20-man roster (never done a dynasty league before so I don’t know if that’s accurate or what). Teams with picks 1-3 get to keep 8 players for the next season. 4-6 get to keep 9, 7-9 get to keep 10, and 10-12 get to keep 11. Does that sound reasonable? ---
**Author:** ![SenorBeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senorbeef/32/2220_2.png) [@SenorBeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SenorBeef)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/58 "2009-08-27T01:13:44Z")
I’m not enthusiastic about implementing a variable length keeper rule after all that discussion we had and finally settling on a straight dynasty league. If it turns out that my proposal is too disadvantageous towards the guys who draft first in the first round, then we could maybe serpentine in roujnds 1-4 instead of 1-2 in my proposal and reverse the order and straight draft from 5 till the end of the draft rather than from 3 till the end of the draft. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/59 "2009-08-27T01:22:54Z")
Maybe we should just go with an auction then? ---
**Author:** ![Stringer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eb8c5e/32.png) [@Stringer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stringer)\ **Post date:** [August 27, 2009, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086/60 "2009-08-27T01:24:31Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > If the default assumption is that the first pick in a serpentine draft is best, and each successive pick becomes worse, I wonder if there’s some other way to add value to later picks? > > Let’s say we have a 20-man roster (never done a dynasty league before so I don’t know if that’s accurate or what). > > Teams with picks 1-3 get to keep 8 players for the next season. 4-6 get to keep 9, 7-9 get to keep 10, and 10-12 get to keep 11. Does that sound reasonable? The way you add value to later picks is in the nature of serpentine drafting. You get two top 15 picks if you’re at the end of the round. Dynasty means you keep everyone. There is so much turnover in the top rounds from year to year so I doubt we have an issue with parity. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-dynasty-fantasy-football-league-recruiting/507086.md?page=4)