# \*\*\* SDMB Live coverage, VP Debate. 10/04/2016 \*\*\* **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 1, 2016, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354 "2016-10-01T13:33:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![Anny\_Middon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bc79bd/32.png) [@Anny\_Middon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anny_Middon)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2016, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/281 "2016-10-05T23:11:11Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > My reaction to “you’ve whipped out that Mexican thing again” is that it’s offensive because it’s dismissive of the many people appalled by Trump’s ‘announcement/rapists’ and "Judge Curiel’ remarks. The phrase conveys contempt for the concept that Trump was out of line, and implicitly, for the people who believe he was out of line. Such contempt is, at best, insensitive. +1 But adding – maybe my mind is in the gutter, but whenever someone accuses a man of whipping out a thing, I think they’re talking about him whipping out his dick. Granted, Kaine isn’t Mexican (so his dick can’t be), but he speaks fluent Spanish so maybe Pence thinks he’s part Mexican. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/282 "2016-10-06T00:40:16Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > My reaction to “you’ve whipped out that Mexican thing again” is that it’s offensive because it’s dismissive of the many people appalled by Trump’s ‘announcement/rapists’ and "Judge Curiel’ remarks. The phrase conveys contempt for the concept that Trump was out of line, and implicitly, for the people who believe he was out of line. Such contempt is, at best, insensitive. And, after all the times Pence ran away from Trump with zip that would make the Flash look like Snail-Man, _this_ is the point on which he draws the line and defends him? ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/283 "2016-10-06T01:13:35Z")
> [@squidfood](#): > > One of the first comments in this very thread was: “Over/under on when Kaine bursts into Spanish, just because he can? I say less than five minutes.” And of course he didn’t, so, uh, I guess Nostradamus I ain’t. > [@](#): > > I think Pence prepared “that Mexican thing” as a chide to Kaine using Spanish as his only gimmick, though the place Pence found to stick it in was not-the-right-context cringey. Use it or lose it, or something like that. I do wish these mooks would stop trying so hard to come up with just the right catchphrase, as if they were Arnold Schwarzenegger in _Commando_. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/284 "2016-10-06T01:23:38Z")
> [@Steve\_MB](#): > > And, after all the times Pence ran away from Trump with zip that would make the Flash look like Snail-Man, _this_ is the point on which he draws the line and defends him? The Clinton folks would be smart to emphasize (in ads and in what Hillary and surrogates say) that Pence did exactly as you observed: _ran away from Trump_. Failed to defend or back Trump in, what, six (or more?) challenges. Failed to be _loyal_…again and again and again and again and again and again (etc.). Word is, that’s something Trump doesn’t care much for. It should be rubbed in his face as often as humanly possible. > [@Anny\_Middon](#): > > +1 > But adding – maybe my mind is in the gutter, but whenever someone accuses a man of whipping out a thing, I think they’re talking about him whipping out his dick. > Granted, Kaine isn’t Mexican (so his dick can’t be), but he speaks fluent Spanish so maybe Pence thinks he’s part Mexican. Do men of the religious right even acknowledge that there \*is \*such a thing as a dick? I assumed they doublethink themselves into believing it’s all Ken Doll down there. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/285 "2016-10-06T01:52:41Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Romney tried the “OMG we have fewer ships now” crap in 2012. The ships are better now. We don’t need as many. Jeezus. And Obama at the time pointed that out[and retorted we also had fewer horses and bayonets](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GK3ORgw-h_4). (Besides, so does virtually everybody that counts) > [@Anny\_Middon](#): > > But adding – maybe my mind is in the gutter, but whenever someone accuses a man of whipping out a thing, I think they’re talking about him whipping out his dick. Maybe Barack missed a golden opportunity in 2009 to [start his inaugural speech with this immortal line](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EYlDbv7MqE8). ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/286 "2016-10-06T02:02:06Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > I do wish these mooks would stop trying so hard to come up with just the right catchphrase, as if they were Arnold Schwarzenegger in _Commando_. Eh, it’s why the debates happen in the first place, or at least one of them. These people aren’t there to give completely focused answers to specific questions with citations and appeals to relevant authorities. That’s called policy debating, and if you really get into it at a high level, it’s a very technical skill which demands a lot of time and effort per debate, and it simply isn’t worth it. If a politician comes to a debate with a box full of three-by-five cards with quals and crits and everything else, they’re a moron. They prepared for the wrong thing, and they’re likely to lose, and will deserve to. It’s a terrible way to convince people and it’s a terrible way to convey information. So the debates are less formalized (stylized?) and more about personalities and arguments, as distinct from deep analysis. You can’t do deep analysis in a ninety-minute format. What you can do is give enough facts and arguments to convince the more intelligent of the undecided to look more closely at your detailed platform, and get the kinds of jabs in that your side can use in ads after the debate. The best is to have them hang themselves, by forcing them into errors you can use against them, as happened here. Debates show personality. Personality is important. Trump’s personality, as revealed by the debate, is “semi-senile old codger who can’t be bothered to prepare for important events and can be baited into shooting his feet off up to the thigh”, which is something we basically knew already but is important to reinforce. Kaine is on the “yappy little dog” end of the spectrum, which is a bad thing for a middle-aged man, but he did get Pence to try to abandon his own campaign and whip out that idiotic thing he came up with, so it wasn’t a total loss. ---
**Author:** ![AnalogSignal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/analogsignal/32/1085_2.png) [@AnalogSignal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnalogSignal)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/287 "2016-10-06T02:33:18Z")
#ThatMexicanThing is gaining traction finally. I bet Hillary will use the phrase in the next debate. > **[\#ThatMexicanThing: Twitter anger at Mike Pence over debate comments](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-37561346)** > > Republican Governor Mike Pence upsets the Latin American community with his "you've whipped out that Mexican thing again" comment during a TV debate. > **['That Mexican Thing' Took on a Life of Its Own Online](https://time.com/4519044/vice-presidential-debate-mexican-thing/)** > > A phrase from Indiana Gov. Mike Pence at the debate. > **[Twitter's response to whipping out that #ThatMexicanThing](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/twitters-response-to-whipping-out-that-thatmexicanthing-vice-presidential-debate-mike-pence-tim-kaine/)** > > Trump wasn't the one under fire Tuesday night for making questionable comments about Mexicans, but his running mate, Gov. Mike Pence > **[Democrats Slam Pence for 'That Mexican Thing' Comments](https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/democrats-slam-pence-mexican-thing-comments/story?id=42600137)** ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/288 "2016-10-06T02:35:25Z")
> [@AnalogSignal](#): > > I bet Hillary will use the phrase in the next debate. She’ll try to associate Trump with something his running mate said? That’s underhanded. They’re in no way associated in any political context. Pence made that very clear. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/289 "2016-10-06T02:37:20Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Missed the debate; glad to read about it here. Did Pence’s gay rights, guns, abortion or tobacco views come up? Do you think Kaine attacked him effectively on them, if so? > [@Richard\_Parker](#): > > The only thing they really discussed on Pence’s hit list was Syrian refugees and abortion. > > I thought Kaine was effective on abortion, but he didn’t go after the crazy Pence stuff like requiring funerals for aborted fetuses. He just attacked the general idea of imposing religious morals on women, and Trump’s call for punishment of women. > > The refugee conversation was rushed and a wash, I think. Pence claimed that the court only ruled against him because there hadn’t been an attack by refugees yet, but that there will be. :rolleyes: > [@jsc1953](#): > > It felt to me that each candidate was there entirely as a surrogate for their running mate. The only time their personal views were expressed was on the question regarding conflicts between their faith and their job. > > Which, by the way, Kaine answered; Pence deflected (he talked about his faith but not about any conflict). > > And which also, by the way, was the only exchange where they didn’t talk over each other. > [@amarinth](#): > > That did come up later that night on The Daily Show. Thanks, all. ---
**Author:** ![AnalogSignal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/analogsignal/32/1085_2.png) [@AnalogSignal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnalogSignal)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/290 "2016-10-06T02:54:33Z")
> [@Derleth](#): > > They’re in no way associated in any political context. Pence made that very clear. > > 😉 Yes, we learned that Pence never heard any of the things Trump said. And Trump is so fixated on attacking Miss Universe, he doesn’t have time for Pence or studying up on NATO, nuclear proliferation, or anything more complicated than insulting people based on their appearance. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/291 "2016-10-06T03:04:02Z")
> [@AnalogSignal](#): > > Yes, we learned that Pence never heard any of the things Trump said. And Trump is so fixated on attacking Miss Universe, he doesn’t have time for Pence or studying up on NATO, nuclear proliferation, or anything more complicated than insulting people based on their appearance. I think you’ll agree that a key skill for any potential President is the ability to prioritize. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/292 "2016-10-06T03:53:42Z")
My take on that “whipping out the Big Mexican Thing” was that Pence was making a dick joke. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 4:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/293 "2016-10-06T04:32:41Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > I think you’ll agree that a key skill for any potential President is the ability to prioritize. Let’s go to the quarry and throw stuff down there I first read that as “I think you’ll agree that a key skill for any potential President is the ability to patronize.” 😛 ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/294 "2016-10-06T12:36:52Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > The conventional wisdom is that Kaine helped Clinton and Pence helped Pence. I subscribe to that theory. Pence is now the 2020 nominee, I can tell you right now. So do I. I think it’s pretty clear by now that virtually everyone on Trump’s campaign team is either a shameless mercenary or, like Pence, is in it for personal political gain. None of them believe in anything Trump is doing, except for the white supremacists, and none of them have even a shred of ethics. It’s quite the team, really. I wouldn’t be surprised if the wheels start coming off before the month is out. If there’s any justice in the world Pence’s feeble efforts to distance himself from Trump will just reveal him for the scheming opportunist that he is. ---
**Author:** ![SmartAlecCat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/67e7ee/32.png) [@SmartAlecCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAlecCat)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/295 "2016-10-06T13:25:59Z")
> [@Ukulele\_Ike](#): > > My take on that “whipping out the Big Mexican Thing” was that Pence was making a dick joke. [Excuse me while I whip this out](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HgRE6BPhN2I) ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2016, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354/296 "2016-10-06T20:58:09Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > “He’s not a polished politician, he doesn’t say what he means?” Yes Pence, that just killed your night. Yes!! I was getting tired of the shaking head “he never said that” and finally, Pence can’t do it any more – “look, he’s not a polished politician”. And there it is. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-live-coverage-vp-debate-10-04-2016/767354.md?page=14)