# Sdmb mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [October 30, 2008, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198 "2008-10-30T02:29:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 58
**Author:** ![Hal\_Briston](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9a28c/32.png) [@Hal\_Briston](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hal_Briston)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1141 "2008-11-17T15:07:37Z")
Back from the weekend, and surprise surprise, **ShadowFacts** is riding me (must be a Mafia game). Not much to use in my defense, except that his characterization of my “bandwagon” vote is crap. If I’d have been online the evening before I voted, I’d have voted then. [My reasoning for voting](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=10432938#post10432938) wasn’t not weak, it weren’t spurious, and I’ll stand by it all the way down. He was playing _way_ out of character, which can be a great scum indicator. To call it a “bandwagon” vote is maddening. **JSexton** made the statement that convinced me shortly after my workday ended. If he’d made it an hour earlier, we wouldn’t be having this conversation – I’d have been the second vote on him. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1142 "2008-11-17T15:33:54Z")
I want to get a vote out: **vote Zeriel** based on the voting patterns. I think **Squid** is on the right track here. With 3 out of 6 voters on **Zeriel** YesterDay, I think it’s likely scum were pushing **JSexton** for his benefit. With one more Day of data, I’ll be ready to do some number crunching, but for now, I think this informal look is good enough to vote on. By the way, does anyone want to hazard a guess on how many scum we have? With 23 players initially, 2 of them likely third parties, I think there’s probably 4 or 5 scum. ---
**Author:** ![ok11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8baadc/32.png) [@ok11](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ok11)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1143 "2008-11-17T15:37:38Z")
> [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](#): > > I’m not going to vote for the people with most votes, just because they have most votes. If I can’t see the case on them, I will leave my vote on a person I do find scummy, even if i’m the only one who seems to think that Your approach makes sense. However, I think that if you find someone scummier than the top vote getters, you should try to explain why you think so, and try to persuade others. If you don’t agree with the case against someone, try to point out its flaws. Town players have to work as a team, and if you’re off by yourself doing your own thing, it’s not as helpful. I’m still somewhat suspicious of you (see below), but for now I’ll move on **Unvote One And Only Wanderers** > [@Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](#): > > FWIW, I’d accept any day that you claim to be extended which runs over 144 hours to be a confirmation of your ability. The Day can’t last more than 144 hours. It says so in the rules. Also, **Santo** already said that his power doesn’t let him extend the Day beyond that limit. I don’t know whether you were being facetious, but I figured I’ll point it out just in case. * * * Right now, I’m fine with a **Zeriel** ban. What concerns me is that if he turns up town, it will almost inevitably lead to a **Hal** ban. And what if they are both town? On Day 1, all 3 of our top candidates were non-scum. If the same is true for Day 2, then scum wouldn’t care who got banned, and the weird vote patterns are just townies trying to figure out what to do. That’s why I reviewed posts by people who made one-off votes at the end of Day 2 (namely **OAOW** , who was voting for me, and **Total Lost** , who voted for **Zsofia** ), because I thought a scum would try to hide that way. If I had to pick between the two of them, I am more suspicious of **OAOW**. However, his ban won’t give us as much info as a **Zeriel** lynch, so **Ban Zeriel** I just hope that if he comes up town, we won’t simply vote **Hal** without any further analysis, because that might be playing right into the scum’s hand. I’m not saying **Hal** isn’t scum, but I just don’t want to see a lot of votes Tomorrow saying, “well, since **Zeriel** was town, ban **Hal**.” Otherwise, that ban won’t tell us anything about the alignment of people voting for **Hal**. * * * Going by official vote counts alone, here’s what I think **Zeriel** ’s alignment will tell us. If he’s town: The only unconfirmed voters for **NBC** are **Santo** and **Hal**. So it’s likely at least one of them is scum. > [@Pleonast](#): > > **NBC** : 6 (Santo Rugger, Hal Briston, Pedescribe, Zeriel, JSexton, Nanook o/t North Shore) It also means that either no scum voted for **Hal** , or that **ShadowFacts** is scum. > [@](#): > > **Hal Briston** : 3 (Oredigger, ShadowFacts, Zeriel) (Oredigger77 is a CM) If he’s scum: The only additional piece of info I get from the vote records is that it’s less likely that \*\* Boozahol Squid, P.I\*\* is scum. The reason I’m saying this is that on Day 1 there are so many potential targets for scum, it’s unlikely they’ll vote for each other right off the bat. However, I do realize that this type of reasoning is WIFOM. > [@Hawkeyeop](#): > > 1: Boozdio (Zeriel) ---
**Author:** ![Santo\_Rugger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Santo\_Rugger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Santo_Rugger)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1144 "2008-11-17T15:38:35Z")
> [@Pleonast](#): > > By the way, does anyone want to hazard a guess on how many scum we have? With 23 players initially, 2 of them likely third parties, I think there’s probably 4 or 5 scum. That makes sense. 5 if they’re all vanilla with possibly a Godfather type, 4 if they have more powers. ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1145 "2008-11-17T15:40:34Z")
Sorry, everyone. I got blasted with a wicked head cold yesterday afternoon that put me to bed last night without posting. I’m trying to slog through a couple hours of work before returning to bed. Hopefully the Day will last long enough for me to get back with a clear head, but don’t expect anything from me in the near term. My apologies, I realize this is a sucky thing to do given that I put myself front and center in the conversation toDay, but my brain is wrapped in a towel right now ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Santo\_Rugger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Santo\_Rugger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Santo_Rugger)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1146 "2008-11-17T15:42:39Z")
> [@Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](#): > > FWIW, I’d accept any day that you claim to be extended which runs over 144 hours to be a confirmation of your ability. Dude. Seriously. If you’re going to discuss my role, please, _please_ go back and read my posts pertaining to it. You’ve straight up called me a liar, and now you’re coming up with ways I confirm my role that I’ve explicitly stated I can’t do. Seriously, what gives? ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1147 "2008-11-17T15:43:32Z")
I think **ok11** has a very good point that if we ban either Zeriel or Hal, and they’re town, we’ll probably be doing some reflexive banning the next Day, which may or may not be very useful to us. There are few things less likely to produce information and less fun to play than a “lynch on rails” game. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1148 "2008-11-17T18:03:22Z")
> [@Oredigger77](#): > > I’m changing my definition of a lurker, again, I think there were enough voting deadlines yeaterDay to use not voting as a good definition. > > At the 48 hour deadline seven people had not voted based on the official count they were **Blam, Diggit, Fretful, Hal, JSexton, Kat, and Pleo**. I think it is safe to eliminate **Diggit** from this conversation. At 74 hours **Blam and Hal** did not have a vote in while **Zeriel** had unvoted without a replacement. At the end of the day **Blam** was the only person without a vote while **Pleo and Rapier** had unvoted. Something is up with **Blam** never voting even though he was posting in the game it is just too noticeable so I am going to go with number two on my lurky list. > > **Vote Hal Briston** > [@Oredigger77](#): > > I sure have missed a lot but I’m caught up just as I’m walking out the door. I think that both **Hal** and **Z** jumping at the chance to vote for **Jsexton’s** idea pinged me as looking to start a bandwagon. But once if fizzled they both bailed and tried to start one on **J**. I think the second one is a legitimate townie reaction but the first one bothers me. Before there was any information about who was trying to do what they were already out voting. > > I am also suspicious of **J** but I think he has given a good enough explanation to not be lynched toDay but I think he has eared a permanent number 2 spot on my scum roster. > > Noone vote for Nanook > > I still think there is something funky with his power and without more information I think we are safer eliminating him. > > Sorry to be all over the place but I’m happy with my vote on **Hal**. I should be around more tomorrow and will be posting more. These are my two posts about my case against **Hal**. There really isn’t much to it but then with these same two the pivotal roles in **Shadow’s** vote scenario from yesterDay, I think we’re headed in the right direction. Either one will be good for an informational lynch but I think **Hal** is a better lynch given that **Z** voted for him while **Hal** pushed **J** farther into the lead. ---
**Author:** ![Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/65b543/32.png) [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hero_From_Sector_7G)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1149 "2008-11-17T18:17:57Z")
> [@Total\_Lost](#): > > And the fos on Hal was then based on what? I’ve said it twice, **Hal** and **Zsofia** jumped on the **JSexton** bandwagon with pretty much no reason. **Hal** has been pinging me harder than **Zsofia** based on day one stuff. I felt three fingers was enough, as I didn’t feel it really contributed anything if I were to rank the entire population. As for my thinking, well, I am a bit new to this game and am trying to digest a lot of this. I feel the best way I can contribute to the game is by posting my thoughts, and naively I thought everyone else would be doing the same. I’m learning as we play that this might not be the best strategy. It seems like a lot of people are willing to lurk and hammer away at prominent posters without offering analysis of their own. At this point I’m honestly a little confused about how to hunt scum. Between this and reading hundreds of pages over at mafiascum I’m kinda worn out. Over there I’m trying to read games without knowing orientation and pick out the scum. Admittedly my success has been poor. So that’s where I’m coming from. ---
**Author:** ![Santo\_Rugger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Santo\_Rugger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Santo_Rugger)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1150 "2008-11-17T18:20:35Z")
> [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > Between this and reading hundreds of pages over at mafiascum I’m kinda worn out. **Over there** I’m trying to read games **without knowing orientation** and pick out the scum. Admittedly my success has been poor. How about over here? 😛 But seriously, try going to the last Day and finding out who the scum are _before_ you read one of the games. Some things you wouldn’t notice if you didn’t know the person had ulterior motives just jump out at you. ---
**Author:** ![Hal\_Briston](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9a28c/32.png) [@Hal\_Briston](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hal_Briston)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1151 "2008-11-17T18:36:48Z")
> [@Oredigger77](#): > > …while **Hal** pushed **J** farther into the lead. > [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > I’ve said it twice, **Hal** and **Zsofia** jumped on the **JSexton** bandwagon with pretty much no reason. For fucks sake, people, how is “He was A) distorting what I said, and B) acting like scumbusing was unheard of” _no reason_?? I’ll put [my voting post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=10432938#post10432938) again on tis page – it wasn’t a bandwagon vote, it wasn’t an OMGUS vote – it was a clear, simple, valid “I think you’re scum” vote, and all this digging for the “real” reason getting agravating as shit. I dread what’ll happen if (once work calms down and I can do a more thorough reread of today) I decide I find **Zeriel** to be the most suspicious. Won’t _that_ ruffle some nuts… ---
**Author:** ![Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/65b543/32.png) [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hero_From_Sector_7G)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1152 "2008-11-17T18:39:46Z")
Thanks **Santo** that is probably a better, if not more enjoyable, way to read other games. Funny how a normal conversational prepositional phrase can carry such heavy implications in this context. Thanks for not riding me on that. ---
**Author:** ![Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d9b06d/32.png) [@Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boozahol_Squid_P.I)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1153 "2008-11-17T19:22:21Z")
> [@Sandy Roger](#): > > Dude. Seriously. If you’re going to discuss my role, please, _please_ go back and read my posts pertaining to it. :smack: At this point, I’m forced into starting to make shit up for your role. By the bye, I’ll consider you confirmed if hard candy starts shooting out of my dog’s ass on any non-prime numbered night when the town outnumbers scum by exactly an 8:1 margin. ---
**Author:** ![ok11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8baadc/32.png) [@ok11](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ok11)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1154 "2008-11-17T19:25:27Z")
> [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > I felt three fingers was enough, as I didn’t feel it really contributed anything if I were to rank the entire population. We’re more than 48 hours into the game, so are you going turn one of your FOSs into a vote soon? I don’t mean to single you out. I just wanted to take this opportunity to say that I think only 11 players voted so far, and it would suck if Day 3 ended and we had such a short vote record. [QUOTE=Hero From Sector 7G] Between this and reading hundreds of pages over at mafiascum I’m kinda worn out. [/QUOTE] I feel your pain. I’ve been trying to read up on various roles lately, and it made me realize that what I’ve seen in games on this board is only the tip of the iceberg. I should have really done some outside research before I signed up to play. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1155 "2008-11-17T19:39:02Z")
> [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > I’ve said it twice, **Hal** and **Zsofia** jumped on the **JSexton** bandwagon with pretty much no reason. I don’t know about Hal - I didn’t like a lot of his back and forth with JSexton yesterDay. But as for me, I explained my reasoning several times. ---
**Author:** ![Oredigger77](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/oredigger77/32/3181_2.png) [@Oredigger77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oredigger77)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1156 "2008-11-17T19:52:45Z")
> [@Hal\_Briston](#): > > For fucks sake, people, how is “He was A) distorting what I said, and B) acting like scumbusing was unheard of” _no reason_?? Fair enough you came up with a valid reason for your vote, but that vote still put **J** further into the lead. But that doesn’t explain you waiting on your vote on Day 1 or your original vote for **OK**. Either way, it seams that in order to come up a reasonable explanation for the voting yesterDay either you or Z needs to go. I think that your actions haven’t been as weird individually as **Z** but the body of your work has more of an anti-town slant. I think that its more likely for scum to play the middle of the road game then to be in our faces like **Z** (not saying that he isn’t scum). So I think we’ll get the best information from your lynch. ---
**Author:** ![Santo\_Rugger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Santo\_Rugger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Santo_Rugger)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1157 "2008-11-17T20:06:02Z")
> [@Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](#): > > :smack: > At this point, I’m forced into starting to make shit up for your role. By the bye, I’ll consider you confirmed if hard candy starts shooting out of my dog’s ass on any non-prime numbered night when the town outnumbers scum by exactly an 8:1 margin. It’s 3PM EST. Do you know where your dog’s ass is? That was too funny, I almost feel bad about calling you out on it. Almost. ---
**Author:** ![Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/d9b06d/32.png) [@Boozahol\_Squid\_P.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boozahol_Squid_P.I)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1158 "2008-11-17T21:50:47Z")
> [@Santo\_Rugger](#): > > It’s 3PM EST. Do you know where your dog’s ass is? There’s a 12.5% chance it’s sitting in a pile of toffee. ---
**Author:** ![Total\_Lost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e56c9b/32.png) [@Total\_Lost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Total_Lost)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1159 "2008-11-17T22:25:01Z")
[quote=“Oredigger77, post:1156, topic:470198”] I think that your actions haven’t been as weird individually as **Z** but the body of your work has more of an anti-town slant. [QUOTE] I presume you mean Zeriel = Z and not Zsofia, but if I ask you nice would you put an extra letter aften the Z next time? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/65b543/32.png) [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hero_From_Sector_7G)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2008, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198/1160 "2008-11-17T23:27:18Z")
If I’m counting this right, **Hal** is leading with 4 (ShadowFacts, Zsofia, Oredigger, Zeriel) , tied with **Zeriel** also at 4 (Kat, Boozahol, Pleonast, Ok11) Compare that with yesterday’s vote JSexton : 7 (BS PI, Zsofia, Rapier42, Hal Briston, Pleonast, Nanook o/t North Shore, ok11) Zeriel : 6 (Kat, amrussell, JSexton, Hero from Sector 7G, Pedescrobe, Blaster Master) Hal Briston : 3 (Oredigger, ShadowFacts, Zeriel) If **Shadow** ’s earlier claim that **Hal** was being protected I am really curios to hear any views again on who is doing the protecting, especially in light of today’s votes. I just can’t see a pattern that will help us tomorrow. What I do see is a block of three votes on **Hal** that is the same as yesterday. These votes manifested themselves today as **Zeriel** also gained votes. This morning **Shadow** said nothing about how yesterday **Zeriel** had the same conditions as **Hal**. Watching a similar sequence of events unfold today has left me very uneasy about Shadow. Vote ShadowFacts – These 48 hours went by too quick and there wasn’t a whole lot of discussion, especially from some repeat offenders. I was sitting on my hands hoping to get a little more input from people but it doesn’t look like that is going to happen. These are the lowest participants in this thread by post count. 28 - Kat 25 - ShadowFacts 24 - Fretful Porpentine 20 - One And Only Wanderers Of those, OAOW is the only person to not even bothering to place a vote today. FOS: One and Only Wanderers I’m also really hoping to see everyone else put their votes in. We need that information, even if it doesn’t impact the lynch. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198.md?page=57) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-mafia/470198.md?page=59)