# SDMB Musical Lovers' Salon and Debating Society **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 23, 2004, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785 "2004-06-23T12:12:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![Draelin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ce73a5/32.png) [@Draelin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Draelin)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2005, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/221 "2005-04-27T14:40:38Z")
I’m kind of an on-again, off-again Society member (because sometimes I just don’t have time to hit the video store), so I’ll go along with anything. I don’t mind you being bossy. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2005, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/222 "2005-04-27T14:50:25Z")
Do I still get to write my OP? (see, I’m conscious and aware at this point; it just took a long time to wake me up 🙂 ). ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2005, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/223 "2005-04-27T14:53:43Z")
Oh, and yeah, if you have specific films you want to discuss, I’m all for having y’all make a master list. I do feel like it goes a bit slow… for those of us space cadets three weeks is more than ample time to watch a movie and then completely forget that we watched it to discuss it here. 🙂 But, maybe having the whole list at once, as you say, would help to facilitate shorter turn-around time between movies. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2005, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/224 "2005-04-27T14:57:08Z")
**Eonwe** – yes, you’re definitely on for doing the OP on _Fiddler on the Roof_ early next week. (I watched it Saturday as my own little shiksa nod to Passover.) I’m raising these issues now so we can decide which direction to go in after that. ---
**Author:** ![TwoTrouts](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a9adbd/32.png) [@TwoTrouts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TwoTrouts)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2005, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/225 "2005-04-27T15:19:43Z")
I bow to the more knowledgeable members and would like to see the list. Does it include _Seven Brides for Seven Brothers_? ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2005, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/226 "2005-04-27T15:27:38Z")
Hm, how did you guess? 😉_I_ voted for _Seven Brides for Seven Brothers_ (I think not as one of my top 15, but one of my next 15) – but just sent my most-recent ballot to **ArchiveGuy** last night, so we’re waiting for him to tabulate the results on that. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2005, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/227 "2005-04-27T15:27:55Z")
I vote for _Moulin Rouge!_ Hell, I’ll even write the OP and lead the discussion, even though I’m (comparably) unqualified to do such a thing (I’m not at all knowledgable in Broadway/musical traditions). ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2005, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/228 "2005-04-27T15:29:59Z")
> [@](#): > > My original vision of this group was that it be run pretty democratically – mostly because I’m naturally extremely bossy, so I tend to overcorrect when I think I’m headed in that direction. As we go along, though, it seems as though people aren’t necessarily all that interested in picking films (or maybe they’re just shy about writing OPs, who knows). As somebody who has moderated discussion groups (online and RL) for the past 10 years, one truth always comes to the forefront: _The group has to have a leader_, somebody willing and passionate enough about the subject to keep it going. Else it dies. ---
**Author:** ![Eureka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/74df32/32.png) [@Eureka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eureka)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2005, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/229 "2005-04-27T19:49:56Z")
Ever since **ArchiveGuy** commented on the lack of inspiration of some of the recent choices, I’ve been tempted to ask for at least a partial list of more inspired choices. I’m glad to see that this list has been compiled without my intervention. 3 weeks generally seems like a reasonable amount of time between musicals to me. If there is interest in moving things along faster, that’s fine too. My movie watching time is about to expand hugely- if only temporarily. On the other hand, if the musical isn’t available through a local library on VHS, I’m unlikely to pursue it further. I’ve watched more than one almost immediately after I saw the OP describing the movie. I’ve never gotten around to getting my name put on the choosers list, so I’m open to starting the new list whenever it suits the choosers of the new list (although those who had choices coming should be allowed to make a choice if they want.) I do recommend a new thread when you are ready to announce the new list. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2005, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/230 "2005-04-27T20:29:15Z")
> [@twickster](#): > > Also – we’ve been doing a three-week period between announcing the film and starting the discussion. Do people really need three weeks? Well, the easy question first - no. I don’t think we need 3 weeks. In fact, that may be too long. I keep forgetting when we’re to watch the next film and what it’s supposed to be… To the other question… I’d like to know what your criteria are/were for the list of 20 or so films. What films were you guys hoping to see (Please not **Gigi** )? Are you looking to see certain films because you like them? Because they’re important? Because they’re by specific directors? Starred specific actors? Had certain songs, scenes, ideas, or themes? Really rarely seen stuff? Really widely known stuff? What are you going for with your list? What makes an “inspired” choice? And could it be that the three week wait between films is one of the reasons that we haven’t come across some of those films yet? After all - it’s only been 12 films. While not all of those 12 would ha ve come up on my list of top 20 movie musicals to see, most of them come up in my top 50. Could quicker turnover solve the problem? Or perhaps not having the nominator write the OP? (I know my OP sucked - it prompted no discussion whatsoever. Someone else would have done a better job of it). ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2005, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/231 "2005-04-27T20:29:28Z")
Yeah, the four non-choosers absolutely deserve the chance to choose, if they want. (Reviewing the thread, I see **Tracy Lord** mentioned _Brigadoon_.) We may mix those choices into The Master List, depending on how those people feel about it. **Archive Guy** suggested we post The List about six titles at a time, so we can tweak it in response to … whatever eventualities might need to be responded to. I’ll email the four of them tonight (if there are active email addresses for them) to point them to this thread. And starting a new master thread makes sense as well. ---
**Author:** ![Eureka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/74df32/32.png) [@Eureka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eureka)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2005, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/232 "2005-04-27T20:47:31Z")
> [@amarinth](#): > > (I know my OP sucked - it prompted no discussion whatsoever. Someone else would have done a better job of it). One of the interesting things in reading these threads has been how much it varies in terms of how much discussion there has been of themes mentioned in the OP, I remember seeing this in the theater way back when, I saw this live and they did X differently, etc. I suspect that won’t change. Though it still fascinates me how much commentary **Little Shop of Horrors** inspired. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2005, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/233 "2005-04-27T21:00:14Z")
**amarinth** snuck in there while I was posting (obviously). > [@amarinth](#): > > Well, the easy question first - no. I don’t think we need 3 weeks. In fact, that may be too long. I keep forgetting when we’re to watch the next film and what it’s supposed to be… Sounds like there’s general agreement on this. Cool! > [@](#): > > To the other question… I’d like to know what your criteria are/were for the list of 20 or so films. What films were you guys hoping to see (Please not **Gigi** )? Are you looking to see certain films because you like them? Because they’re important? Because they’re by specific directors? Starred specific actors? Had certain songs, scenes, ideas, or themes? Really rarely seen stuff? Really widely known stuff? What are you going for with your list? What makes an “inspired” choice? Each of the three of us nominated 30 films we’d like to see discussed, each of us from our own prejudices and enthusiams. (My list was very dance-heavy, **Lamia** had a bunch of rock-oriented and Disney films, and **ArchiveGuy** had more of an academic overview). **Archive Guy** (who’s a total freakin’ genius at organizing stuff like this) put together a master list from this (75 titles total), noting overlaps – the only movie that all three of us included was _Cabaret_. We then responded to each others’ lists by creating two lists of 15 each – our top 15 picks and our second-tier picks. From these three lists, **AG** put together a list of 20 films, which we’ll fill out to 24 by each picking a “nyah nyah nyah you can’t stop me” pick ( **AG** getting two, since he missed his pick in the original system). Nope, no _Gigi_. No _Singin’ in the Rain_. No _Oliver!_ (phew!). They talked me out of _Top Hat_ and _Gay Divorcee_ – we’ll be doing _Shall We Dance_ for the Fred and Ginger film. There are a couple of, uh, non-mainstream choices (my nominees of _Hedwig and the Angry Inch_ and Ken Russell’s surreal version of _The Boy Friend_ both made it), and a couple of films that we’ve probably all seen more than once (_Music Man_ and _All That Jazz_). And other cool stuff as well. Let’s try this, with anyone who wants to write OPs volunteering (so it doesn’t totally turn into the **TwickyArchive** Show). Like **Eureka** , I’m not entirely sure the quality of the OP had a huge amount to do with the amount of discussion – sometimes more people or fewer actually watched the film, and sometimes there just wasn’t a whole lot to say about it. We did try to pick films that we thought people would want to see and have plenty to say about. We can wait and see what happens after we go through this list – we may all be tired of musicals by then, or we could decide to go off in some whole new direction. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2005, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/234 "2005-04-28T01:04:53Z")
I’ve sent out emails to the “haven’t picked yet” folks – well, three of them; the email to **singersargent** came back as undeliverable. They’ll either post here or email me if they want to pick. And **Archive Guy** has put together a set of six themed films that … well, tune in next week, this is going to be a _lot_ of fun. ---
**Author:** ![Tracy\_Lord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@Tracy\_Lord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tracy_Lord)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2005, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/235 "2005-04-28T01:20:58Z")
I’m all for the coup. 🙂 Consider my pick surrendered, Capitano! ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2005, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/236 "2005-04-28T03:23:31Z")
I bowed out a couple of pages ago. I just haven’t had the time to watch any of the movies. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2005, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/237 "2005-04-28T13:23:20Z")
Great! So far this has been a pretty bloodless coup… ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2005, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/238 "2005-04-29T00:46:41Z")
Got an email from **Kizvrvexious** , who said: > [@](#): > > After reading through some of the discussions, I was all ready to make > my recommendation, and even started writing a message to that effect in > the Salon’s thread. > > But seeing that the majority are in favor of allowing the revolution to > go forward, and seeing as how my participation has thus far been nil, I > have reconsidered, and do hereby yield my turn. > > I just hope that SOMEBODY picks 1776. I’ve passed that message on to **Archive Guy** , who’s putting the final touches on The List. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2005, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/239 "2005-05-02T16:46:27Z")
Fiddler OP to arrive sometime this evening; I’m on overload with work today, so I don’t have time to type it out until I’m done tonight. Have no fear! ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2005, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785/240 "2005-05-11T00:00:23Z")
Yoo hoo, **Eonwe** … [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sdmb-musical-lovers-salon-and-debating-society/251785.md?page=13)