# Sealioning **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 16, 2019, 10:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837 "2019-10-16T10:36:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![SmartAleq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smartaleq/32/163_2.png) [@SmartAleq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAleq)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/21 "2019-10-16T16:41:56Z")
Pissed off at being spotlighted much there, Willieboy? ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/22 "2019-10-16T16:49:02Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Like anything else cool or funny that most people don’t know about, dimwitted wannabes will overextend the use of a term until it is basically meaningless simply so they can appear to be hip to something you aren’t hip to. > > Then they will spend hours editing wikis and posting “authoritative”-seeming lists, complete with numbers, to justify their misuse of the term. OP wanted to know what sealioning was. But you didn’t answer that at all. I understand that the reason is that you don’t feel like participating in a discussion, you just want to be a jagoff. I suppose a man’s got to focus on his strengths. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/23 "2019-10-16T16:52:04Z")
I’ve never heard the term before today, but I’ve experienced it more than enough. My idiot congressman’s FB page is full of it from trump loyalists. “Give me evidence _from reputable sources_ that show trump is guilty.” And "you have no answer for my points! You are a coward democrat! " “Still waiting for your rebuttal.” I had read “never provide detailed answers to such a question, because you’ll just be wasting your time. You’ll never convince them”, but you can’t write that as a reply. They’ll just say “you have nothing! I win!” it’s like arguing with a five year old. As long as they get the last word, they think they’re winning. And they will ALWAYS get the last word in that type of argument. It’s the nature of the thing. Knowing it has a name won’t stop it, but it will make my responses shorter! ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/24 "2019-10-16T17:09:51Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > I’ve never heard the term before today, but I’ve experienced it more than enough. > > \ Only popped in to say yours is the best username in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/25 "2019-10-16T17:11:56Z")
> [@SmartAleq](#): > > Pissed off at being spotlighted much there, Willieboy? **WillFarnaby** isn’t a troll or sealion. He’s very forthcoming with his crazy ideas, and instead of trolling people by asking for cites for everything, he just goes off the deep end and calls his opponents racist Democrats or statists or warmongers. What you’re seeing here is a grudge that I posted something, and I’m a stupid racist Democrat statist warmonger. He follows me from thread to thread like an angry yet impotent wasp, trying to sting me with barbs I just never feel. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/26 "2019-10-16T17:15:42Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > What you’re seeing here is a grudge that I posted something, and I’m a stupid racist Democrat statist warmonger. He follows me from thread to thread like an angry yet impotent wasp, trying to sting me with barbs I just never feel. But relentlessly following someone is also part of sealioning, which is not really appropriate to the other examples in this thread because it is a general message board where anyone can post anywhere. Only if you _do_ deliberately follow someone would it be classic sealioning, which in WF’s case would be appropriate, or even more classically, posting on someone’s blog that they hadn’t responded to a twitter comment. (Which isn’t to say that the other examples _aren’t_ sealioning because definitions can drift, only that following someone around gets you extra sealiony points.) But I agree that WF is still not a sealion because he isn’t polite and doesn’t pretend to engage. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/27 "2019-10-16T17:18:27Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > He follows me from thread to thread like an angry yet impotent wasp, trying to sting me with barbs I just never feel. So, he is a troll, albeit an ineffectual one? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/28 "2019-10-16T17:38:34Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Like anything else cool or funny that most people don’t know about, dimwitted wannabes will overextend the use of a term until it is basically meaningless simply so they can appear to be hip to something you aren’t hip to. Those Boomers sound like some real statists! ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/29 "2019-10-16T18:06:27Z")
> [@Pleonast](#): > > So, nothing to do with Nazis invading England? (-: ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/30 "2019-10-16T18:53:03Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > 1. An extreme focus on the process of a debate, rather than the main point (e.g., if someone says the sky is blue, the troll/sealioner will focus discussion individually/serially on the words, meaning, and standard of proof for “sky,” “is,” and “blue” rather than coming out with a competing argument that the sky is a different color. As an example: > [@Is O'Rourke deliberately sabotaging the Dems?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-orourke-deliberately-sabotaging-the-dems/841637/182): > > I do have a gripe with the whole “gun buyBACK” terminology though. It’s wrong. The government isn’t buying BACK people’s guns. They never owned them in the first place. O’Rourke is proposing gun confiscation with some compensation. I’m starting to think that he’s reading this thread as an instruction manual. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/31 "2019-10-16T19:23:39Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Like anything else cool or funny that most people don’t know about, dimwitted wannabes will overextend the use of a term until it is basically meaningless simply so they can appear to be hip to something you aren’t hip to. > > Then they will spend hours editing wikis and posting “authoritative”-seeming lists, complete with numbers, to justify their misuse of the term. So, other posters in this thread, what would this count as? Threadshitting? ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/32 "2019-10-16T19:28:35Z")
Whatever it’s called at least he’s doing in a forum where it’s OK to call him a jagoff for it. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/33 "2019-10-16T20:09:00Z")
The original cartoon, as cited, has the woman denigrating the sealion for no reason at all. Doesn’t seem like the most solid ground on which to build a meme. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/34 "2019-10-16T21:20:03Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > The original cartoon, as cited, has the woman denigrating the sealion for no reason at all. Doesn’t seem like the most solid ground on which to build a meme. The sea lion jumped into someone else’s conversation to act like a sea lion. The whole idea is that this is par for the course for sea lions, which is why, in the first place, she doesn’t like them. It’s like someone saying “I don’t like assholes” and suddenly a wild asshole appears. ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/35 "2019-10-16T21:59:08Z")
> [@raventhief](#): > > The sea lion jumped into someone else’s conversation to act like a sea lion. The whole idea is that this is par for the course for sea lions, which is why, in the first place, she doesn’t like them. It’s like someone saying “I don’t like assholes” and suddenly a wild asshole appears. It’s like someone saying “I don’t like assholes” and suddenly an HD appears. Fixed it for you. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2019, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/36 "2019-10-16T23:59:18Z")
If anyone wants to see it in action, **HD** is doing it right now in the Kurds thread in Great Debates. As **Ravenman** said, it’s subtle but once you notice it, it’s obvious. We could add that thread to the Wiki page (with apologies to **WF** for editing a wiki page). ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/37 "2019-10-17T00:03:57Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > Hey, can someone really explain sealioning to me? I’ve now seen it referenced by several posters and several moderators, and I’ve looked up the original comic, but I don’t see how it applies to the posts here where it’s referenced. > > I’m putting this in the Pit because accusations of sealioning are accusations of trolling, and I’m looking for examples and an explanation of how it fits. The posters here who are accused of it don’t seem to be taking the position of the sea lion in the comic – they aren’t inviting people to debate, they’re just debating in bad faith. I don’t think I’ve ever seen an example that’s displayed in the original comic, but maybe I’m missing some subtlety. > > Here’s the original comic: [#1062; The Terrible Sea Lion – Wondermark](http://wondermark.com/1k62/) > > I’m off to work with limited opportunities to respond, but I’ll read this with interest if I get responses. Well, first you sneak up behind the sea lion while it’s asleep and then… Er, no idea. I heard it for the first time in a thread not to long ago. I’m so unhip I can’ barely walk, apparently. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/38 "2019-10-17T00:25:35Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Well, first you sneak up behind the sea lion while it’s asleep and then… > > Er, no idea. I heard it for the first time in a thread not to long ago. I’m so unhip I can’ barely walk, apparently. He’s doing it to you currently in the Kurds thread. I’m glad I’m not involved with that one – my head would explode. It’s weird – he started out against the Syrian mess (unlike **Magiver** who was all in from the beginning) but I guess the cognitive dissonance of disagreeing with the Dear Leader is wearing him down. Anyway, back to the main topic of the OP. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/39 "2019-10-17T00:27:03Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > The original cartoon, as cited, has the woman denigrating the sealion for no reason at all. Doesn’t seem like the most solid ground on which to build a meme. I really can’t tell if this is meant as a brilliant example of sealioning, or if this is just a perfect example of sealioning. If the former, Kudos to you, you almost whooshed me, and did whoosh **raventhief**. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2019, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837/40 "2019-10-17T00:30:47Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > The original cartoon, as cited, has the woman denigrating the sealion for no reason at all. Doesn’t seem like the most solid ground on which to build a meme. I think that’s the point. It’s not about the merits of the issue in itself, so antipathy toward sealions was deliberately chosen because it slightly surreal, lacking the intrinsic baggage of a real-life political issue. It’s about the process of debate, the manner of engagement. The sealion has every right to feel aggrieved, but rather than stating his opposing view (or even righteous anger) in a straightforward manner, giving his reasons why sealions are perfectly agreeable creatures, he adopts an ostensibly uber-polite uber-reasonable demeanour insisting that they _engage_ with him and expound their arguments in order to try to convince him of the merits of their view. But of course, it’s a ridiculous notion that a sealion would be genuinuely _open-minded_ about the idea that sealions are awful. The humans know that and don’t want to engage, and his behavior deteriorates into into passive-aggressive stalking. I think the essence of sealioning is simply that you are _not_ remotely open-minded about an issue, you enter a debate in an ostensibly polite and reasonable manner, but with a bad-faith aim to simply make people waste time debating you extensively and pointlessly. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sealioning/841837.md?page=3)