# Seeing the "real America" **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 17, 2010, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493 "2010-08-17T02:52:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/41 "2010-08-17T18:29:13Z")
> [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](#): > > > [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > > > Butthurt? Who has hurt the butt? > > Canada? Leave Canada out of this – or put a cork in it. ---
**Author:** ![Sattua](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sattua/32/11906_2.png) [@Sattua](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sattua)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/42 "2010-08-17T19:16:18Z")
> [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > The next time I go to the US (I’ve only ever been to pretty obvious places, and none all that recently) I’d like to pick somewhere that’s a bit “small town” ie not gigantic city. I seem to prefer nowadays plonking myself down somewhere, going to the local shops, checking out the local bars, reading the local newspapers. I’m less interested in the tourist traps. People are much more interesting than places, generally. This kind of holiday is easy for me in the UK, or France, because I know them decently well. The US is so big that I’m not sure where to go. It would have to be not too hot, as I wilt. Portland, Oregon? This small-city American girl thinks of Portland, Oregon as a very big city. For a more small-town experience, you might be happier hitting Portland, Maine in the summer. There are beaches. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/43 "2010-08-17T19:21:30Z")
Out of more than 18,000 incorporated towns in the United States, Portland Oregon is about the 30th-largest. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/44 "2010-08-17T19:34:09Z")
Aren’t people always talking about heart-shaped butts? Or is that faces? ETA: Isn’t being the 30th-largest unincorporated town kind of like being the 30th most solvent bankrupt company? ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/45 "2010-08-17T20:20:04Z")
I have a couple of friends from the Netherlands who have traveled to the US repeatedly for extended road trips. They seemed to take great pleasure in getting off the beaten path. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/46 "2010-08-17T20:44:01Z")
> [@amarinth](#): > > Do people from other countries do that when visiting the US? Is there someone out there saying “New York City is so overdone. I’m going to Buffalo to see the real America”? And if so, where do they go? There may well be visitors like that, but as another poster says it is usually people visiting friends. I’ve visited the US 6 times, one on a specific holiday to NYC, with a trip to my cousins in CT, but other times just to see friends. It gives one a great insight into American culture and small town/suburban life. NYC feels quite different to most other parts of the US I’ve visited. I’d like to spend more time in the South as I’ve only ever been in VA as yet. From big cities to small towns I’ve seen plenty that has interested me, some of it tailored to tourists, other things not so. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/47 "2010-08-17T21:06:33Z")
> [@Sattua](#): > > This small-city American girl thinks of Portland, Oregon as a very big city. For a more small-town experience, you might be happier hitting Portland, Maine in the summer. There are beaches. Is Portland, Oregon, really that large a city? It’s about the size of Edinburgh. As a potential tourist, it’s not like I’m hoping to hang around in the suburbs or further hinterland. It looks like a very nice place in a nice part of the world. Perhaps I can get a taxi to Portland, Maine, if I don’t like it. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Sattua](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sattua/32/11906_2.png) [@Sattua](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sattua)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/48 "2010-08-17T22:23:02Z")
Wikipedia says the metro area has 2.2 million residents. Sounds like a big city to me. I’ve always lived in metro areas of 150K-300K. Portland, Maine has a metro area of about 500K… enough for good restaurants, not too many to hamper driving. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/49 "2010-08-17T22:37:08Z")
> [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > Perhaps I can get a taxi to Portland, Maine, if I don’t like it. 😉 It’s a bit far - you may just want to take the train instead… (Actually, a train ride from Portland to Portand would be an awesome way to spend a vacation, if you like train rides.) ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/50 "2010-08-17T22:41:26Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Isn’t being the 30th-largest unincorporated town kind of like being the 30th most solvent bankrupt company? Incorporated. If I’d left out that qualifier, the 18,000+ figure would have been higher, but the 30th ranking would be unchanged. Portland Oregon is a major city. Not a world city, but not in any sense a small town. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/51 "2010-08-17T22:58:19Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > (Actually, a train ride from Portland to Portand would be an awesome way to spend a vacation, if you like train rides.) I like trains. That must be a possible journey, don’t care if it’s a very quick one. Hmmm ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/52 "2010-08-17T23:13:26Z")
> [@Spoke](#): > > I have a couple of friends from the Netherlands who have traveled to the US repeatedly for extended road trips. They seemed to take great pleasure in getting off the beaten path. Some European students I knew drove from Houston to Big Bend National Park over a Christmas holiday. Yes, the park is amazing. But they couldn’t stop talking about the trip there–they just drove & drove & they were still in Texas! They were amazed because that long a trip would cover several countries back home. And the route is not especially picturesque; mostly flat, the unlike Monument Valley that John Ford made the icon of the American West. I vividly remember a childhood trip where I discovered the beauty of New York State & New England. There were granite mountains, great rivers & amazing lakes, along with small towns like the pictures in books & in old movies. (We don’t have red barns in my part of Texas.) I know foreign tourists love our great western parks, but the East has a fine combination of great cities, small towns & nature. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/53 "2010-08-17T23:17:02Z")
> [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > > [@Munch](#): > > > > (Actually, a train ride from Portland to Portand would be an awesome way to spend a vacation, if you like train rides.) > > I like trains. That must be a possible journey, don’t care if it’s a very quick one. Hmmm Definitely possible. However, I’m having trouble getting it to work on [amtrak.com](http://amtrak.com) going west to east. If you want to follow the sun, you can do it for $665. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/54 "2010-08-17T23:26:11Z")
> [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > > [@Munch](#): > > > > (Actually, a train ride from Portland to Portand would be an awesome way to spend a vacation, if you like train rides.) > > I like trains. That must be a possible journey, don’t care if it’s a very quick one. Hmmm It could be done. I checked out various Portland, ME (POR) to Portland, OR (PDX) routes [here](http://tickets.amtrak.com/itd/amtrak). Take the Downeaster, the Lake Shore Limited & the Empire Builder. Or maybe add the Cascades to the last bit. $411.00\* not \*following the sun. Hmmm, indeed… ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2010, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/55 "2010-08-17T23:34:35Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > > [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > > > I like trains. That must be a possible journey, don’t care if it’s a very quick one. Hmmm > > Definitely possible. However, I’m having trouble getting it to work on [amtrak.com](http://amtrak.com) going west to east. If you want to follow the sun, you can do it for $665. Portland OR to Boston, MA via Chicago can be had for $277. Takes three days. (I used the interactive route atlas/trip planner). I don’t believe there’s an Amtrak station in Portland, ME; it seems that from Boston you have to complete the trip by bus that you book through Amtrak. The California Zephyr, which runs San Francisco to Chicago, is supposed to be a hell of a trip. There’s special glass roofed observation cars. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2010, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/56 "2010-08-18T00:06:48Z")
For a large city, and in the sense of the historic demographics which comprised mainly white people and black people, I think Chicago is the “real America” in a way. The immigrant contributions are there, and there still are ethnic neighborhoods, but in general the sense I’ve gotten when visiting Chicago is that the immigrants, or their descendants, are more assimilated. I think that’s definitely true compared with NYC or L.A., where we have more first generation newcomers, who often don’t yet speak English, and work in marginalized sectors of the economy. Then there’s the “educated” Chicago accent which is supposed to be the standard of public discourse and broadcasting. Nearly forgotten, at least by outsiders, is the Chicago working class accent; best illustrated by a National Lampoon newspaper parody of many years ago, “The Chicagah Tribune”. In short, Chicago has all the pieces that we think of as going to make up American culture–immigrants, but also a high degree of assimilation, as well as a standard of educated speech but also a strong working class tradition. And the Cubs. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2010, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/57 "2010-08-18T00:09:43Z")
I ran into a German family in Yosemite (actually I shared my campsite with them - they had failed to make reservations and they did not realize that Yosemite books up 6 months in advance). They were hiking the beauty of Yosemite, then were driving to San Francisco. I think they started in LA. So in a trip they got LA, the farming central valley, Yosemite, the drive to San Francisco from Yosemite, then I think Napa. Pretty good feel for a part of America - all of it real. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2010, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/58 "2010-08-18T02:16:31Z")
> [@valleyofthedolls](#): > > > [@Duckster](#): > > > > You are correct. Just as much of the rest of the planet does not have vast stretches of unspoiled land in national parks and monuments, historical areas, grasslands, forests, etc. The concept that the land itself and those native creatures that dwell within should and do have standing on par with humans is a uniquely American concept. We’ve exported the concept and although our ideas are duplicated around the world, the duplication is seldom, if ever, duplicated on virgin land. > > > > American “culture” is directly tied to the land and our roots are closer and deeper than practically all of Europe that subdued their natural areas long, long ago. > > Maybe in the romantisized world you live in but I’ll call BS. The real America? Go to any shitty fast food restaurant and there you are. Fine I’m a romantic. I also live within 30 minutes of millions of acres of wild land (lions, tigers and bears, you bet!) and about an hour from 1,000 year old living trees, the only actively growing glaciers in America outside of Alaska, and other wild and unique things deliberately left off of tourist maps and USGS maps as well. > [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > The whole point about seeing the “real” wherever is that most people don’t do it. Now, that _might_ be because they don’t know any better, but it’s much more likely that it’s because it sucks, whatever it is. > > Any country or region which makes money on tourism will be quick to promote whatever it is that it has to offer that people don’t know about. If it’s not in the guidebook, it’s because it’s boring. > > > [@Duckster](#): > > > > You are correct. Just as much of the rest of the planet does not have vast stretches of unspoiled land in national parks and monuments, historical areas, grasslands, forests, etc. The concept that the land itself and those native creatures that dwell within should and do have standing on par with humans is a uniquely American concept. We’ve exported the concept and although our ideas are duplicated around the world, the duplication is seldom, if ever, duplicated on virgin land. > > Spent much time in much of the rest of the world, have you? I’m going with _no_. The national park may be a uniquely American idea\*, but the concept that nature ought to be protected is not. > > \*although it really isn’t; it just more or less happened here first. Yes, I’ve spent considerable time overseas, thankyouverymuch. The very concept that land, and all that naturally dwells within, deserve standing on its merits is an American invention that have been exported around the world. It was first embodied with the national park idea directly in 1870, which eventually led to the creation of Yellowstone National Park. But the idea that truly wild land should exist in its own right goes back further, but was not directly applied until the 1964 Wilderness Act. Other countries today may have national parks (none older than Yellowstone), and there may be virgin land in other places “older” than that found in America but the very idea that such land should exist on their own merits is strictly an American invention. ---
**Author:** ![sitchensis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sitchensis/32/4892_2.png) [@sitchensis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sitchensis)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2010, 7:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/59 "2010-08-18T07:54:50Z")
Drive from Seattle WA to Bozeman MT not on I-90 and hit Glacier Nat Park, in Bozeman turn around and drive back to Portland through Jellystone . See: Seattle, Cascades, Desert, Farm Country, Rockies, MT plains, Rockies, Hells Canyon, Columbia River and wineries, and make sure to hit the Pendleton Roundup for a good rodeo. That’s all you need to see ---
**Author:** ![Dogzilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@Dogzilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dogzilla)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2010, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493/60 "2010-08-18T13:02:48Z")
> [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](#): > > > [@Dogzilla](#): > > > > Wal Mart. > > American who’s never been abroad and has never heard of Tesco and Carrefour detected. :smack: I wasn’t implying that I think Wal Mart is the pinnacle of American culture and there’s no discount shopping for cheap Chinese crap overseas. I was implying that, if you want to see the _people_ of _real_ America, go to Wal Mart. That’s where you will find a very broad cross-section of demographics. That said, I hate Wal Mart and do not shop there. So you’d miss the Wal Mart haters. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seeing-the-real-america/550493.md?page=4)