# Self aiming rifle that 'turns novices into experts'
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [May 25, 2013, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352 "2013-05-25T22:33:55Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)
#### Post date: [May 25, 2013, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/1 "2013-05-25T22:33:55Z")
_Another_ gun thread? Bo-ring. But wait…this one is about a rifle with Linux, wi-fi and the same technology behind air-to-air missiles!
In Austin, TX (where else?), a company has developed an advanced rifle that reportedly turns complete beginners into expert marksmen (or markswomen);
> [@](#):
>
> Steve has just delivered a .338 Lapua Magnum round directly onto a target about the size of a big dinner plate at a range of 1,008 yards—that’s ten football fields, or a tick over 0.91 kilometers. It’s his very first try. He has never fired a rifle before today.
> **[Bullseye from 1,000 yards: Shooting the $17,000 Linux-powered rifle](https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2013/03/bullseye-from-1000-yards-shooting-the-17000-linux-powered-rifle/)**
>
> ARM CPUs, lasers, and Wi-Fi make firing this weapon an experience like no other.
More on the precise details behind a ‘Precision Guided Firearm’ (PGF);
> [@](#):
>
> The PGF lets the user choose a target in the rifle’s sights while the weapon decides when it is the best time to shoot - compensating for factors like wind speed, arm shake, recoil, air temperature, humidity and the bullet’s drop due to gravity, all of which can affect accuracy.
> **['Self-aiming' rifle turns novices into expert snipers](https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn23571-self-aiming-rifle-turns-novices-into-expert-snipers/)**
>
> A new computer-aiming system for rifles lets you "tag" a target with a laser pulse and works out the best moment to pull the trigger, making life easier for long-range killers
It’s incredibly expensive, but the technology is there and will only get cheaper. What’s the debate, you ask? If the Feds should get involved and what you think about a world where anyone with the cash can have the skills of an experienced sniper - would any public place be truly secure if civilians can get hold of one of these bad boys? Or is accuracy, something strived for since Mr. Gun Powder first shot a ball out of a tube, nothing for concern? Tell us what you think.
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### Author:  [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)
#### Post date: [May 25, 2013, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/2 "2013-05-25T22:43:30Z")
Warning: Do not fire Amazin’ Laser at the President.
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### Author:  [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)
#### Post date: [May 25, 2013, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/3 "2013-05-25T23:08:30Z")
I see your 1,000 yards and raise you another 1,000: [Sandia’s self-guided bullet prototype can hit target a mile away](https://share.sandia.gov/news/resources/news_releases/bullet/)
> [@](#):
>
> Sandia researchers Red Jones and Brian Kast and their colleagues have invented a dart-like, self-guided bullet for small-caliber, smooth-bore firearms that could hit laser-designated targets at distances of more than a mile (about 2,000 meters).
> …
> Sandia’s design for the four-inch-long bullet includes an optical sensor in the nose to detect a laser beam on a target. The sensor sends information to guidance and control electronics that use an algorithm in an eight-bit central processing unit to command electromagnetic actuators. These actuators steer tiny fins that guide the bullet to the target.
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### Author:  [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)
#### Post date: [May 25, 2013, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/4 "2013-05-25T23:14:40Z")
> [@Dissonance](#):
>
> I see your 1,000 yards and raise you another 1,000: [Sandia’s self-guided bullet prototype can hit target a mile away](https://share.sandia.gov/news/resources/news_releases/bullet/)
Ok, what happens when you put a self-guided bullet in a self-aiming rifle?
“It’ll shoot the fleas off a dog’s back at three thousand yards, Tannen, and it’s pointed straight at your head!”
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### Author:  [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)
#### Post date: [May 25, 2013, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/5 "2013-05-25T23:23:23Z")
> [@Dissonance](#):
>
> I see your 1,000 yards and raise you another 1,000: [Sandia’s self-guided bullet prototype can hit target a mile away](https://share.sandia.gov/news/resources/news_releases/bullet/)
Did you ever watch that movie [_Runaway_](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Runaway_%281984_film%29)?
I watched that movie as a little kid and it gave me nighbmares.
It’s kind of messed-up that those nightmares are coming true.
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### Author:  [@Declan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Declan)
#### Post date: [May 25, 2013, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/6 "2013-05-25T23:38:11Z")
> [@Mr.Kobayashi](#):
>
> It’s incredibly expensive, but the technology is there and will only get cheaper. What’s the debate, you ask? If the Feds should get involved and what you think about a world where anyone with the cash can have the skills of an experienced sniper - would any public place be truly secure if civilians can get hold of one of these bad boys? Or is accuracy, something strived for since Mr. Gun Powder first shot a ball out of a tube, nothing for concern? Tell us what you think.
Sounds like a solution in need of a problem.
The only practical thing I can see this being used for , is fixed base stations or roving remote tracked vehicles for farmers or ranchers. Step down the fire power from 308 to 7.62 and remote in and dispatch coyotes or what ever varmint is hassling the cattle.
Declan
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### Author:  [@thirdname](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thirdname)
#### Post date: [May 26, 2013, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/7 "2013-05-26T00:07:33Z")
The technology is pretty much what tank guns use, not air-to-air missiles. I don’t know if it will increase crime. Rifles are already pretty easy to shoot. If you’re firing from a rest position, it’s pretty much point-and-shoot out to at least a few hundred yards against a human-sized target, but there aren’t many sniper-style shootings. On the other hand, being able to shoot from further out might make it easier to shoot someone and get away.
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### Author:  [@BunnyTVS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BunnyTVS)
#### Post date: [May 26, 2013, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/8 "2013-05-26T01:07:23Z")
> [@monstro](#):
>
> Did you ever watch that movie [_Runaway_](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Runaway_%281984_film%29)?
>
> I watched that movie as a little kid and it gave me nighbmares.
Yeah, seeing Gene Simmons without his make-up is traumatising.
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### Author:  [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)
#### Post date: [May 26, 2013, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/9 "2013-05-26T02:04:04Z")
I can see how this technology would be a godsend for the military, or even for police SWAT units.
In civilian hands? This is a “lone nut kills dozens and uploads it live to Facebook” waiting to happen.
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### Author:  [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)
#### Post date: [May 26, 2013, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/10 "2013-05-26T05:19:08Z")
> [@Mr.Kobayashi](#):
>
> Ok, what happens when you put a self-guided bullet in a self-aiming rifle?
They immediately start arguing.
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### Author:  [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)
#### Post date: [May 26, 2013, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/11 "2013-05-26T05:39:27Z")
> [@Kobal2](#):
>
> They immediately start arguing.
Exactly! The gun will decide you’re better off shooting someone else.
This is how it will work. The gun will use facial recognition software to look ID and look up your target online, and as you wave the gun around (as newbies do) it will ID everyone you scan. What YOU wanna do is shoot the guy who’s boinking your wife. But then the gun tells you there’s two burglars, a rapist and a child molester all within range.
What do you do? Me, I don’t want yo get on the bad side of my Smart GUn
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### Author:  [@Wulabo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wulabo)
#### Post date: [May 26, 2013, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/12 "2013-05-26T06:54:10Z")
Hitting the intended target sounds like a better solution than the countless deaths each year of innocents caught in the line of fire.
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### Author:  [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)
#### Post date: [May 26, 2013, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/13 "2013-05-26T07:04:33Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#):
>
> The gun will use facial recognition software But then the gun tells you there’s two burglars, a rapist and a child molester all within range.
>
> What do you do? Me, I don’t want yo get on the bad side of my Smart GUn
hmmmm… then what happens if YOU, the guy holding the gun, are the one that the gun recognizes from its database of convicted rapists? Can the gun kill itself? 🙂
But seriously…
This technology sounds scary…because it is easy to abuse.
Like the earlier threads we have had here about 3d printers making it easy to print your own pistol at home. Sure, you can make your own pistol at home right now using simple machinist’s tools. But most people don’t.
When 3d printers make it easy, people _will_ use them to make guns.
And right now, anybody can use a rifle like a sniper. But most people don’t.
But when a high-tech version makes it easy–_and makes it feel like a computer game_, people will use them.
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### Author:  [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)
#### Post date: [May 27, 2013, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/14 "2013-05-27T04:09:44Z")
Imagine how easy murder is going to be when you can shoot a target in a city from 1000 metres away - that sort of range is going to make it exponentially harder to catch anyone that tries it.
And I’d imagine that safety features (such as a human lockout in targeting) will take time to catch up.
I don’t think there will be a lot of problems - but haven’t you already had the “beltway snipers”? How hard were they to catch? If you up the range to such a factor, how much worse is it going to get?
Or better still - I don’t know how good the technology is, but what if you can hit the driver of a semi from the back of a pick-up 1km in front?
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### Author:  [@usedtobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usedtobe)
#### Post date: [May 27, 2013, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/15 "2013-05-27T06:02:27Z")
It will make getting alibis much easier.
Me? I was parking my car across town about then - check the garage - I use a pass card - it tracks all ins and out!
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### Author:  [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)
#### Post date: [May 27, 2013, 8:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/16 "2013-05-27T08:09:41Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#):
>
> Exactly! The gun will decide you’re better off shooting someone else.
I was thinking more like they couldn’t agree on how to hit the target. Like :
Gun : Target confirmed and lined up. Good to go.
Bullet : No it ain’t. Aim two microns to the left, dude.
Gun : My aiming is perfect.
Bullet : No is ISN’T ! Why do you always do this ? Why can’t you ever listen ? You forgot to account for the phase of the moon, you gotta… you know what, I don’t even care. I’ll just correct in-flight. AS USUAL.
Gun : You won’t if I don’t fire you, punk. I’ll tell the meatbag you’re jammed, and he’ll rack the slide and eject you, how’s that sound ? I bet you’ll be a reaaaal smart bullet, lying on the ground like a little bitch.
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### Author:  [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)
#### Post date: [May 27, 2013, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/17 "2013-05-27T10:54:13Z")
At long last sniper rifles are as accurate at long distances as the pistols in a western
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### Author:  [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)
#### Post date: [May 27, 2013, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/18 "2013-05-27T15:32:55Z")
Menu options:
“Right between the eyes”
“Shoot the gun out of his hand”
“Ricochet off church bell”
“Dance, Pilgrim!”
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### Author:  [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)
#### Post date: [May 27, 2013, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/19 "2013-05-27T18:04:19Z")
The vast majority of shootings seem to be up close, you don’t get many snipers from hundreds of yards away.
I was reading a book by a member of seal team 6 last year (I think the Howard Wadsin book) where he said something along the lines of the fact that snipers from ST6 could successfully hit a target out to about 400 yards no matter the scenario (water, wind, fatigue, etc) but beyond that range they ran into problems. So yeah this rifle (and self aiming bullet) will make the best marine and navy snipers no better than a total amateur. I assume that is good.
As for what it will do for civilian population, unless you get another Charles Whitmore most shootings aren’t done with $22,000 rifles from hundreds of yards away. They are almost always done with handguns up close, there are only about 400 murders a year in the US done with rifles.
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### Author:  [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)
#### Post date: [May 27, 2013, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-aiming-rifle-that-turns-novices-into-experts/659352/20 "2013-05-27T18:08:10Z")
> [@bengangmo](#):
>
> Imagine how easy murder is going to be when you can shoot a target in a city from 1000 metres away - that sort of range is going to make it exponentially harder to catch anyone that tries it.
>
> And I’d imagine that safety features (such as a human lockout in targeting) will take time to catch up.
>
> I don’t think there will be a lot of problems - but haven’t you already had the “beltway snipers”? How hard were they to catch? If you up the range to such a factor, how much worse is it going to get?
>
> Or better still - I don’t know how good the technology is, but what if you can hit the driver of a semi from the back of a pick-up 1km in front?
You can also make silencers at home out of cheap materials from a hardware store. So you could have amateurs with silenced rifles (maybe 110db, probably less. I’ve heard a properly silenced gun is no louder than a staple gun) who can hit targets from half a mile away.
But again, rifle murders are rare. Of the 8k firearm homicides in the US each year, about 400 are done with rifles, so about 5%.
The DC snipers shot and killed a lot of people before they were caught. A big reason they were caught is they gave themselves up by telling too much to the police.
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