# Self-driving cars may not be a bad thing **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 30, 2015, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197 "2015-05-30T14:49:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![drachillix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/48db29/32.png) [@drachillix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drachillix)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2015, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/81 "2015-06-02T18:39:23Z")
> [@The\_Angry\_Badger](#): > > The problem with that is, that basically means the driver has to be alert, aware of the conditions and ready to take over at a second’s notice. If you’re going to have to do that for the whole journey then you might as well just drive yourself anyway. > > Having the car suddenly switch over to manual mode if it doesn’t know how to handle a situation is worse than useless - what if you’re reading a book when that happens? Or sleeping? Car encounters input it cant handle #1 impending collision - stop anyway #2 less imminent danger, initiate “problem” mode activate hazard lights, begin slowing vehicle, notify driver (buzzer, alarm, whatever) do its best to pull over/stop driving. If the driver can intervene and take over and handle it, great. If not it pulls over. Say a tire blows, the system will probably realize there is something weird about the positioning sensors on the wheel in question. It may not know its a flat tire, but it most likely will know something is wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2015, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/82 "2015-06-02T18:45:22Z")
> [@drachillix](#): > > I know you are not directing the question at me, but you are looking at several models available in 3-5 years, fairly common in 10. I’m not so sure the first models will be out that soon, notwithstanding all the press releases from auto manufacturers that say so. Shoot, I’m not sure the Tesla Model X will be out in the next 3-5 years. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2015, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/83 "2015-06-02T18:51:06Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > **chappachula** – can I ask, do you think that autonomous cars will not be available or ready for many years if ever (like, 40 years or more), or do you think these are just really hard problems that are going to have to be solved over the next decade or two? Gee, I dunno…A little of both, methinks. There is a huge market out there for robotic cars, and since the financial incentive is there, corporations will work very,very hard to produce a car they can sell. So I expect some sort of semi-autonomous car to be available soon, but with many,many limitations. But the idea of a completely independent car is still a fantasy…The car that will take you to work, then drive itself home, then pick up your 10 yr old kid after school and take him to grandma’s house, then return to your office and take you home, all with no human input and no errors. For the next 50 years, we’re going to need a human being with a driver’s license sitting in the vehicle at all times, ready to take over, even if he is only needed for 1 percent of the trips, when somethng happens to confuse the car, and it just stops in the middle of the lane. That means that one of the biggest markets --elderly people who no longer drive–will still be off-limits. The remaining market will be people who prefer to sleep on the way to work every day. But that’s a pretty big market 🙂 , so I expect it to be filled within the next 20 years or so. But even then, the cars will be very limited: to warm weather climates, and to properly maintained roads. I can see a typical 2-car family investing in a robot car as a third car, usefull for one and only one thing–making a routine commute every day over a pre-defined route, and sitting unused for several months of winter. ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2015, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/84 "2015-06-02T19:08:15Z")
> [@drachillix](#): > > The day you see people loading 3rd party or home tweaked firmware THEN they will have a point. Think about how many updates Windows provides now (bug fixes, virus updates, service packs, etc), because umnplanned and unknown events arise…(i.e “shit happens”) When a half million self-driving cars hit the road, moving among a half-billion regular vehicles, on a half-billion different roads, there will be billions\* of events that the original program didnt know about. So every car will need to receive updates to its software all the time, probably once a week or so. Those updates will be sent over regular internet connections to your car’s wifi. Hackers will have a field day. \ 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2015, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/85 "2015-06-02T19:58:37Z")
> [@drachillix](#): > > They are not ready for self driving cars, having recently experienced traffic in Manila I understand what you are implying however many of these places have a culture of really shitty driving practices. A computer needs some kind of rules and structure to follow, those countries don’t even try. One of the good things about self-driving cars might be a decline in shitty driving practices. And I’m not just talking about third world practices- I can see how it might not be a bad thing for someone prone to road rage to not be in control of a vehicle. Actually, I wonder if it might not reduce road rage, knowing that the thing that just happened that you didn’t like (for example, someone cutting in front of you) didn’t happen because a person decided to do it. Drowsy driving is a huge problem- [it’s estimated that 28% of US drivers have fallen asleep at the wheel in the past year](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep-deprived_driving). The NHTSA estimates that it causes 100,000 crashes per year. Most of the people who fall asleep while driving probably do so during fairly routine driving, say on a non-congested freeway, the kind of driving a self-driving car would be well-equipped to do. Even a car that was only self-driving for portions of a trip could help with that problem. The car could make a loud noise to wake a sleeping driver if manual control was required. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2015, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/86 "2015-06-02T20:32:26Z")
> [@Anne\_Neville](#): > > One of the good things about self-driving cars might be a decline in shitty driving practices. Word. Right now there are many people on the road who _think_ they’re good drivers because I drive defensively. People say it’s not that bad. I can’t tell if these people just have a rosy view of the world, are inobservant, or so ignorant of traffic laws and safe driving they can’t spot danger and infractions. Recently I drove less than a mile and observed three serious, life-risking driver actions…I’m not talking about just not following the rules of the road. The weirdest of the three was a van puttering along at 22 in a 35 zone. Not life-threatening in itself, just frustrating…until the 4-way stop, which the van rolled right through at that same 22 mph, not yielding to the suddenly-evading cross traffic. ---
**Author:** ![Regallag\_The\_Axe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/regallag_the_axe/32/445_2.png) [@Regallag\_The\_Axe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Regallag_The_Axe)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2015, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/87 "2015-06-02T20:46:19Z")
The first ‘self driving’ cars will be self driving on Interstate highways only. I can see now: You pull onto the highway and a notification come up on the console-screen that says something like, ‘Highway detected, press “START” to begin auto-drive, or press “CANCEL.”’ Then you’d tell the car what exit you want to get to and it would alert you when you’re close. Highways are easy. Even my phone knows when there’s a slowdown, and proximity-radar can take care of the details. Cars that can drive themselves on side roads, private driveways, etc. are still a way off. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2015, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/88 "2015-06-02T21:19:06Z")
> [@Regallag\_The\_Axe](#): > > The first ‘self driving’ cars will be self driving on Interstate highways only. I can see now: You pull onto the highway and a notification come up on the console-screen that says something like, ‘Highway detected, press “START” to begin auto-drive, or press “CANCEL.”’ Then you’d tell the car what exit you want to get to and it would alert you when you’re close. Even that would probably make drowsy driving less dangerous, so it would be beneficial. My dad totaled his car a few years ago when he fell asleep driving on a freeway (fortunately no one was hurt). My 2015 Subaru Outback is (unfortunately) not a self-driving car. But it has some nice features that I’m sure make it safer for me and Mr. Neville to drive. It has a backup camera, which has made me a _lot_ less nervous in the parking lot at Lil’ Neville’s daycare. It has lane-departure warnings, which probably would help with drowsy driving (that might have woken my dad up before he went into the guardrail). It can tell you if you’re coming up on an obstacle ahead. ---
**Author:** ![swampspruce](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/swampspruce/32/261_2.png) [@swampspruce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/swampspruce)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2015, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/89 "2015-06-03T13:53:02Z")
> [@Balance](#): > > Give me my override button, or [the goat gets it!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MzS7cCMxKUc) 😃 > > If you really feel my choice of example is too capricious, pretend we’re talking about boulders instead. Nice! 😃 Naw, we’ll stick with the goats for now. You can make delicious roti out of them, boulders take too much tenderizing. ---
**Author:** ![swampspruce](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/swampspruce/32/261_2.png) [@swampspruce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/swampspruce)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2015, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/90 "2015-06-03T14:02:20Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > 70 years ago, there was no such thing as a class-action lawsuit. > Society has changed; today we are much less tolerant of corporations causing people to die. > > When the first ,say, one hundred thousand self-driving cars start to share the roads with a half-billion regular cars, there are going to be LOT of problems. > The lawyers will make more money than Google. > My guess is that , in order to save the industry, the government will have to create a new type of law, restricting people from suing car manufacturers. You’re missing the point. There definitely was class action law suits in the 70s when the Pinto issue came out, and auto safety and design became better for it or when seat belts became mandatory. Just as airline safety got better when it was discovered that the Dehavilland Comet had cracks from having square windows, there are going to be problems to be overcome as **Enipla and Balance** have demonstrated. One of those issues will be “Who can I sue?” but isn’t that why the law is a living thing? The car still has to be registered to someone, and my guess is that is who the lawyers would go after. ---
**Author:** ![JcWoman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jcwoman/32/2889_2.png) [@JcWoman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JcWoman)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2015, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/91 "2015-06-03T14:28:02Z")
> [@Sailboat](#): > > Word. Right now there are many people on the road who _think_ they’re good drivers because I drive defensively. > > People say it’s not that bad. I can’t tell if these people just have a rosy view of the world, are inobservant, or so ignorant of traffic laws and safe driving they can’t spot danger and infractions. Exactly. What I notice is that we generally need to stop a lot, whether it’s for stop lights, signs, or just heavy traffic. Every time we stop, and the longer we stay stopped, the more people get bored and start doing other things: fiddling with phones, radios, whatever. And then there are a lot of people who would just rather be doing anything other than driving. A good example (besides yours) of a really bad driver is a friend of mine. She just can NOT keep her hands off her phone. If a text comes in, she has to read it, if she thinks of something she needs to call someone about, she has to do call them now. The other day we went on a long trip together and during her turn to drive, she asked me to google something. As I picked up my phone to do just that, she picked up hers and started fiddling with it, veered into another lane and got honked at. I told her “just drive, I’m looking it up”. I got a little cranky with her on that one. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/92 "2015-06-05T16:19:48Z")
> [@Balthisar](#): > > Plus, the rest of the world will come around eventually. This is some stunning optimism. > [@chappachula](#): > > Think of the total chaos on the roads of Bankok or Mumbai: Massive traffic jams, no white lines to mark the lanes, huge numbers of bicycles, rickshaws, pedestrians and animals in the streets, busses with dozens of people riding on the roof and hanging out the windows ,etc, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/93 "2015-06-05T16:29:21Z")
People in Mumbai and Bangkok came around to driving cars instead of riding horses, didn’t they? They might come around to self-driving cars for similar reasons. ---
**Author:** ![sparky\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/77aa72/32.png) [@sparky\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sparky_1)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2015, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/94 "2015-06-05T18:31:25Z")
> [@Anne\_Neville](#): > > People in Mumbai and Bangkok came around to driving cars instead of riding horses, didn’t they? They might come around to self-driving cars for similar reasons. Self driving horses? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2015, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/95 "2015-06-26T16:06:46Z")
Huge news here, people. Two self-driving cars did NOT crash into each other. You read that right – there was no accident, and it’s big news. > **[Self-driving cars nearly collide in California, news service says; Google...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/06/26/self-driving-cars-nearly-collide-in-california-raising-questions-about-the-technology/)** > > Robotic cars are undoubtedly safer, but pose some tricky philosophical problems. ---
**Author:** ![UncleRojelio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unclerojelio/32/3160_2.png) [@UncleRojelio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleRojelio)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2015, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197/96 "2015-06-26T18:07:24Z")
The thing I am most looking forward to about self-driving cars is being able to run stop signs and red lights with impunity. Since my car will know the velocity and direction of all the cars approaching an intersection it will automatically adjust itself to allow passing through the intersection without fear of colliding with any of the other cars. This, and this fact alone has me all atwitter with anticipation. I deeply lament every moment of my life I’ve spent waiting at red light when there is no cross traffic. Eliminating this waste will make me extremely happy. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-driving-cars-may-not-be-a-bad-thing/721197.md?page=4)