# Self-represented defendants in custody; do they get any accommodation from the jail or prison for that? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 15, 2021, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-represented-defendants-in-custody-do-they-get-any-accommodation-from-the-jail-or-prison-for-that/946581 "2021-07-15T19:15:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2021, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-represented-defendants-in-custody-do-they-get-any-accommodation-from-the-jail-or-prison-for-that/946581/1 "2021-07-15T19:15:32Z")
I’m listening just now to a podcast episode in which a murder defendant refused counsel and represented herself in court. Leaving aside all the questions this raises about the wisdom (or lack thereof) of doing so, this leads me to ask: Will the jail or prison allow the defendant any accommodations in terms of being given a room in which to work, being excused from the usual jail routines, and so on? Some kind of access to a legal database? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2021, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-represented-defendants-in-custody-do-they-get-any-accommodation-from-the-jail-or-prison-for-that/946581/2 "2021-07-15T19:40:26Z")
Aren’t all prisoners (except for those under extraordinary security measures) allowed access to the prison library? ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2021, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-represented-defendants-in-custody-do-they-get-any-accommodation-from-the-jail-or-prison-for-that/946581/3 "2021-07-15T20:08:50Z")
All US prisons have law libraries or means for inmates to access them. Inmates get time to use the library, they can work there or on their units. There’s not so much labor or job opportunity that needs to be done by inmates in a prison that it would prevent them from “working on my case”. (I hear that term a lot: “Doc, I didn’t come down for my lab tests that day because I was working on my case”.) ---
**Author:** ![Bootb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19b73/32.png) [@Bootb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bootb)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2021, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-represented-defendants-in-custody-do-they-get-any-accommodation-from-the-jail-or-prison-for-that/946581/4 "2021-07-16T00:30:05Z")
Here’s a real-world example from Colorado. > **[Court addresses 'security concerns' surrounding evidence in Stauch case | KRDO](https://krdo.com/news/local-news/2021/03/12/court-addresses-security-concerns-surrounding-evidence-in-stauch-case/)** > > COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. (KRDO) -- Letecia Stauch, accused of murdering her 11-year-old stepson Gannon Stauch in early 2020, faced a judge again at the El Paso County Courthouse on Friday to discuss access to evidence in jail and security concerns in... ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2021, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-represented-defendants-in-custody-do-they-get-any-accommodation-from-the-jail-or-prison-for-that/946581/5 "2021-07-16T00:51:13Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Aren’t all prisoners (except for those under extraordinary security measures) allowed access to the prison library? One of the difficulties, however, is that law libraries are increasingly online. That can set up issues where the accused needs online access to get current legal resources, like cases snd statutes, but may be under prohibitions in using the internet (eg, mobsters, fraudsters, child-porners, domestic violence/harassers). ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2021, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-represented-defendants-in-custody-do-they-get-any-accommodation-from-the-jail-or-prison-for-that/946581/6 "2021-07-16T03:11:03Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Aren’t all prisoners (except for those under extraordinary security measures) allowed access to the prison library? In my entire career, I never saw a prisoner in such heavy security that he was denied access to law library material. That would have been right up there with denying a prisoner food or medical care. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2021, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-represented-defendants-in-custody-do-they-get-any-accommodation-from-the-jail-or-prison-for-that/946581/7 "2021-07-16T14:17:41Z")
Everyone has access to the material, but presumably there are some high-security prisoners who aren’t allowed into the library itself (just like they might not be allowed into the cafeteria, but instead have meals brought to their cell). ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2021, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-represented-defendants-in-custody-do-they-get-any-accommodation-from-the-jail-or-prison-for-that/946581/8 "2021-07-16T15:01:33Z")
That works when the legal source is a book. Can raise problems when the way to access is by the internet. Bringing a computer with an outside link to the prisoner’s cell can raise security issues. Without going into details, I’m aware of some cases where the issue of internet access to legal materials was a security issue. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2021, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-represented-defendants-in-custody-do-they-get-any-accommodation-from-the-jail-or-prison-for-that/946581/9 "2021-07-16T16:51:44Z")
People held in prison (remand) awaiting trial (unconvicted) cannot be forced to perform penal labor, as it would be a violation of the 13th amendment. ---
**Author:** ![TheBigFig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@TheBigFig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheBigFig)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2021, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-represented-defendants-in-custody-do-they-get-any-accommodation-from-the-jail-or-prison-for-that/946581/10 "2021-07-17T01:39:41Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > In my entire career, I never saw a prisoner in such heavy security that he was denied access to law library material. That would have been right up there with denying a prisoner food or medical care. I have a friend who was recently released from state prison after about a year. During her entire period of incarceration, she was never allowed to visit the law library (or any library) due to COVID restrictions. I think she said that the only time she was allowed out of her cell block at all was for meals. I don’t know how common this is, but there are definitely prisons right now where access to the law library is restricted or non-existent. ---
**Author:** ![gdave](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gdave/32/3683_2.png) [@gdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gdave)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2021, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-represented-defendants-in-custody-do-they-get-any-accommodation-from-the-jail-or-prison-for-that/946581/11 "2021-07-17T01:53:54Z")
Note that @Little_Nemo referred to law library _material_. As referred to upthread, was your friend allowed access to law library material for consultation in her cell block, i.e. having books and material delivered to her cell? ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2021, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/self-represented-defendants-in-custody-do-they-get-any-accommodation-from-the-jail-or-prison-for-that/946581/12 "2021-07-17T15:11:24Z")
Ted Bundy famously escaped from custody by jumping out of a second story law library window in the courthouse (he was granted access because he was representing himself).