# Senator Frist wants Constitutional Amendment banning gay marriage **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 29, 2003, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211 "2003-06-29T20:04:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![DeskMonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f14d63/32.png) [@DeskMonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DeskMonkey)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/101 "2003-06-30T20:35:00Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > \*\* > 2. You insist on saying that “I’m dancing on Strom’s grave” when all I am doing is posting expressions of releif at his passing on a message board. Ypou allow no room for people to post negative opinions of Strom and his career without using the hyperbole of “grave-dancing.” > \*\* Do you feel it’s right to be happy about, celebrate, and enjoy his death? Because at some point, that’s where all this mess started. I just can’t help having this image of people spinning around in an office chair, clapping and squealing with joy. Needless to say, this is disturbing to me and others. Obviously you’re not sending a nice wreath to the funeral (nor am I), but can you say you’re actually happy about his death? Like Munchkin/Wicked Witch happy? Or just relieved, like Bowden family/Max Cady relieved? It seems like **Mockingbird** is assuming there are lots of people in the “gleeful” camp, but I’m starting to feel that’s not the case. Both you and **Otto** have made points to remove yourself from that and I’m wondering who **Mockingbird** is referring to when he says something to the effect of “some of us are enjoying his death”. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/102 "2003-06-30T20:35:25Z")
**Guin** yea, I know, hence the pity- and I agree it does tend to get into the ‘more oppressed than thou’ **Mockingbird** glad to give you some pleasure - there’s several reasons for misspellings in my posts, I type fast, often have typos, and my eyesight is pretty fucked up as well, so I don’t always spot them. BUt go ahead and be smug about finding an error in my post, it suits you. and I guess I’ll just have to live w/your opinion of my posts being ‘shoot mouth off w/out thinking’. I’ve not often gotten that comment (doesn’t mean that no one else thinks it of course), often get comments that suggest either agreement or a level of respect, even from people who do not share my opinion. Were I in the position of getting comments like “shrill” and “ramble” etc, from folks of all types of perspective, I’d be more concerned. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/103 "2003-06-30T20:38:48Z")
> [@](#): > > Or just relieved, like Bowden family/Max Cady relieved? That’s the one. I don’t enjoy death, but I am damned if I’m going to weep over an asshole like Strom Thurmond or express anything but relief that he will not be around to plague gay and black citizens. ---
**Author:** ![DeskMonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f14d63/32.png) [@DeskMonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DeskMonkey)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/104 "2003-06-30T20:43:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > \*\*That’s the one. I don’t enjoy death, but I am damned if I’m going to weep over an asshole like Strom Thurmond or express anything but relief that he will not be around to plague gay and black citizens. \*\* I’d find it odd if you felt any other way. I feel the same about tears of either sorrow and joy in this case. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/13edae/32.png) [@Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Cheatem_Undhow)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/105 "2003-06-30T21:31:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > \*\*You’re a bigot because you side with the homophobe and not his victims. Since you are not Queen of the Message Board, you don’t get to dictate what may or may not be posted, so if I choose to express relief that a hated oppressor is no longer around to make life difficult, that’s too goddamn bad for you. \*\* Jesus Christ, **gobear** , your asshattedness grows by the day. Suggesting that dancing on the grave of a homophobe might be inappropriate is not the same as “siding with the homophobe.” You really need to get over this paranoid persecution complex you have. Newsflash: just because some people don’t think every little thing you decide to do is the noble act of a freedom fighter battling on behalf of the oppressed does not make those people antigay. Get over yourself. ---
**Author:** ![jlzania](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/67e7ee/32.png) [@jlzania](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jlzania)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/106 "2003-06-30T21:51:55Z")
**Guinastasia** > [@](#): > > The “since you’re not \_\_\_, you can’t possibly understand” also tends to lead towards “more oppressed than thou” and people ignoring other groups that are targeted. I’m obviously not clearly articulating my point, **Guin**. if that’s what you think I’m saying. Because I’m human and have experienced pain, I can empathize when others are in pain. Because I’m human and have experienced suffering, I can empathize when others suffer. Because I’m human and have experienced prejudice, I can empathize when others rail against prejudice. However, I (hopefully) will never experience what gay men and women experience daily. Our commonalities and the ability to empathize allow me to understand some of their experiences by listening to their voices but I do think that there are some things you can’t comprehend until you live through them,despite having the best imagination in the world. Like war. Or death. Or the knowledge that you are a second-class citizen denied the equal right to love and live with whom you choose, regardless of their sex. I don’t think it boils to a game of “who’s more oppressed” although I do believe that some folk are more oppressed than others. Back in the days when I was playing radical revolutionary, I was whining on about how da man was oppressing me. A friend of mine gently reminded me that I could always go home. play the game, and assimilate back into my white middle-class life. She could never stop being black. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/107 "2003-06-30T21:53:40Z")
> [@](#): > > Suggesting that dancing on the grave of a homophobe might be inappropriate is not the same as “siding with the homophobe.” He decries negative opinions of Strom and any expressions of emotion that are less-than reverent as “grave dancing”. > [@](#): > > You really need to get over this paranoid persecution complex you have. Hey, did you need the Supreme Court to declare sex with your wife no longer criminal. No, then you do not know what the fuck you are talking about. > [@](#): > > Newsflash: just because some people don’t think every little thing you decide to do is the noble act of a freedom fighter battling on behalf of the oppressed does not make those people antigay. And just where did I make that claim? Disapproving of me is just disapproving of me, but defending an dead bigot’s memory from criticism without any attention being paid to the reasons why he has attracted such ire is antigay. Yes, it fucking well is. I will not allow you people to act as if Strom Thurmond were some innocent old geezer being attacked unfairly. Get over yourself. ---
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/108 "2003-06-30T21:58:46Z")
> [@](#): > > That’s the one. I don’t enjoy death, but I am damned if I’m going to weep over an asshole like Strom Thurmond or express anything but relief that he will not be around to plague gay and black citizens. How is that “dancing on Strom’s grave”? I repeat, I find it very revealing that you are more concerned with my disrespect for Strom’s death than you are with his disrespect for my life. A bigoted legislator may spend decades working to keep people like me second class citizens, but woe betide us if we respond with less than reverence at his passing. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/109 "2003-06-30T23:26:56Z")
I don’t rejoice at his death, but I did rejoice when he left the Senate. What happened during Strom’s final years in the Senate was obscene. His nearly lifeless body was propped up “Weekend at Bernie’s” style to rubber stamp the agenda of the most hatefull factions of the Republican Party. ---
**Author:** ![Tars\_Tarkas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Tars\_Tarkas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tars_Tarkas)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2003, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/110 "2003-06-30T23:48:13Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > \*\*How is that “dancing on Strom’s grave”? > > I repeat, I find it very revealing that you are more concerned with my disrespect for Strom’s death than you are with his disrespect for my life. > \*\* get him an account and i’ll flame him. > [@](#): > > A bigoted legislator may spend decades working to keep people like me second class citizens, but woe betide us if we respond with less than reverence at his passing. \*\* aren’t you supposed to be better than him? when will you start acting like it? ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/111 "2003-07-01T00:23:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > \*\*Senator Frist can do with his Bible what I do with my partner. \*\* I now have an image of Frist holding a Bible in front of him with his dick in the gutter. I mean, I’m sure he bookmarks the important passages, but that’s just grossing me out. ---
**Author:** ![Homebrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Homebrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homebrew)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/112 "2003-07-01T01:24:54Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Tars Tarkas \* > \*\*aren’t you supposed to be better than him? when will you start acting like it? \*\* That’s just rich. Are you really comparing venting on a damned internet message board to the very real, hateful things that Strom Thurmond did, through his years in the legislature, to both gays and blacks. Take a step back and see if you’re really comparing apples and grapes. ---
**Author:** ![Denis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5e9695/32.png) [@Denis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Denis)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/113 "2003-07-01T02:16:18Z")
I’ve gotta say I stand with **gobear** on this latest hijack. I don’t see him “dancing on the grave” of Thurmond. Frankly, I feel a “big fucking deal, who’s the next bigotted fuck gonna take his place?” kind of vibe myself. I don’t give much of a shit about what kind of moral cretinsim our legistators operate under (I rather expect it of them), I just want the fuckers to stop giving it the **force of law!** Yeah, yeah. Impossible. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/13edae/32.png) [@Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Cheatem_Undhow)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/114 "2003-07-01T02:38:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by gobear \* > \*\*He decries negative opinions of Strom and any expressions of emotion that are less-than reverent as “grave dancing”. \*\* I don’t see that as being his view – I doubt **Tars** has any problem with the obits that prominently discussed the corrosive effects Thurmond’s racial politics had on this country – but even if it is, that view is not “siding with the homophobes.” **Tars** (and my) position on how we treat our dead is not the same as endorsing the views held by the departed. \*\* > [@](#): > > Hey, did you need the Supreme Court to declare sex with your wife no longer criminal. No, then you do not know what the fuck you are talking about. \*\* No one challenges the notion that gay people have a difficult time in this country due to laws and attitudes that discriminate against them. No one’s suggested otherwise. But grasp this simple fact: **Tars** and I are not one of your persecutors. Let me say that again: **Tars and I are not one of your persecutors.** When you start tarring us as having “sided with the homophobes” – when you start suggesting that anyone who criticizes your actions as in league with homopobic elements – then you’re exhibiting a paranoid persecution complex. Everyone is not out to get you. You only make yourself look foolish when you act otherwise. \*\* > [@](#): > > I will not allow you people to act as if Strom Thurmond were some innocent old geezer being attacked unfairly. \*\* Again, I hardly think anyone was calling Thurmond an “innocent old geezer.” No one was suggesting that the factual record showed anything other than what it did. No one suggested that Thurmond’s views and politics be whitewashed from memory as his passing was noted. You’re beating up a straw man here. It is entirely possible to point out Thurmond’s record while still maintaining one’s dignity. ---
**Author:** ![summerbreeze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3bc359/32.png) [@summerbreeze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/summerbreeze)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/115 "2003-07-01T02:39:30Z")
Dr. Frist has got to love me; I married, had five children, all staunch Presbyterians, then met the love of my life, who is much more of a capitalist than my husband ever was. She and I own our home, two expensive cars, a farm, pay lots of taxes, take care of our elderly parents, adopt unwanted dogs, volunteer with Cities in Schools, attend church. We certainly don’t commit sodomy; we don’t have illegitimate children; we aren’t a heterosexual couple who could marry but choose not to make a commitment. In short, we are everything Frist wants people to be except for one thing – we are absolutely raving liberal Democrats. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/116 "2003-07-01T03:47:51Z")
This is not meant to criticize anyone here specifically. But for those who have scolded **gobear** for his reaction to Senator Thurman’s death, I am curious about something: Are you wanting gobear to change his feelings about Thurman? Do you want him to lie about his feelings? Do you want him not to share those feelings? Which of those are you objecting to? Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/117 "2003-07-01T03:59:36Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Tars Tarkas \* > \*\* aren’t you supposed to be better than him? when will you start acting like it? \*\* Blah, _blah_. Woof, _woof_. Hug the Earth sing kumbaya. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/118 "2003-07-01T04:03:36Z")
> [@](#): > > Are you wanting gobear to change his feelings about Thurman? Well, wait. I have nothing against Thurman. I kind of liked her in _Gattaca_. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/119 "2003-07-01T04:13:42Z")
**jlzania** , I think you misunderstand me-I was addressing what **wring** was saying. I agree, there are some things I can never truly KNOW or experience. However, as a human being, and I hope, a compassionate one, I can imagine how I might feel. And quite frankly-I’m a wimp, in that I cannot stand to see people suffer. For any reason. And bigotry is wrong. But in the past, **Mockingbird** has chosen to play this little game, claiming that even those who are trying to empathize with him are just weak, that they’ll NEVER EVER EVER understand how horribly oppressed he is. I forget the thread where it was, it was pretty bad. Okay, I’ll never know what it’s like to be gay. And he’ll never know what it’s like to have PMS. Does that mean that we humans can’t understand what it’s like to be well, shit on? ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2003, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211/120 "2003-07-01T04:22:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Guinastasia \* > \*\*But in the past, **Mockingbird** has chosen to play this little game, claiming that even those who are trying to empathize with him are just weak, that they’ll NEVER EVER EVER understand how horribly oppressed he is. > \*\* I have **NEVER**. _EVER_. said anything like that. I dare you to find cites from my posting history to support that or RETRACT it, you sycophantic bandwagon jumping social misfit. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senator-frist-wants-constitutional-amendment-banning-gay-marriage/185211.md?page=7)