# Sending the wrong message **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 22, 2010, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065 "2010-06-22T00:00:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Suburban\_Plankton](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/suburban_plankton/32/219_2.png) [@Suburban\_Plankton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Suburban_Plankton)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/21 "2010-06-22T17:23:20Z")
> [@Sam\_A.Robrin](#): > > Then there are the layered messages. I was just discussing Shel Silverstein’s _The Giving Tree_ with a parent of a young child. It teaches us that if you give and give and give, your love will remain strong. But just below the surface is the message the kids are actually getting: If you take and take and take, she’ll still love you anyway, so take and take and take until she’s worn down to nothing. God, I hate that book…I read it as a child, and what I got out of it was, “Man, that guy is a jerk! The tree gives and gives and gives, and what does he do in return? He cuts it down! What an ass!!!” Now, it has been 30-some years since I read it, so I may not be remembering the subtle intricacies of the story, or I may in fact be remembering it completely wrong, but there’s no way in hell I’ll ever reread it to find out because it’s the Most Awful Story Ever Written… I’ll stop now, before I get started on _To Build a Fire_… ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/22 "2010-06-22T17:34:50Z")
> [@Suburban\_Plankton](#): > > I’ll stop now, before I get started on _To Build a Fire_… OK, how does that one get interpreted wrongly/in the worst possible way? I thought the message of that was “don’t be an idiot; Nature can kill you easily if you’re not smart and prepared.” ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/23 "2010-06-22T17:37:50Z")
Cinderella, Snow White et al: Marry a prince and you’ll live happily ever after. Princess Diana fell for that one and look where it got her. That’s why I love Gregory Maguire’s books. He adds realism to fairy tales. ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/24 "2010-06-22T17:40:24Z")
Oh, Lord, The Giving Tree. There was a thread a couple years ago here about that book that was at least two pages of people arguing over whether it showed unconditional love or abuse. I fall on the side of the latter–that kid/man was a total ass. ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/25 "2010-06-22T17:48:10Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > That’s why I love Gregory Maguire’s books. He adds realism to fairy tales. Have you ever seen _Into the Woods_? In short, Cinderella and Rapunzel marry their princes and live happily ever after. That’s the end of Act I. Act II gets a little more interesting. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/26 "2010-06-22T17:57:51Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > Oh, Lord, The Giving Tree. There was a thread a couple years ago here about that book that was at least two pages of people arguing over whether it showed unconditional love or abuse. I fall on the side of the latter–that kid/man was a total ass. I’ve got an early edition with the original title: **“The Codependent Enabling Lack-Of-Self-Esteem Tree”** ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/27 "2010-06-22T18:22:25Z")
> [@CrazyCatLady](#): > > Rudolph the Red-nosed Reindeer: if you’re different in any way, the best you can hope for is that the people who mock, ostracize, and mistreat you will be stop being such blatant dicks after you pull their asses out of the fire. It is pretty pathetic how desperately Rudolph races to help those who tormented him. It’d been better if he’d made them debase themselves to get his help, “Oh, I’m not good enough for your games, but now that you _need_ my help, suddenly I’m great? My nose may be red, but at least it isn’t brown.” ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/28 "2010-06-22T18:24:40Z")
Don’t forget my very favorite, Forrest Gump. It’s good to be stupid. Being smart just makes people unhappy. Also, it gives them AIDS. ---
**Author:** ![cjepson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a9adbd/32.png) [@cjepson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cjepson)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/29 "2010-06-22T18:30:34Z")
nm ---
**Author:** ![tdn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/94ad74/32.png) [@tdn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tdn)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/30 "2010-06-22T18:31:25Z")
> [@Hypno-Toad](#): > > It is pretty pathetic how desperately Rudolph races to help those who tormented him. It’d been better if he’d made them debase themselves to get his help, > > “Oh, I’m not good enough for your games, but now that you _need_ my help, suddenly I’m great? My nose may be red, but at least it isn’t brown.” He should have gone all [Raging Rudolph](http://www.metacafe.com/watch/44906/funny_videos_raging_rudolph/) on them. ---
**Author:** ![Hampshire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hampshire/32/4887_2.png) [@Hampshire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hampshire)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/31 "2010-06-22T18:41:43Z")
> [@Hypno-Toad](#): > > It is pretty pathetic how desperately Rudolph races to help those who tormented him. It’d been better if he’d made them debase themselves to get his help, > > “Oh, I’m not good enough for your games, but now that you _need_ my help, suddenly I’m great? My nose may be red, but at least it isn’t brown.” The Rudolph one is downright scary. Santa pretty much comes right out and tells Donner that he should be ashamed of himself for having a kid with an abnormality. Rudolph is shunned from their community until they find a way to exploit his handicap. Hurray! ---
**Author:** ![Hampshire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hampshire/32/4887_2.png) [@Hampshire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hampshire)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/32 "2010-06-22T18:45:48Z")
Toy Story I & II: Don’t ever ever throw your toys away. Start those hoarding tendencies early. ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/33 "2010-06-22T18:54:25Z")
> [@Hampshire](#): > > The Rudolph one is downright scary. Santa pretty much comes right out and tells Donner that he should be ashamed of himself for having a kid with an abnormality. > Rudolph is shunned from their community until they find a way to exploit his handicap. Hurray! And don’t forget the Island of Misfit Toys, showing that there’s a history of hiding anyone who doesn’t fit their strict standards of normal. ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/34 "2010-06-22T18:59:25Z")
> [@tdn](#): > > He should have gone all [Raging Rudolph](http://www.metacafe.com/watch/44906/funny_videos_raging_rudolph/) on them. Excellent. Freakin’ excellent. ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/35 "2010-06-22T19:01:35Z")
**How the Grinch Stole Christmas** : it doesn’t matter if you live in a cave on a mountaintop a mile from your nearest neighbors. When _other people_ want to party, you have no right to peace and quiet in your own home. ---
**Author:** ![kath94](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/67e7ee/32.png) [@kath94](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kath94)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/36 "2010-06-22T19:12:09Z")
> [@Hampshire](#): > > Toy Story I & II: Don’t ever ever throw your toys away. Start those hoarding tendencies early. Yeah, just wait until you see Toy Story III. Try getting your kids to throw away old toys or even donate them NOW! ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/37 "2010-06-22T19:20:18Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > Shrek: Ugly people can’t be with beautiful people > Grease: To get and keep your man, you have to be slutty > Ferris Beuller’s Day Off: Be a dick to everyone and make your friends pay the consequences > The Breakfast Club: Stop being different, except if you’re a smart nerd. If you’re a smart nerd, do everyone else’s homework for them and be alone. > > Any others? Shrek- I was put off by the “Water finds its own level” lesson. You’re ugly? You better find another ugly person to love you. Grease- People ignore than Travolta changes for her as well. He becomes a jock, she becomes a…slut. It’s when they see how far each other was willing to go for the other, they cut through the bullshit and can get together. It’s not a bad message. ---
**Author:** ![teela\_brown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/d9b06d/32.png) [@teela\_brown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/teela_brown)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/38 "2010-06-22T19:30:07Z")
_Lawrence of Arabia_: Dedicate your life to helping a lot of divergent tribes get together and form a country, and as you leave to return to England, they all turn on each other and start fighting. ---
**Author:** ![Electric\_Warrior](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@Electric\_Warrior](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Electric_Warrior)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/39 "2010-06-22T19:35:10Z")
Mulan: Pretending to be a boy and fighting for your country is just a way to get yourself hurt. The real goal for a young independent girl is to just find a rich man to marry. The Rainbow Fish: If you’re different, no one will love you. Also, if you have something nice you should give it to other people because one person can’t have all the nice things. Alice in Wonderland (2009): In imaginary worlds, whichever powerful monarch you have allegiance to is ALWAYS right and should crush all other entities with claims on land. Wait… that could work in real life too, couldn’t it? Yay, let’s go colonize China! EDIT: Aaaannnd I just realized that the two conflicting powers in Underland are THE WHITE QUEEN and THE RED QUEEN. WTF? Actually on that note, the original Alice in Wonderland: Nothing interesting happens in real life. Live with it. > [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > The Breakfast Club: Stop being different, except if you’re a smart nerd. If you’re a smart nerd, do everyone else’s homework for them and be alone. Also - that abusive bully who destroys property, refuses to get a high school education, and harasses and molests girls until they answer extremely personal questions about their sex lives just to be left alone? Really just needs to be loved. By the girl he harasses. Yeah. ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065/40 "2010-06-22T19:39:40Z")
**Pretty Woman** : If you’re poor and trying to raise money so you can go to college and better yourself, forget it - just get yourself a sugar daddy (preferably for keeps), because money makes you awesome. Who needs college? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sending-the-wrong-message/544065.md?page=3)