# Senile Jimmy Carter Explains Animosity Toward President Obama **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 17, 2009, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464 "2009-09-17T17:43:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/41 "2009-09-17T19:04:18Z")
Strange duplicate post. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/42 "2009-09-17T19:07:05Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > When the Clintons were pushing their health care, were people marching on Washington with signs calling them communists and nazis? I don’t remember. I don’t either, but they were petty and small. I do recall how Clinton was allegedly a drug dealer/murderer/rapist and on and on. ---
**Author:** ![VanLandry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/eb9ed0/32.png) [@VanLandry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VanLandry)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/43 "2009-09-17T19:08:04Z")
> [@](#): > > Or, just perhaps, we could save the accusations of racism for instances when it is demonstrably true, rather than cheapening it and hurling it about with impunity. Well said, Airman. I couldnt agree more. Racism still exists and show’s it’s ugly head from time to time but this isnt one of 'em. I’m a little suspicious that this is actually a smokescreen to detract from the actual issue’s regarding the healthcare bill. We’re no longer debating illegal aliens getting free healthcare and /or how 30 million new patients will be “cutting in line to see _my_ doctor!” It’s now been reduced to “You’re a racist!” and “No, I’m not!!!”, “Are”, “Not”,… ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/44 "2009-09-17T19:14:37Z")
Health Care reform has had very little to do with the teabaggers’ opposition to health care reform. I think religious nutbaggery plays into it as much or more than racism. I saw a poll on Rachel Maddow showing that about 1/3 of self-identified conservatives believes that Barack Obama is or may be the Antichrist. Wherever that kind of crap comes from (along with the birther/deather kind of nonsense, it’s got nothing to do with health care policy. ---
**Author:** ![Baracus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/2bfe46/32.png) [@Baracus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baracus)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/45 "2009-09-17T19:15:14Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > Or, just perhaps, we could save the accusations of racism for instances when it is demonstrably true, rather than cheapening it and hurling it about with impunity. I agree with this. No doubt some of the batshit insane anti-Obama sentiment is due to racism, but where on the spectrum from polite disagreement to what we have now, does one go from merely having idealogical differences to being racist? I don’t see what the purpose of making the accusation is either. The true racists aren’t going to be won over. Without explicit acts of racism, I am inclined to think that many on the fence regarding Obama are going to see this as the prediction of “everybody who disagrees with Obama will be labeled a racist” coming true. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/46 "2009-09-17T19:16:14Z")
Let’s be clear here, it is NOT the opposition that is racist, it is the virulent, violent, out-of-control oppositon that is largely based on racism in my book. And I do believe there is a certain level of disrespect there that would not be the same with a white president. This does not mean that if you disagree with the President you are racist. ---
**Author:** ![Jodi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7feea3/32.png) [@Jodi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jodi)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/47 "2009-09-17T19:20:33Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I was addressing the OP’s assertion that Carter claimed that “anybody who disagrees with Obama” is racist (a contention I notice you don’t seem too concerned about challenging). I just looked at Carter’s exact words. I didn’t even really notice the Joe Wilson stuff, I was examing the exact quote. Given Wilson’s history, though, it’s not a stretch. Okay; no prob. > [@](#): > > “Grave” and “serious” accusations were made about Jimmy Carter by the OP, but that doesn’ts eem to bother you. Well, no. One is Jimmy Carter; the other is **ralph124c**. Which one should I take seriously? > [@](#): > > Wilson’s history includes membership in a group called [Sons of Confederate Veterans](http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?pid=1027) which endorses the “confederate cause,” including secession and slavery, rabiid support of the Confederate flag and the above cited attacks on Strom Thurmond’s daughter. The article you cite – a very interesting one too, thank you – documents a recent wrench to the far right into racism by that group. It does not document that the group endorses secession and slavery, nor does it say whether Joe Wilson is still a member. Seems like the group had quite a few moderate members before; and it seems they’ve all left at this point. ETA: And I should clarify that as a non-native Southerner with an interest in history, I am very skeptical of all groups claiming to be the Confederate anything, as I suspect a less than objective agenda on that basis alone. ---
**Author:** ![SaharaTea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@SaharaTea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SaharaTea)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/48 "2009-09-17T19:22:16Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > Let’s be clear here, it is NOT the opposition that is racist, it is the virulent, violent, out-of-control oppositon that is largely based on racism in my book. And I do believe there is a certain level of disrespect there that would not be the same with a white president. > > This does not mean that if you disagree with the President you are racist. Agreed. I can’t say for certain if Joe Wilson is a racist, although the evidence against him isn’t good. But I do think it’s incredibly naive to say that racism plays no part at all in any of the opposition, especially when I see [images like this](http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/09/17/obama.witchdoctor.teaparty/)being carried around by teabaggers at the protests in Washington last weekend. ---
**Author:** ![Hampshire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hampshire/32/4887_2.png) [@Hampshire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hampshire)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/49 "2009-09-17T19:23:04Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > He just KNOWS that anybody who disgrees with Obama is a racist! I don’t think Carter is referring to just anybody who may disagree with the president. He makes a point to say it’s the majority of the **intensely demonstrated animosity** being seen. Don’t like the stimulus package- fine, don’t like the bailouts- fine, don’t like certain aspects of the health care reform- fine. But when I see people up in arms about anything he does just because he’s doing it (i.e. adressing school kids, just mentioning the words ‘healthcare reform’) you have to wonder what their motive is? “I hate him!” “Why?” “Because I just hate him!” :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/50 "2009-09-17T19:24:47Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > Let’s be clear here, it is NOT the opposition that is racist, it is the virulent, violent, out-of-control oppositon that is largely based on racism in my book. And I do believe there is a certain level of disrespect there that would not be the same with a white president. > > This does not mean that if you disagree with the President you are racist. The disrespect shown to Obama is greater than the disrespect shown any other President? Surely you jest. If anything the guy is getting much more respect than his predecessor, and more than any President in my lifetime with the possible exception of Reagan. I am clearly not attuned to this alleged racism, because I haven’t seen it. Oh, I’ve heard the allegations, but I have yet to see anything demonstrably racist from mainstream America. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/51 "2009-09-17T19:25:55Z")
This may come as a surprise to some, but I don’t feel Carter has become senile either. He’s _always_ been like that! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/52 "2009-09-17T19:30:24Z")
For me an indication that Carter is basically correct in his is assessment is twofold: first, I already thought that, so it MUST be right. And second, the objections to Obama have been unusually irrational. There’s always gonna be someone disagreeing with the president. And there’s always gonna be irrational people in that group. But there’s such an imbalance of irrational responses to rational ones in Obama’s detractors that it seems to me a pretty clear indicator that there’s something unspoken in back of it. And while this doesn’t prove any kind of universal racism in ANYone who disagrees with Obama, I think it’s a valid consideration in such cases as, for example, Joe Wilson. Wilson, first, represents a state that has had less compunction about political expressions of racism than most states. And second, the degree of irrationality in Wilson’s outburst: Obama was NOT lying, and Wilson’s reaction was clearly due to an emotionally overwhelming–i.e., irrational–reaction. So all things considered, I think Carter is largely correct about Wilson, and further I think racism is a valid consideration in analyzing much of the negative reaction to Obama. (The alternative is to believe either than NONE of Obama’s detractors are racist, or that racists are keeping their objections to themselves. Neither of which seems as likely as the possibility that racists are voicing their objections to Obama, but they’re not being up front about their racism.) ---
**Author:** ![Alienhand](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8edcca/32.png) [@Alienhand](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alienhand)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/53 "2009-09-17T19:31:09Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Health Care reform has had very little to do with the teabaggers’ opposition to health care reform. > > I think religious nutbaggery plays into it as much or more than racism. I saw a poll on Rachel Maddow showing that about 1/3 of self-identified conservatives believes that Barack Obama is or may be the Antichrist. Wherever that kind of crap comes from (along with the birther/deather kind of nonsense, it’s got nothing to do with health care policy. That was this [PPP poll](http://publicpolicypolling.blogspot.com/2009/09/extremism-in-new-jersey.html) (14% yes 15% not sure). I remember the Bush New World Order and Reagan 666 crap so I’m not sure if the percentages are anything higher than normal. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/54 "2009-09-17T19:35:47Z")
> [@Alienhand](#): > > That was this [PPP poll](http://publicpolicypolling.blogspot.com/2009/09/extremism-in-new-jersey.html) (14% yes 15% not sure). I remember the Bush New World Order and Reagan 666 crap so I’m not sure if the percentages are anything higher than normal. 14% said yes, 15% said “not sure.” That makes 29% of Republicans who at least think it’s possible. That’s bananas. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/55 "2009-09-17T19:36:43Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Same link: Circumstantial evidence of racism there, though not of it being behind that particular display of childishness. [HIJACK]If it were [this flag](http://media-2.web.britannica.com/eb-media/83/4483-004-A28E7C24.gif) or [even this one](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e2/Confederate_National_Flag_since_Mar_4_1865.svg/800px-Confederate_National_Flag_since_Mar_4_1865.svg.png) I’d agree, but it wasn’t. It was [this one](http://scrapetv.com/News/News%20Pages/usa/Images/confederate-flag.jpg) that he supported flying above the South Carolina capitol when in fact it NEVER flew over the South Carolina state capitol during the war and was raised only after it had become a KKK symbol. It’s sometimes called the Confederate Battle Flag but that too is incorrect. For one thing the Confederacy had hundreds of battle flags- most regiments had their own and in fact that was the whole point (if you’re separated you can go towards your regiments flag). The Confederate battle flag that had that basic design was usually square (most famously Robert E. Lee’s [Army of Northern Virginia flag](http://goodoldrebel.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/600pxbattle-flag-of-the-us-confederacy-svg.png), though again individual regiments within the Army often had their own, usually [something like this](http://homepages.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~colburn/AL40thFlag.JPG).) The rectangular flag was very rarely used as a battle flag other than for the Confederate navy, which was never more than 1% of the Confederate armed forces. HOWEVER- and this is important- the naval jack became famous after _Birth of a Nation_ and the rebirth of the Klan. The KKK has used that flag as a symbol for almost 90 years; they were responsible for its popularity, and the flag is indelibly linked to them. So, short version, the flag Wilson supported has a history but it’s racism. In my experience many people do not know that the naval jack is NOT the Confederate flag and Wilson may be one of them, but ignorance is unpardonable when acting as an elected official on such a heated issue. (Whenever I see the [Heritage Not Hate](http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.fotw.net/images/u/us-csah.gif&imgrefurl=http://www.fotw.net/flags/us-csa.html&h=217&w=342&sz=13&tbnid=KWlxEKH4GkniyM:&tbnh=76&tbnw=120&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dheritage%2Bnot%2Bhate&usg=__71w5YdG0yClGB71GdeCbh-m2p7g=&ei=ho-ySr6WGsHClAfC_b2BDw&sa=X&oi=image_result&resnum=1&ct=image)signs I always want to ask the owners what units their ancestors served in; I’d lay you even money they wouldn’t have a clue and probably wouldn’t understand the question, and 10:1 that none of the units used that flag, thus the heritage is that of the KKK.)[/HIJACK] ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Joe\_Meager](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bb73d2/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Joe\_Meager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Joe_Meager)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/56 "2009-09-17T19:39:50Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > I don’t think I’ve seen this much animosity towards a president – hell, even Bush didn’t get this much bullshit. Are you absolutely feckin serious? “Bush lied, people died.” Ever heard that one before? Huh? Bush II was widely accused of lying in the events leading up to the war in Iraq. As a result of his lying, people lost their lives. Or, so goes the meme. “Bush lied, people died.” A direct cause and effect link. Obama lied, but nobody has accused him of actually causing anyone to lose their life. So what is that again about “Bush didn’t get this much bullshit”? Bush got this and more. And don’t even try to start with the “death panels”. Most people on this board (including me) don’t believe they’d actually exist or actually cause the (premature) death of anyone. But a heck of a lot of people on this board (not including me), who \*don’t \*believe “Obama lied, there really will be death panels!”, have fully bought into the notion that “Bush lied, people died!” In addition to worshipers, servants, and whores, in this thread we now see the emergence of a new class of Obamaton – the fellators. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/57 "2009-09-17T19:41:27Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > The disrespect shown to Obama is greater than the disrespect shown any other President? Surely you jest. If anything the guy is getting much more respect than his predecessor, and more than any President in my lifetime with the possible exception of Reagan. Reall? he has been President for less than 10 months, inherited a massive economic shitstorm and a two ridiculous wars. However, we all know they bs started almost immediately. For many of us it is simply the disresepect he got immediately despite being democratically elected. And in my mind a large part of that instant disrespect was due to the color of his skin. Do I have absolute proof, no, but it is what I believe. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/58 "2009-09-17T19:43:30Z")
> [@Jimmy\_Joe\_Meager](#): > > Are you absolutely feckin serious? > > “Bush lied, people died.” Ever heard that one before? Huh? > > Bush II was widely accused of lying in the events leading up to the war in Iraq. As a result of his lying, people lost their lives. Or, so goes the meme. “Bush lied, people died.” A direct cause and effect link. > > Obama lied, but nobody has accused him of actually causing anyone to lose their life. So what is that again about “Bush didn’t get this much bullshit”? Bush got this and more. > > And don’t even try to start with the “death panels”. Most people on this board (including me) don’t believe they’d actually exist or actually cause the (premature) death of anyone. But a heck of a lot of people on this board (not including me), who \*don’t \*believe “Obama lied, there really will be death panels!”, have fully bought into the notion that “Bush lied, people died!” > > In addition to worshipers, servants, and whores, in this thread we now see the emergence of a new class of Obamaton – the fellators. Um, Bush did lie and now almost 5000 Ameircans have died (and tens of thousand more Iaqis) has a lot more eveidence and truth behind it then , “You lie!” ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Joe\_Meager](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bb73d2/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Joe\_Meager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Joe_Meager)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/59 "2009-09-17T19:43:32Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > I saw a poll on Rachel Maddow… Oh good gawd. You do realize that this statement carries about as much weight as “I saw a poll on Bill O’Reilly…” don’t you? Oh, you don’t. ---
**Author:** ![redtail23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/3e96dc/32.png) [@redtail23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/redtail23)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2009, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464/60 "2009-09-17T19:44:05Z")
I’ve heard too many comments along the lines of “ain’t no damn nigger can be President” coming from the same types of loonies as at the 9-12 protest to believe that it’s NOT based on race to a large extent. The birthers, insisting that the man is Kenyan? Oh, no, _that’s_ not racism, not at all! The religious whackos, who insist that he’s Muslim and therefore shouldn’t be President of our Christian nation? No, no, no racism there. The “he’s a socialist, a fascist, a communist, AND a Nazi” crowd? OK, they’re just stupid. But I’d bet money that a lot of them are upset by his race. Hell, my MIL refused to vote in the election. She approved of much of the Democratic platform and was sick to death of the Republican bullshit, but she would NOT vote for a black man for President. (She’s 94, so I cut her some slack.) I’m absolutely not saying that anyone who opposes Obama is a racist, and I haven’t seen any one else saying that either. I don’t suppose one of y’all who are claiming that’s what is happening can back that idea up with anything but a vague feeling? I have no problem with people who legitimately disagree with the President’s ideas or positions, and I don’t think that those people are racist. Carter wasn’t talking about mainstream America, nor are the posters here who are defending him. The people we’re talking about are the lunatics like [these](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUPMjC9mq5Y) people. Remember the pre-election video of the people with Obama monkeys? Yeah, those guys too. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/senile-jimmy-carter-explains-animosity-toward-president-obama/510464.md?page=4)