# Sensata: Romney's Hypocrisy **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 27, 2012, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043 "2012-10-27T13:17:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/41 "2012-10-27T20:29:47Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > A funny sort of evolution. Nationalism used to be a cornerstone of the authoritarian right mentality. Very foundation of classical fascism. Now, business is more “international”, it has much less any “patriotic” element. They still pretend to it, as it enhances their standing, but they have no real loyalty to any country, be it Germany or the US. China is still new at this whole capitalism thing, they are still very intently nationalistic, like the Japanese, they regard the success of their businesses as the advancement of their country. > > American business is all grown up, and has long since set aside such sentimental concerns. Maybe that’s a good thing. Fucked if I know. I don’t think it’s such a good thing. Nationalism still means feeling some sense of shared destiny with other people, even if it’s just people from one country. These post-nationalists are loyal only to themselves. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/42 "2012-10-27T20:37:29Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > (D)on’t you think it would bolster his argument a little better to decry an act of offshoring that was actually happening, instead of one that wasn’t? > [@John\_Mace](#): > > Yes, it would. I wonder why he did that… Any guesses? ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/43 "2012-10-27T20:40:02Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I don’t think it’s such a good thing. Nationalism still means feeling some sense of shared destiny with other people, even if it’s just people from one country. These post-nationalists are loyal only to themselves. While expecting nationalism from everyone else; “support the troops”, “I honor your service to our country”, etc. But if we raise taxes on the rich a few percent, it seems to be just accepted that they’ll move to another country. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/44 "2012-10-27T21:15:36Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > More of your bullshit false equivalencies. > . . . > you are idiotically and astoundingly wrong. What you said was dumb and you should feel dumb for saying it.) Knock it off. This is not The BBQ Pit. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/45 "2012-10-27T21:17:50Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > I wonder why he did that… Any guesses? Did what? Use an example that wasn’t actually true? Who knows. Sloppy research by his staff. He was searching for some “bad news” for Ohioans to latch onto since he has a chance to win that state. This is Populist Romney. Just one of the many personas you get if you vote for him. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/46 "2012-10-27T21:38:51Z")
If I ever hear him describe something as “groovy” I will go totally stabby. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/47 "2012-10-27T22:40:45Z")
How about “swell”? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/48 "2012-10-27T22:53:17Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Did what? Use an example that wasn’t actually true? Who knows. Sloppy research by his staff. He was searching for some “bad news” for Ohioans to latch onto since he has a chance to win that state. This is Populist Romney. Just one of the many personas you get if you vote for him. No, I mean why he would use a made-up example when there is an example that he undoubtedly has to know about that he has yet to comment on. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 27, 2012, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/49 "2012-10-27T23:20:59Z")
> [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](#): > > No, I mean why he would use a made-up example when there is an example that he undoubtedly has to know about that he has yet to comment on. Because it would be politically stupid to do so? But I think you over-estimate how much Romney knows about the day-to-day goings on at Bain. He’s been gone from there for over a decade. There’s a good chance he _might_ know, but it’s certainly it’s not “undoubtable” that he does. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/50 "2012-10-28T01:16:01Z")
And note the double standard. The President is not responsible for the day to day operations of the federal government even though he is actually in charge, yet Romney is responsible for a company he hasn’t had a management role in since Bill Clinton was President. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/51 "2012-10-28T01:48:16Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > And note the double standard. The President is not responsible for the day to day operations of the federal government even though he is actually in charge… No one in this thread is saying that. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/52 "2012-10-28T03:45:32Z")
Not this thread, but we’ve had LONG conversations about it in other threads. The double standard does exist and always has. It’s not partisan, we just expect higher standards from the private sector than we do from our government. Which is an argument for bringing that kind of accountability to our government by installing someone who is used to that accountability. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/53 "2012-10-28T03:56:48Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Not this thread, but we’ve had LONG conversations about it in other threads. Cite, please? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/54 "2012-10-28T05:09:11Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Not this thread, but we’ve had LONG conversations about it in other threads. The double standard does exist and always has. It’s not partisan, we just expect higher standards from the private sector than we do from our government. Which is an argument for bringing that kind of accountability to our government by installing someone who is used to that accountability. Well, if the same posters are saying that in other threads, do call them out. But if it’s just some other posters, then so what? I don’t see the point of calling out poster X for statements made my poster Y. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/55 "2012-10-28T05:20:55Z")
Fair enough. I was assuming there was consensus on that point since I was completely alone in the other thread arguing that the President was accountable for what happens in his administration. [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=662283&highlight=fast+furious&page=5](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=662283&highlight=fast+furious&page=5) ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/56 "2012-10-28T05:43:23Z")
To avoid a thread hijack, I’ll just conclude this line of argument by pointing out that the public is very forgiving towards Presidents for things that happen in their administration that they were not directly involved in. For all “the buck stops here” talk, the buck in practice tends to stop with an underling and the public generally accepts that. It is very unlikely that the public would hold something against Mitt Romney for something a company he formerly led has done. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/57 "2012-10-28T05:46:50Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > And note the double standard. The President is not responsible for the day to day operations of the federal government even though he is actually in charge, yet Romney is responsible for a company he hasn’t had a management role in since Bill Clinton was President. If Mitt Romney cannot control it for a company he started and still makes millions of dollars a year from, what makes you think he can control it for the county? Even if he cannot control it as you allege (something I don’t buy) nothing is stopping him from divesting himself of whatever is owed him. He could even make a big announcement and come off looking good. Yet, he doesn’t. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/58 "2012-10-28T05:56:37Z")
No candidate is going to come out in support of outsourcing, but a grand display in opposition to it would be over the top and give more credence to the Luddites than they deserve. As for how well Romney can run his administration, we’ve seen how well Romney runs things when he is actually in charge of them. The best his opponents can do is try to pin things on him that weren’t under his control, while at the same time supporting an incumbent with multiple failures that cost lives. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/59 "2012-10-28T07:24:29Z")
BTW, helpful short video on outsourcing: [http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/what-the-candidates-wont-explain-about-outsourcing/](http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/what-the-candidates-wont-explain-about-outsourcing/) Now it would be nice if we could get leadership to explain why this stuff is actually good in many cases. Last guy to come right out and defend free trade was Bill Clinton. Since then, candidates have been content to demagogue and cater to people’s fears. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [October 28, 2012, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043/60 "2012-10-28T09:25:41Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > No candidate is going to come out in support of outsourcing, but a grand display in opposition to it would be over the top and give more credence to the Luddites than they deserve. He doesn’t deserve to be in the White House if he rails against outsourcing while profiting from it. Period. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sensata-romneys-hypocrisy/639043.md?page=4)