# Sequels that ruin the original movie **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 5, 2017, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400 "2017-01-05T17:21:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Richard\_John\_Marcej](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Richard\_John\_Marcej](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_John_Marcej)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/61 "2017-01-06T20:14:55Z")
> [@WOOKINPANUB](#): > > I don’t think it ruins the experience of viewing / the memory of the first one, but I think it can change the meaning or impact of the first one. Like \*\*Max Torque’\*\*s excellent example of _Blair Witch II,_ the whole impact of that film is that we’re supposedly watching the last days of these three hikers’ lives. That’s the universe we work within, the reason the end shot is so impactful. To be told in the sequel that the original film was never meant to be real totally contradicts what we saw before and completely changes the meaning of it. I saw BWII and thought it sucked tremendously all on it’s own pathetic self and while it didn’t diminish the enjoyment I got our of the original it just felt somehow \*disrespectful \*for lack of a better word. Wait, wasn’t there a sequel to Blair Witch made years ago? I only saw the original and had no interest in seeing the latest film, but I could have sworn they made a second one already. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/62 "2017-01-06T20:18:14Z")
I guess it also helps me that I don’t take this stuff like movies seriously. It’s just entertainment , nothing more. ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanub/32/132_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUB)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/63 "2017-01-06T20:28:07Z")
> [@Richard\_John\_Marcej](#): > > Wait, wasn’t there a sequel to Blair Witch made years ago? I only saw the original and had no interest in seeing the latest film, but I could have sworn they made a second one already. Yes, sorry. The sequel to which I was referring is _Book of Shadows_ (I _think_ BW II was part of the title). The one that came out recently is just called\* Blair Witch\* and is allegedly supposed to be more of an actual sequel, though I’ve not yet seen it. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/64 "2017-01-06T20:29:14Z")
I saw Howard the Duck but I guess it doesn’t matter how bad it was since I don’t read any comic books. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/65 "2017-01-06T20:42:17Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > I guess it also helps me that I don’t take this stuff like movies seriously. It’s just entertainment , nothing more. Sure. And it’s more entertaining when there’s not a terrible sequel invalidating the movie you’re watching 😛 I doubt anyone here is some rabid Blair Witch obsessed fan and yet several say that the sequel messes up the first movie for them. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/66 "2017-01-06T20:48:15Z")
the real issue is that hollywood doesn’t want to spend time for original stories. So we get James Bond 500 or whatever they are up to now . Eventually we will get Star Trek 300, Star Wars 1000, etc. And they can even take a short book like hobbit and make 3 movies out of it. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/67 "2017-01-06T21:12:37Z")
> [@stillownedbysetters](#): > > **The Matrix** was a gem of a movie, quirky, imaginative and new. Matrix 2 and 3 were progressively awful and made me begin to resent the first movie which occasioned them. Well, shit, someone had to, like answer all those drunken dorm-room conundrums. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Torque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Max\_Torque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Torque)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/68 "2017-01-06T22:01:22Z")
A big part of the problem is us, the movie-watching public. We are comfortable with things we know. We like going to movies where we recognize the characters, or the universe, or the plotline, or even just the actors. These comfortable movies always make a profit. Not necessarily a huge profit, but enough. And so, we get more of the same, and we pay to watch it, and apparently everyone’s happy. Occasionally you get something that breaks with formula that becomes a success. Now, it’s lovely when that happens, but it’s too risky for the guys in the big offices. And honestly, when movies cost $10+ per ticket, we don’t want to risk our money on a dud either. So, we stick with what we know, and movies remain a safe packaged product. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/69 "2017-01-06T22:04:57Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > . . . And the problem with later Niven is, when he decides he wants to change continuity, he simply says, “You know all that stuff you believe to be true, that people told you about Slavers/Ringworld/hyperspace monsters/Protectors? The stuff you’ve based you entire understanding of those things on? Well, the people that told you were lying!” That’s hack writing. . . . Philip Jose Farmer does this to hideous effect in the Riverworld novels. Here (as in the Dune sequels) each book is significantly worse than the book preceding it, and the sequels go a long way toward ruining the earlier books. I can go with sequels going downhill in quality. (Fritz Leiber’s brilliant “Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser” stories decline steadily in quality, until the very last ones are grotesque bondage-and-discipline porn.) But Farmer lies to the reader, and that’s not forgivable. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/70 "2017-01-06T22:05:00Z")
funny that people think $10 a ticket is high for a movie. Try going to a play, concert, ballet, pro sporting event, etc. for $10. Unless it’s a kids event it’s way more than $10. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_John\_Marcej](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Richard\_John\_Marcej](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_John_Marcej)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/71 "2017-01-06T22:27:16Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > the real issue is that hollywood doesn’t want to spend time for original stories. So we get James Bond 500 or whatever they are up to now . Eventually we will get Star Trek 300, Star Wars 1000, etc. And they can even take a short book like hobbit and make 3 movies out of it. > [@Max\_Torque](#): > > A big part of the problem is us, the movie-watching public. We are comfortable with things we know. We like going to movies where we recognize the characters, or the universe, or the plotline, or even just the actors. These comfortable movies always make a profit. Not necessarily a huge profit, but enough. And so, we get more of the same, and we pay to watch it, and apparently everyone’s happy. > > Occasionally you get something that breaks with formula that becomes a success. Now, it’s lovely when that happens, but it’s too risky for the guys in the big offices. And honestly, when movies cost $10+ per ticket, we don’t want to risk our money on a dud either. So, we stick with what we know, and movies remain a safe packaged product. But here’s where we get the damned if they do, damned if they don’t conundrum. If film makers keep making sequels, movie franchises, etc… the audiences criticize them for turning out the same old same old, not making new and quality films. If film makers make small films with unknown talent in front of and behind the camera the audiences stay away in droves saying they’re not going to spend money and take a chance with something they don’t know. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/72 "2017-01-06T22:32:56Z")
pretty sure they can make money with a small film and new actors. Of course that would have to be a small budget film since it won’t sell many tickets. A lot of oscars go to these types of films. They probably cannot make a profit on a $200 mil budget film with CGI unless it’s got a big star or is a sequel. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/73 "2017-01-06T22:37:37Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > Philip Jose Farmer does this to hideous effect in the Riverworld novels. Here (as in the Dune sequels) each book is significantly worse than the book preceding it, and the sequels go a long way toward ruining the earlier books. Eh, I’d disagree except for the utterly unnecessary fifth one. The first is a masterpiece, and at least the next two are pretty good. The fourth is just sort of too much, but not bad. _Gods_ is just… awful. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/74 "2017-01-06T22:42:59Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > funny that people think $10 a ticket is high for a movie. > > Try going to a play, concert, ballet, pro sporting event, etc. for $10. Unless it’s a kids event it’s way more than $10. Of course we think it’s high! Wait six months and you can buy the damn thing on Amazon for $9.95. You can’t do that with plays, concerts etc. Still, I think those are also too high priced, so take that for what it’s worth. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/75 "2017-01-06T22:47:35Z")
Superman was a really good movie. Superman 2 was awesome. Superman 3 and 4 sucked diseased yak wang. They should have quit after #2 and gone out with a massive win. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Torque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Max\_Torque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Torque)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2017, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/76 "2017-01-06T22:54:57Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Of course i dont hope to convince anyone that they didnt like the film. Many people didn’t, and their opinion of why they didnt like those films is perfectly valid. > > Hell, there are many films that won _Best Picture_ that people have a valid opinion that they hated that film. But if a Film won Best Picture, then by definition, it is not a bad film, just a film you didnt like. > > But saying that because ““Yeah, well, you know, that’s just, like, your opinion, man.”” _tha_t makes the film horrible, is wrong. I will actually give Jar-Jar Binks a pass, seeing as he’s a character for children. Even without pointing out the many, many things wrong with Jar Jar, there’s a lot of stuff wrong with **TPM**. For example: [ul] [li]The movie starts out telling us that there’s a trade dispute. This is a horrible idea in a movie for kids. Setting that aside, what’s the issue? Trade of what? Who’s getting shortchanged? How exactly do you pull off a planet-sized blockade to stop trade? Why is the dispute important enough for Jedi Knights to be sent to negotiate an end to it?[/li][li]The heroes have to go through the planet core to get to the capital city. Leaving aside what a stupid idea this is, that means that the capital city of Naboo is on the other side of the planet. For what plausible reason would the Trade Federation start landing their invading army on the side of the planet _opposite_ the city they intend to invade?[/li][li]How does the slavery thing work on Tatooine? Slaves can have families, own property, and don’t even seem to work that much. Even a child like Anakin has enough resources to cobble together a pod racer that can beat Sebulba AND a translator/protocol droid.[/li][li]Speaking of the pod racer, in one of my favorite plot holes, there are two bets made on the race: Qui-Gon bets the ship (the silver SR-71) against the parts he needs to replace it, and he bets the racing pod itself against Anakin’s freedom. Anakin wins, so he keeps the ship and pod, and wins the parts and Anakin. Anakin then sells the pod and apparently gets a good price for it. So why didn’t Anakin use that money to buy his mom from Watto?[/li][li]The two-headed race announcer. Jesus H. Christ.[/li][/ul] Since my day here is done and I have a snowy drive home, I’ll stop there. This is just what came to mind offhand, and I’m sure others can add to it. Since this isn’t a “dump on **TPM** thread,” I won’t bother adding to the list, but I’m sure others can think of many many more. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2017, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/77 "2017-01-08T04:03:20Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Superman was a really good movie. Superman 2 was awesome. > > Superman 3 and 4 sucked diseased yak wang. They should have quit after #2 and gone out with a massive win. While 3 and 4 are sad in many ways, they do not ruin the original two. ---
**Author:** ![Superdude](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/superdude/32/13450_2.png) [@Superdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superdude)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2017, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/78 "2017-01-08T04:11:39Z")
> [@Richard\_John\_Marcej](#): > > While I don’t believe a sequel can ruin the original film I think a bad movie could tarnish the original subject matter, specifically if it’s adapted from a book. > > If you mention the name _ **Howard the Duck** _ to anyone, they’ll immediately think of the lousy movie and will forever tie it in with it. Unfortunately, the comic series it was adapted from was very good. From the art by Gene Colan to the satire of writer Steve Gerber. > > I personally know that the movie won’t ruin my memory of the comic series, but because of the stink it gave the subject matter, it may prevent others from seeking out and reading the original material. Hey! I liked _Howard the Duck_. Maybe because I was 13 when it came out, and I remember giggling like a madman at duck nipples. ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2017, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/79 "2017-01-08T13:20:31Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Sadly, this thread ruins that one. Ha! Meta. ---
**Author:** ![igor\_frankensteen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/839c29/32.png) [@igor\_frankensteen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/igor_frankensteen)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2017, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/80 "2017-01-08T14:09:56Z")
There are hundreds of sequels that were crap. Almost every sequel that was written just to try to milk the same audience that liked what was supposed to be a stand-alone film, are garbage. But sequels that actually turned the first film from fascinating or exciting or otherwise wonderful, to dreck? That’s rare. The only one I am completely sure of for me, was Matrix 3. It ended the series, not by having the world be freed, but by tucking everyone back into their delusion pods, and restoring the slightly more friendly master program to control. I can only figure that the plot writer was running a malware cleaner on their PC, and thought, hey. That’s all the Matrix REALLY needs. Star Wars was pretty screwed up by the rather unimaginative decision to explain The Force as being the result of the will of an inheritable bloodstream disorder, but I can still watch the original for as much as it was. I could (as I think many of us could) have written a vastly more subtle and interesting overall story arc, based on the established basics. ``` With the Alien series, since the original premise was pretty simple (weird monster that's extra scary because of it's horrifyingly sexual-deviant-based method of procreation), the sequels were mostly just like carnival rides, where different variations on the original themes are used. Resurrection was actually pretty good, because it took things in a new direction. ``` [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400.md?page=5)