# Sequels that ruin the original movie **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 5, 2017, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400 "2017-01-05T17:21:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2017, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/81 "2017-01-08T18:15:28Z")
That’s not all. Reading the book always ruins the movie that was based on the book. A lot of movies are based on very good books, but the film just concentrates on a few vivid or squalid scenes from the book, and ignores most of the rest, except loosely drifting along the original storyline. Sometimes important characters are completely written out. “Unberable Lightness of Being” was a book in three parts, and he movie was only about one of them. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2017, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/82 "2017-01-09T17:00:40Z")
> [@Max\_Torque](#): > > A big part of the problem is us, the movie-watching public. We are comfortable with things we know. We like going to movies where we recognize the characters, or the universe, or the plotline, or even just the actors. These comfortable movies always make a profit. Not necessarily a huge profit, but enough. And so, we get more of the same, and we pay to watch it, and apparently everyone’s happy. > > Occasionally you get something that breaks with formula that becomes a success. Now, it’s lovely when that happens, but it’s too risky for the guys in the big offices. And honestly, when movies cost $10+ per ticket, we don’t want to risk our money on a dud either. So, we stick with what we know, and movies remain a safe packaged product. I don’t mind sequels, I like many of them. It would be awful if the Empire Strikes Back, Return of the Jedi, Stark Trek 4, Spiderman 2, or Captain American: Civil War didn’t get made. The problem is when the studio disrespects the premise of the characters that we spent a movie or so getting to know. I loved how happy Luke, Leia, Han, and Chewbacca were at the end of ROTJ, it cheapens that to know that nothing good came out of all their stuggling. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2017, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/83 "2017-01-09T17:27:06Z")
> [@Max\_Torque](#): > > An example from one of the later videos: describe Han Solo without describing what he looks like. Easy: roguish, brash, bold, a smuggler, but still has a heart. Okay? Now, do the same for Qui-Gon Jinn. “Err…” And this is the character who’s at the center of the story! As much as I love those reviews, this was the part that bugged me. You can literally do that for every character in the movie, the guys just want to prove their point. Qui Gon: calm, cerebral, analytical, the ultimate teacher, full of conviction, willing to help Obi-wan: headstrong, brash, dutiful Amidala: caring, stubborn, also cerebral, a woman of action See? You can do it for everyone. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Bredin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@John\_Bredin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Bredin)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2017, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/84 "2017-01-09T19:15:16Z")
> [@puddleglum](#): > > I loved how happy Luke, Leia, Han, and Chewbacca were at the end of ROTJ, it cheapens that to know that _nothing_ good came out of all their stuggling. (Emphasis added.) In real life, do we say nothing good came of WWII because it was followed by the Cold War instead of the peaceful post-war future (a United Nations with “teeth”, etc.) many envisioned during the war? No, because it was still better than leaving the Axis to roam unchecked. YMMV (and obviously does), but I don’t feel that _ROTJ_ was rendered pointless by the “revelation” in _Force Awakens_ that the Empire wasn’t going to disappear in a puff of smoke everywhere it held sway just because its head was cut off in one battle at one place. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Infovore](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/infovore/32/420_2.png) [@Infovore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Infovore)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2017, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/85 "2017-01-09T19:24:05Z")
_Jurassic Park: The Lost World_ didn’t destroy the first movie (I don’t think that’s possible–I adore that movie) but it did mess up one of the characters nearly beyond recognition. In JP, Ian Malcolm was brilliant, quirky, weird, a little bit skeevy, and just overall a fun character. TLW saddled him with a wooden daughter (seriously, that kid was _boring_) and a girlfriend, both of whom required him to take on the role of “protective boyfriend/daddy” instead of “weird-ass chaotician and coolest guy in the room.” I was _so_ excited for this to come out given how much I loved the first one, but the result was a big ol’ ‘meh.’ ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2017, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/86 "2017-01-09T19:31:12Z")
**Leprechaun in the Hood** totally ruined **Leprechaun**. I can’t even anymore. ---
**Author:** ![erysichthon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d07c76/32.png) [@erysichthon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/erysichthon)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2017, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/87 "2017-01-09T20:07:07Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Yup. I remember the earlier event, too. But it gets combined with more recent memories. Unlike a computer, the human mind doesn’t selectively and consciously erase the memories it doesn’t want\* This is exactly how I feel about it. I don’t think it’s possible for a sequel to retroactively _ruin_ a previous movie, but it can certainly cast a shadow over your pleasant memories of the original movie. Sure, you can ignore the sequel or pretend it never happened, but you can’t un-remember it. _Blade Runner_ is one of my favorite films, but I’m already dreading the possibility that the forthcoming sequel will attempt to settle a 35-year debate—and not in the way I would prefer. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2017, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/88 "2017-01-09T21:29:11Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > 57% is just about average. 60% would make it “Fresh”. I’d say 57% is “OK”. Most of the reviews were from 19 years ago, though, as you’d expect, and honestly I think a lot of people were trying really, really, really hard to find something to like. Even I at the time said “well, I guess that was OK.” The movie hasn’t aged well; in retrospect, though at the time I said it was okay, I now think it’s a genuinely terrible movie. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/89 "2017-01-10T03:07:59Z")
> [@ChockFullOfHeadyGoodness](#): > > That reminds me of another one, if you are willing to stretch the definition of sequel to include a TV-series revival: Last year’s revival of _The X Files._ > > You know the big alien conspiracy arc that took up 9 years of your lives, and created more mysteries that it ever answered because the show was just making it up as they went and kept getting renewed after the show runner wanted to end it? Yeah, well, that was all misdirection and lies from the \*\*\*real \*\*\*conspirators who are \*\*\*really \*\*\*up to this _ **new** _ (even stupider) evil plot. > > Grrr… At least the standalone episode with the Weremonster was excellent. Nah, it just kinda retconned it back to the end of series 7 and showed that it wasn’t lies after all. Look or read back on plot details a bit more. It was almost like a reboot. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/90 "2017-01-10T03:38:29Z")
I generally agree that no sequel can truly “ruin” a previous movie, because the previous movie still exists… But in the spirit of this thread, Terminator 3 made all of T2 pointless. T2 is spent preventing Judgment Day, and our heroes sacrifice much and apparently triumph. T3 says that Judgment Day will happen no matter what. (It’s kind of a shame, because I think T3 is an underrated movie on its own… fun, exciting, great action scenes. But it’s nowhere near as good as the first two, and its messages works against the superior T2, leaving it to be generally dismissed.) Also, it pretty much goes without saying, but I think we can all agree that Naughty Night Nurses 8 really undoes all of the story progression from Naughty Night Nurses 7. ---
**Author:** ![Lorne\_Armstrong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/87869e/32.png) [@Lorne\_Armstrong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lorne_Armstrong)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2017, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/91 "2017-01-15T05:20:55Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > I am rather tired of this meme. The prequels were Ok, not awful. By any measure they did well and rated well. > The Directors cut fixed that weird idea. The prequels were absolutely horrible, all three of them. And they did, to a certain extent, ruin the original. Now every time I see Darth Vader I can’t help but think that Hayden Christiansen is inside that suit, which makes Vader laughable. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2017, 9:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/92 "2017-01-15T09:42:44Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > “Ruin the original” is a bit strong, I’ll go with “deserve to be ignored.” Good call. I’d go with the terrible Exorcist 2. The director, John Boorman, had been slated to direct the original. I can only thank all the gods of cinema that he didn’t. We had to wait until Exorcist 3 for the true sequel. ---
**Author:** ![epbrown01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@epbrown01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/epbrown01)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2017, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/93 "2017-01-15T22:29:23Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > How can a movie ruin another movie? Not sure how that makes any sense. It’s been shown pretty effectively quite a few times - by changing the context or resolution of the original. For me, the biggie is “Revenge of the Sith” on a couple of fronts. Darth Vader’s last minute redemption as a good guy is blown by the scene where he kills the Padawans; just because he stood up for Luke doesn’t take away the fact that he carved up a bunch of grade-schoolers with a light saber. Also, we see Anakin’s spirit join Yoda and Obi Wan after Darth Vader dies, when the earlier films make it clear that Yoda and Obi Wan spent years training to attain spirit form after death, a technique Anakin hadn’t even heard about. ---
**Author:** ![nightshadea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/7ba0ec/32.png) [@nightshadea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nightshadea)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2017, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/94 "2017-01-15T23:04:49Z")
> [@Max\_Torque](#): > > I will actually give Jar-Jar Binks a pass, seeing as he’s a character for children. Even without pointing out the many, many things wrong with Jar Jar, there’s a lot of stuff wrong with **TPM**. For example: > > [ul] > [li]The movie starts out telling us that there’s a trade dispute. This is a horrible idea in a movie for kids. Setting that aside, what’s the issue? Trade of what? Who’s getting shortchanged? How exactly do you pull off a planet-sized blockade to stop trade? Why is the dispute important enough for Jedi Knights to be sent to negotiate an end to it?[/li][li]The heroes have to go through the planet core to get to the capital city. Leaving aside what a stupid idea this is, that means that the capital city of Naboo is on the other side of the planet. For what plausible reason would the Trade Federation start landing their invading army on the side of the planet _opposite_ the city they intend to invade?[/li][li]How does the slavery thing work on Tatooine? Slaves can have families, own property, and don’t even seem to work that much. Even a child like Anakin has enough resources to cobble together a pod racer that can beat Sebulba AND a translator/protocol droid.[/li][li]Speaking of the pod racer, in one of my favorite plot holes, there are two bets made on the race: Qui-Gon bets the ship (the silver SR-71) against the parts he needs to replace it, and he bets the racing pod itself against Anakin’s freedom. Anakin wins, so he keeps the ship and pod, and wins the parts and Anakin. Anakin then sells the pod and apparently gets a good price for it. So why didn’t Anakin use that money to buy his mom from Watto?[/li][li]The two-headed race announcer. Jesus H. Christ.[/li][/ul] > Since my day here is done and I have a snowy drive home, I’ll stop there. This is just what came to mind offhand, and I’m sure others can add to it. Since this isn’t a “dump on **TPM** thread,” I won’t bother adding to the list, but I’m sure others can think of many many more. You know the odd thing ? in RTOJ theres a 5 second scene where it shows vader kneeling waiting for the emperor to come out of using the force and acknowledge hes there In the novelization the emperors who knows vaders there and makes him wait there for like a half hour just because he can and thinks its humorous begins remembering how he became emperor and basically sums up the plot of the 3 prequels in oh maybe a half of to a whole page … Very few remember/know this … my problem is simply the movie and the story its self almost felt like they filmed a practice movie 4 years before ep4 and then rescued it from the vault … because they were so similar in look and tone ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2017, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/95 "2017-01-16T00:16:53Z")
> [@epbrown01](#): > > Also, we see Anakin’s spirit join Yoda and Obi Wan after Darth Vader dies, when the earlier films make it clear that Yoda and Obi Wan spent years training to attain spirit form after death, a technique Anakin hadn’t even heard about. They may _mention_ it, but I’m not sure if they “make it clear”, because I don’t recall seeing any reference to this sort of training in the original series. If it is in there, I’d say it wasn’t very clear. It’s clear that Obi Wan did something special at the climactic duel of SW but I don’t remember him prefacing this by telling Luke exactly what he was doing and how he learned it. ---
**Author:** ![epbrown01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7ba0ec/32.png) [@epbrown01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/epbrown01)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2017, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/96 "2017-01-16T02:59:10Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > They may _mention_ it, but I’m not sure if they “make it clear”, because I don’t recall seeing any reference to this sort of training in the original series. If it is in there, I’d say it wasn’t very clear. It’s clear that Obi Wan did something special at the climactic duel of SW but I don’t remember him prefacing this by telling Luke exactly what he was doing and how he learned it. Sorry, I mean that the prequels make it clear that Yoda and Obi Wan are training in the technique while on Degobah and Tatooine respectively in the 15-some year gap between “Revenge of the Sith” and “A New Hope.” So how’s Anakin show up with them at the end of RTOJ? Without the later films/prequels, it could all be grouped under “the Force.” ---
**Author:** ![Smitty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@Smitty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smitty)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2017, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/97 "2017-01-16T03:09:21Z")
Highlander 2. 'Nuff said. ---
**Author:** ![Apocalypso](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@Apocalypso](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apocalypso)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2017, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/98 "2017-01-16T14:56:06Z")
Nightmare on Elm Street went from a horror movie in the first one to a parody of itself in the sequels. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/99 "2017-01-17T12:43:53Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Yep. All those things show it was a OK film. Not a Good film, not a Horrible film, but one that did OK. They show no such thing. Also you don’t know what a meme is. A “meme” isn’t “an opinion DrDeth dislikes.” ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2017, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400/100 "2017-01-17T15:22:01Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > funny that people think $10 a ticket is high for a movie. > > Try going to a play, concert, ballet, pro sporting event, etc. for $10. Unless it’s a kids event it’s way more than $10. Rossini’s [prequel](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Barber_of_Seville) to Mozart’s _Le Nozze di Figaro_ wasn’t as good as the original but still kept to a high standard. Milhaud’s [sequel](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_m%C3%A8re_coupable), however, really let the franchise down. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sequels-that-ruin-the-original-movie/776400.md?page=6)