# Seriously? The jrodefeld and aigonz retardothon. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 5, 2010, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721 "2010-09-05T23:13:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/81 "2010-09-07T13:19:13Z")
> [@Hellestal](#): > > albino hemophiliac Ooh, band name? ---
**Author:** ![Mollie\_Magill](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mollie_magill/32/20882_2.png) [@Mollie\_Magill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mollie_Magill)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/82 "2010-09-07T13:51:10Z")
> [@Mr.Miskatonic](#): > > BTW, for the hard of thinking here is the context, just from the post in question: > > > [@](#): > > > > I know about herd immunity and understand very well the concept of immunizations. As to that 99% of doctors statistic you just pulled out of your ass, you would do well to read the alternative views and understand what these vaccines actually contain. > > > > Why do you think it is even necessary to artificially prevent ALL disease through vaccination? \*\*Why should I be afraid of the Flu, Chicken Pox, or any other number of fairly harmless illness that people have gotten for centuries with no lingering ill effects? > > > > Don’t you understand that people’s immune systems become stronger through fighting illness and disease? We can build up our defenses through supplementation and healthy living better than through vaccinations.\*\* > > > > Did you know that a fairly high number of vaccinations actually CAUSE the disease they are meant to prevent? > > Now tell me that is correct, in context. > > And that is all for that distraction from the OP. Out of context it was sorta correct. In context, however the stoopid shines. My favorite part: > [@](#): > > Why should I be afraid of the Flu, Chicken Pox, or any other number of fairly harmless illness that people have gotten for centuries with no lingering ill effects? I guess death isn’t much of a lingering effect. After all, everyone dies from it. * * * That which doesn’t kill me, missed. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/83 "2010-09-07T15:30:23Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Sam Stone just gave the most savage beating I’ve ever seen to Jro. I feel bad for him. Which one? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/84 "2010-09-07T16:33:33Z")
It puzzles me to no end that for as long as **jrodefeld** has gone on about the Austrian School, the gold standard, Ron Paul, and whatever else nonsense, it’s the vaccine issue that has people piling on with such vigor. Well, maybe I’ve overstated that a little bit… but for all his absolute nutty political and economic views, he doesn’t get nearly as much tsk-tsking for that loonyness as for his recent comments on health care. For example: in a past thread we had a significant discussion of the issue of racism and Ron Paul, principally his newsletter which contained odious comments for a number of years. A small group has pointed out that either (a) Ron Paul approved the racist comments, or (b) Ron Paul allowed racists to write his newsletter with no supervision for a matter of several years. Our hero **jrodefeld** denies that either could POSSIBLY be the case, because Ron Paul isn’t racist, and he’s a good man and a genius so there’s no way that he is responsible for either case (a) or (b). WTF? It simply has to be one or the other. There is no middle ground. And yet, this guy, who I’m guessing is college age yet not in college, is so thoroughly deluded that he can hand-wave away any concrete, reasoned criticism of his views THAT HE CAN’T EVEN REALIZE THAT HE’S HAND-WAVING! I have never come across such a thorough and complete embrace of the Chewbacca Defense that did not have a hint of intentional dishonesty in it. Surely, Johnnie Cochran knew he was blowing smoke up someone’s ass. **jrodefeld** not only doesn’t realize it, he is utterly convinced that he is whispering the truth from God’s lips to our ears, and is genuinely perplexed why we don’t see it his way… and yet, he has a grip on reality, he’s lucid, and I think he’s well-meaning. That kind of pure, 100% delusion surely deserves some kind of medal. Perhaps made from Unobtainium, which I know for a fact exists, and nobody can tell me that it doesn’t, because Ron Paul said it does exist. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/85 "2010-09-07T16:35:01Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > It puzzles me to no end that for as long as **jrodefeld** has gone on about the Austrian School, the gold standard, Ron Paul, and whatever else nonsense, it’s the vaccine issue that has people piling on with such vigor. Because all that other shit doesn’t get kids killed. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/86 "2010-09-07T16:42:13Z")
I don’t think I thank the Great Debates crowd enough, for being willing to make the effort to take on posters who like to post page after page of blather. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/87 "2010-09-07T17:05:27Z")
In one sense we should be grateful to **jrodefeld** for illustrating how strongly the Ron/Rand Paul crowd (and to some extent, libertarianism as a whole) is tied to nutty ideas and quackery, whether through direct support or willingness to enable it. If it wasn’t for **jro** ’s latest GD thread, I wouldn’t have found out that Ron Paul has actually supported homeopathy (in a 2009 speech before the U.S. House). He has deepened my understanding of the depths to which the loonbar crowd adores Ron Paul (noting all the pro-Paul articles on sites such as [rense.com](http://rense.com) and whale.to\*, which **jro** views as authoritative). **jro** couldn’t do more damage to the reputation of the Paul movement if he was a paid tool of the opposition. Hmm…:dubious: \*Actually not everyone on whale.to is convinced of Ron Paul’s goodness. There’s an eye-opening piece on Secret Masonic Signals which all of our major public figures are flashing to those in the know on a regular basis. Even Ron Paul has been implicated. :eek:😕:eek:☹ ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/88 "2010-09-07T17:27:07Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > Because all that other shit doesn’t get kids killed. Well, he does advocate a return to the economy of the late 19th century, in which bobbin boys routinely had their hands mashed through unsafe machinery, bravely sacrificing their future for the cause of liberty, profit, and no government regulation of greedy aristocrats, but technically they didn’t die… And then there were those starving masses lined up at the government trough (aka soup kitchens) just to get food when they could have been out looking for a job, rather than supporting the socialist welfare state, but really those people just lost a lot of weight, and didn’t really die… And then there were all those narsty old people what with bad body odor and yucky sicknesses, who now are suckling off the teet of Uncle Sam with that unconstitutional “Medicare” (what’s with the “care” in that name, anyway? Libertarians “care” too, just without doing anything for sick people, but they “care!”), whereas before they could have just sucked the livelihood out of all their family with their illnesses, which is the way God intended… and technically these people DO die… But your point is taken. In two of the three scenarios in which **jrodefeld** wants to turn back the economic clock 140 years, people DIDN’T get killed, at least right away, so I guess the vaccine thing is a bigger deal than his advocacy for free market systems built upon exploiting the young, old, sick, and weak to the last surviving bone of their pitiful lives. I wonder how **jrodefeld** would weigh the moral burden of subjecting more children to disease and death vs. subjugating huge swaths of the population to state-sanctioned misery? Where might he fall on that moral dilemma? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/89 "2010-09-07T17:32:40Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > If it wasn’t for **jro** ’s latest GD thread, I wouldn’t have found out that Ron Paul has actually supported homeopathy (in a 2009 speech before the U.S. House). He has deepened my understanding of the depths to which the loonbar crowd adores Ron Paul (noting all the pro-Paul articles on sites such as [rense.com](http://rense.com) and whale.to\*, which **jro** views as authoritative). On a related note, I really, really wish Ron Paul would turn [purple](http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://speakout.com/VoteMatch/people/Stan_Jones.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.ontheissues.org/Senate/Stan_Jones.htm&h=242&w=220&sz=6&tbnid=XMFcp60IYHzMEM:&tbnh=110&tbnw=100&prev=/images%3Fq%3DStan%2BJones&zoom=1&q=Stan+Jones&usg=__T_ZKGOIuGoSBjmOez8137rQryWU=&sa=X&ei=YHaGTM37DIXGlQfKxJ2fDw&ved=0CCAQ9QEwAA) like a fellow Libertarian politician did, from overconsumption of colloidal silver, a totally natural and harmless antibiotic. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Miskatonic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr.miskatonic/32/310_2.png) [@Mr.Miskatonic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Miskatonic)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/90 "2010-09-07T18:00:44Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > > [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > > > Because all that other shit doesn’t get kids killed. > > Well, he does advocate a return to the economy of the late 19th century, in which bobbin boys routinely had their hands mashed through unsafe machinery, bravely sacrificing their future for the cause of liberty, profit, and no government regulation of greedy aristocrats, but technically they didn’t die… You are correct, but I would say the real problem is that while people may babble and babble about one type of economics vs. another it really is pretty much out of their hands. The most they can ever hope to do is elect someone who might do what they want - and frankly the limited number of clock reverses is kinda low. With vaccines, however, everyone is master of their body and their childrens’ health. You can’t easily get away from our economic system but you can avoid vaccines and mess up the herd immunity. Children are already dying because of the bullshit that jro is spreading. So we kinda give that priority. ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/91 "2010-09-07T18:35:00Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > I have never come across such a thorough and complete embrace of the Chewbacca Defense that did not have a hint of intentional dishonesty in it. Surely, Johnnie Cochran knew he was blowing smoke up someone’s ass. **jrodefeld** not only doesn’t realize it, he is utterly convinced that he is whispering the truth from God’s lips to our ears, and is genuinely perplexed why we don’t see it his way… and yet, he has a grip on reality, he’s lucid, and I think he’s well-meaning. I don’t. For every truly sincere conspiracy nut (or just plain unsalted nut) on the Internet there has to be at least 10 100% insincere trolls. That GD trainwreck is a pure unsullied example of such trollery-and, judging from the post count now, a completely successful attempt. At the very least, he’s completely uninterested in a genuine and equal exchange of ideas, and that’s enough for me to drag out the TROLL stamp. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/92 "2010-09-07T20:53:40Z")
> [@Meyer6](#): > > Yeesh - healthy people certainly can, and do, die of the flu. I’m highly suspicious of his claim that not a single healthy person died of the swine flu too. Healthy people have never died of the flu. Because if they’ve got the flu, they’re not healthy. Quod Erat Dumbassery ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/93 "2010-09-07T21:40:10Z")
> [@Meyer6](#): > > > [@Mr.Miskatonic](#): > > > > Holy crap, after getting huge lists of casualties from influenza outbreaks and having it explained clearly how the 1918 pandemic killed quite healthy folks he comes up with this: > > Yeesh - healthy people certainly can, and do, die of the flu. I’m highly suspicious of his claim that not a single healthy person died of the swine flu too. It is more than that. The 1918 flu used the bodies immune system against itself. People with good immune systems, like the soldiers at the army bases where it first spread, were more at risk of dying than older, less healthy, people. Can anyone tell me which page his eventual response to my comment saying that he was at risk even if he is healthy is on? I’ve given up the thread because it makes me want to conk the moron with my monitor. ---
**Author:** ![Oldeb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ea666f/32.png) [@Oldeb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oldeb)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/94 "2010-09-07T22:31:43Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > On a related note, I really, really wish Ron Paul would turn [purple](http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://speakout.com/VoteMatch/people/Stan_Jones.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.ontheissues.org/Senate/Stan_Jones.htm&h=242&w=220&sz=6&tbnid=XMFcp60IYHzMEM:&tbnh=110&tbnw=100&prev=/images%3Fq%3DStan%2BJones&zoom=1&q=Stan+Jones&usg=__T_ZKGOIuGoSBjmOez8137rQryWU=&sa=X&ei=YHaGTM37DIXGlQfKxJ2fDw&ved=0CCAQ9QEwAA) like a fellow Libertarian politician did, from overconsumption of colloidal silver, a totally natural and harmless antibiotic. :rolleyes: That’s awesome! I’d never heard of Stan Jones before. The best part is that he continues to promote the use of colloidal silver. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/95 "2010-09-07T22:40:37Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > > [@Meyer6](#): > > > > Yeesh - healthy people certainly can, and do, die of the flu. I’m highly suspicious of his claim that not a single healthy person died of the swine flu too. > > Healthy people have never died of the flu. Because if they’ve got the flu, they’re not healthy. > > Quod Erat Dumbassery Ah, right. So basically we can say that healthy people never actually die of anything at all, right? Excellent, I’ll just keep myself healthy and live forever then! ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/96 "2010-09-07T22:42:49Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > On a related note, I really, really wish Ron Paul would turn [purple](http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://speakout.com/VoteMatch/people/Stan_Jones.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.ontheissues.org/Senate/Stan_Jones.htm&h=242&w=220&sz=6&tbnid=XMFcp60IYHzMEM:&tbnh=110&tbnw=100&prev=/images%3Fq%3DStan%2BJones&zoom=1&q=Stan+Jones&usg=__T_ZKGOIuGoSBjmOez8137rQryWU=&sa=X&ei=YHaGTM37DIXGlQfKxJ2fDw&ved=0CCAQ9QEwAA) like a fellow Libertarian politician did, from overconsumption of colloidal silver, a totally natural and harmless antibiotic. :rolleyes: Not true! You’ve obviously fallen for lies promoted by Big Pharma, the Medical Establishment and the Masons. He has **not** turned “purple” through use of colloidal silver! He’s [a lovely shade of blue-gray](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/11/11/AR2006111101004.html). ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/97 "2010-09-07T22:56:13Z")
> [@Meyer6](#): > > > [@Gyrate](#): > > > > Healthy people have never died of the flu. Because if they’ve got the flu, they’re not healthy. > > > > Quod Erat Dumbassery > > Ah, right. So basically we can say that healthy people never actually die of anything at all, right? Excellent, I’ll just keep myself healthy and live forever then! It’s worked for me so far. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/98 "2010-09-08T00:47:27Z")
> [@Mr.Miskatonic](#): > > BTW, for the hard of thinking here is the context, just from the post in question: > > > [@](#): > > > > I know about herd immunity and understand very well the concept of immunizations. As to that 99% of doctors statistic you just pulled out of your ass, you would do well to read the alternative views and understand what these vaccines actually contain. > > > > Why do you think it is even necessary to artificially prevent ALL disease through vaccination? \*\*Why should I be afraid of the Flu, Chicken Pox, or any other number of fairly harmless illness that people have gotten for centuries with no lingering ill effects? > > > > Don’t you understand that people’s immune systems become stronger through fighting illness and disease? We can build up our defenses through supplementation and healthy living better than through vaccinations.\*\* > > > > Did you know that a fairly high number of vaccinations actually CAUSE the disease they are meant to prevent? > > Now tell me that is correct, in context. > > And that is all for that distraction from the OP. Stop it. If you want something evaluated in context, post the context. If someone asks for help, help. There was nothing wrong with the sentence quoted. Someone asked if there was, and you did not say, “No”, and post the whole section. You threw a hissy fit instead. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/99 "2010-09-08T01:03:09Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > It puzzles me to no end that for as long as **jrodefeld** has gone on about the Austrian School, the gold standard, Ron Paul, and whatever else nonsense, it’s the vaccine issue that has people piling on with such vigor. Because the results can be so heart-breaking - children die. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721/100 "2010-09-08T01:10:48Z")
Do jrodefeld and Olentzero average out as sane? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seriously-the-jrodefeld-and-aigonz-retardothon/552721.md?page=6)