# "set-up fee" or "setup fee" ... or something else? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 23, 2012, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601 "2012-03-23T14:20:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601/1 "2012-03-23T14:20:58Z")
Back story uninteresting, really. I send out these notification emails at work all the time that feature this phrase. Can’t decide if it should have a hyphen, or not, or … something else I haven’t thought of. Simple little Friday morning poll. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![ZenBeam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/3ab097/32.png) [@ZenBeam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZenBeam)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601/2 "2012-03-23T14:37:14Z")
It would help me choose if I saw it used in a typical sentence. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601/3 "2012-03-23T15:11:53Z")
You wouldn’t be wrong to use the hyphen, but my preference is for the hyphen(-)less version. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601/4 "2012-03-23T15:14:08Z")
‘Setup’ is a made up word. Set-up is correct. [If it’s good enough for the OED](http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/set-up), it’s good enough for me. ---
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601/5 "2012-03-23T15:33:09Z")
> [@ZenBeam](#): > > It would help me choose if I saw it used in a typical sentence. Not really a sentence, but here’s a template of the billing emails I send out several times per week: We will now begin billing the monthly fee and any other fees related to the website. Bill to: {customer} Monthly fee: $xx Setup fee: $xyz Please also {rest of email template goes on from here} ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601/6 "2012-03-23T15:51:03Z")
> [@SanVito](#): > > ‘Setup’ is a made up word. Set-up is correct. [If it’s good enough for the OED](http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/set-up), it’s good enough for me. Well, all words are “made up” in one way or another. “Setup” looks cleaner and nicer to my eyes than “set-up” and in both Merriam-Webster and Random House, it looks like it’s the preferred spelling for American usage in this context. If you are asking about UK usage, it may be different. Also, “setup” as one word dates back to 1890, so it’s not like it’s an extremely recent neologism. ETA: Citations: [Dictionary.com](http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/setup?s=t) (note the different definitions for “set-up” and “setup.”) [Merriam-Webster](http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/set-up) (doesn’t even include a separate definition for “set-up.”) [Etymonline](http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?allowed_in_frame=0&search=setup&searchmode=none) for the word origin. [Wiktionary.com](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/setup). If you go to “set-up” it states it’s an “alternative form” of “setup.” ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601/7 "2012-03-23T15:58:57Z")
[This grammar guide says](http://grammarhome.com/grammar_guide/setup.htm) that “set-up” is always wrong. (And I disagree with that.) [As does this one](http://www.stc-phoenix.com/roughdraft06/3apr06/on_the_job.html). [As does this one](http://grammar.ccc.commnet.edu/grammar/grammarlogs/grammarlogs174.htm). As do many others. And so on, and so forth. In American English usage, “setup” is clearly preferred. ETA: Oxford English [American Learner’s Dictionary](http://oaadonline.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/dictionary/setup) also seems to prefer “setup,” but the corresponding UK dictionary prefers “set-up.” So this does seem to be a difference between American English and UK English. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601/8 "2012-03-23T19:25:14Z")
Oddly enough, I think the hyphenated version looks better in the example. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601/9 "2012-03-23T19:31:39Z")
If I saw “setup” somewhere, I’d be wondering what a “se tup” is. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601/10 "2012-03-23T19:36:13Z")
> [@SanVito](#): > > ‘Setup’ is a made up word. Set-up is correct. [If it’s good enough for the OED](http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/set-up), it’s good enough for me. Given that virtually every single program/application I use has a Setup screen, not a Set-Up screen, I feel safe in saying that if that “made up” word is not now legit, it soon will be. I don’t think I’ve ever encountered “set-up” before, to be frank. It’s “setup” if it’s a noun and “set up” if it’s a verb. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601/11 "2012-03-23T20:04:38Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > Given that virtually every single program/application I use has a Setup screen, not a Set-Up screen, I feel safe in saying that if that “made up” word is not now legit, it soon will be. And given that’s it’s over 120 years old in American usage, it should be legit by now, no? If you search the New York Times archive from 1981 to present (they’re broken down into two different time ranges), here are the results: “setup man” : 774 “set-up man”: 102 “Setup fee” is a good bit closer, but still with more than 50% of instances than “set-up fee” “setup fee”: 33 “set-up fee”: 21 American usage is strongly favoring “setup”, and like “to-morrow” becoming “tomorrow” and “e-mail” becoming “email” (in AP Style), I’d say “setup” is preferred in an American audience context. However, I do disagree with the sites I’ve linked to above that say “set-up” is wrong. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601/12 "2012-03-23T20:25:03Z")
According to the [GPO Style Manual](http://tinyurl.com/7qsghgs) (pdf – page 167), it’s “setup.” The manual is the best source for answers to this sort of question. However, in general, it’s a style issue and you can use whatever you want, as long as you’re consistent. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2012, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/set-up-fee-or-setup-fee-or-something-else/616601/13 "2012-03-23T20:53:34Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > However, in general, it’s a style issue and you can use whatever you want, as long as you’re consistent. Agreed. Although the AP is being pretty progressive by calling for “email” instead of “e-mail,” it’s often had weird historical quirks. Believe it or not, AP Style mandated “teen-ager” instead of “teenager” up until 2005 (!).