# Sets, Reps, Weights **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 11, 2012, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519 "2012-02-11T14:44:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/21 "2012-02-21T12:35:28Z")
Not counting, but a few minutes, I’ll do a set at the beginning of a segment on TV (7 PM)then another at the end (say, 7;06) then commercial, then next segment (7:10) so maybe 3 or minutes rest on average, though a little less when I’m doing ab-work mixed with upper-arm and chest work, and a little more when I’m doing particularly exhausting (new) weights, like last night. ---
**Author:** ![Sinaptics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Sinaptics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinaptics)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/22 "2012-02-21T16:13:00Z")
Just wanted to add in a tidbit that I didn’t know until yesterday: There is no such activity as “toning” muscles. Muscles can’t be toned or shaped, they can only get bigger or smaller. Tone acutally refers to the semi-state of contraction your muscles are naturally in, which is an involuntary, and as far as I can tell, an unalterable attribute. Whether your doing 2 sets of 10 or 10 sets of 10, you’re doing the same thing, tearing the muscle and letting it rebuilt itself. For the colloquial definition of toned, people are referring to losing the layer of subcutaneous fat that covers muscles. Lose the layer of fat, and the muscles stand out clearly. Losing that layer usually is accomplished via diet, and not exercise. Additionally, you can’t spot “tone.” For instance, just lose the fat over your abs. From what I’ve read, you can maintain a caloric deficit and your body decides from where to remove fat and there is nothing you can do to influence the spot from whence it takes it. ---
**Author:** ![Lanzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/74df32/32.png) [@Lanzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lanzy)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/23 "2012-02-21T16:39:33Z")
There is a science to doing perfect barbell lifts from a bench. you probably looked it up but it doesn’t seem as if you are doing things quite right. I would never rest “minutes” between sets, one minute is ok. Are you breathing correctly? You should breathe IN while lowering the bar and breathe OUT while raising the bar. Let the coming down take 2 secs while pushing up takes 1. I would add 5 lbs per week until you can’t, then maybe 2 1/2 after that until even that is too much. Follow PERFECT form at all times and the sets can’t reach 10-15. A much smaller set with less reps in absolutely perfect form will give much better results. I have a student that started 90 lb benches when he weighed 135. He is now 145 and benching 185 and still will go up a bit more before flatlining at his weight, so far its been 6 months. His One Rep max is 315. Form Form Form is the goal not weight. Using perfect form might even force you to decrease your lifts for a while but the skys the limit. Good luck. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/24 "2012-02-21T16:50:28Z")
> [@Lanzy](#): > > There is a science to doing perfect barbell lifts from a bench. you probably looked it up but it doesn’t seem as if you are doing things quite right. > > I would never rest “minutes” between sets, one minute is ok. Are you breathing correctly? You should breathe IN while lowering the bar and breathe OUT while raising the bar. Let the coming down take 2 secs while pushing up takes 1. > > . What’s the downside of waiting more than a minute between reps? I admit, I’m lazy and I don’t feel like lifting when my arms are sore, but I’ll do it if I know that there’s a big advantage there. Usually, I’ll credit the people who do anything professionally with knowing what they’re talking about, but I do enjoy following the thinking behind the theory. (Sometimes, I find that the “theorists” don’t have a clue why they’re insisting n the regimen theyre used to, or that it achieves a goal that I’m not interested in meeting, but often there is a reason that makes sense once I understand it.) ---
**Author:** ![Sinaptics](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/278dde/32.png) [@Sinaptics](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinaptics)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/25 "2012-02-21T17:10:07Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > What’s the downside of waiting more than a minute between reps? I admit, I’m lazy and I don’t feel like lifting when my arms are sore, but I’ll do it if I know that there’s a big advantage there. > > Usually, I’ll credit the people who do anything professionally with knowing what they’re talking about, but I do enjoy following the thinking behind the theory. (Sometimes, I find that the “theorists” don’t have a clue why they’re insisting n the regimen theyre used to, or that it achieves a goal that I’m not interested in meeting, but often there is a reason that makes sense once I understand it.) Here is a great article on wait times between sets for different exercise regimens (strength, muscle build, endurance) and explains in detail why the rest period varies, with cites even. [http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/topicoftheweek11.htm](http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/topicoftheweek11.htm) ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/26 "2012-02-21T20:45:53Z")
Yeah, I figured the rest periods would be high, what with the number of sets you’re doing. The other guys have pretty much linked/posted what I would have. Basically, 1 minute rest for building muscle, _maybe_ 3 minutes for strength, but I wouldn’t go higher than that unless you personally experience that as working best for you. But I think judging that would require a somewhat more rigorous approach to measurement than you may want to take 🙂 I’d keep rest periods to around a minute or so, along with following some of the other advice on the thread. That said, the _absolute_ best exercise program is the one you can stick to. So if your system is keeping you working out, don’t mess with it too much. ---
**Author:** ![isaiahrobinson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/85e7bf/32.png) [@isaiahrobinson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/isaiahrobinson)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/27 "2012-02-21T21:06:10Z")
> [@Lanzy](#): > > I would never rest “minutes” between sets, one minute is ok. For strength the optimum rest period is 3 to 5 minutes. One minute is not enough if yor target is getting stronger. For gaining muscle mass it’s 1 to 2 minutes. Anything less than one minute and you’re essentially training for endurance. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Man\_In\_Black](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@The\_Man\_In\_Black](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Man_In_Black)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/28 "2012-02-21T21:26:51Z")
> [@Lanzy](#): > > There is a science to doing perfect barbell lifts from a bench. you probably looked it up but it doesn’t seem as if you are doing things quite right. > > I would never rest “minutes” between sets, one minute is ok. Are you breathing correctly? You should breathe IN while lowering the bar and breathe OUT while raising the bar. Let the coming down take 2 secs while pushing up takes 1. I have to disagree. I would say for a beginner to rest 90sec. between sets. There are some who say “Time Under Tension” (TUT) is needed to gain strength, but my understanding is many no longer feel it helps a beginner. Push the bar up as fast as you can while maintaining control, then lower the weight in a controlled manner (do not just let it free fall to your chest). I would also say to check out Starting Strength. It is a great beginner program. And check out [http://forums.menshealth.com/eve?s=70010347](http://forums.menshealth.com/eve?s=70010347) No offence to anyone here, but the people who post on Men’s Health know much more about weight training and fitness than most posters here. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/29 "2012-02-21T21:45:44Z")
> [@Sinaptics](#): > > Here is a great article on wait times between sets for different exercise regimens (strength, muscle build, endurance) and explains in detail why the rest period varies, with cites even. > [http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/topicoftheweek11.htm](http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/topicoftheweek11.htm) Another source, the official [statement from the American Academy of Sports Medicine](http://weighttraining.about.com/gi/o.htm?zi=1/XJ&zTi=1&sdn=weighttraining&cdn=health&tm=1270&gps=537_383_878_588&f=00&tt=2&bt=1&bts=1&zu=http%3A//journals.lww.com/acsm-msse/Fulltext/2009/03000/Progression_Models_in_Resistance_Training_for.26.aspx) > [@](#): > > Evidence category B. For novice, intermediate, and advanced training, it is recommended that rest periods of at least 2-3 min be used for core exercises using heavier loads (those exercises included specifically to improve maximal strength such as the squat and bench press) (3,149,213,214,221,229,230,269-271). > Evidence category C. For assistance exercises (those exercises complimentary to core exercises), a shorter rest period length of 1-2 min may suffice (149,213,229,230,269). ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2012, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/30 "2012-02-22T20:15:13Z")
> [@Sinaptics](#): > > Just wanted to add in a tidbit that I didn’t know until yesterday: > > There is no such activity as “toning” muscles. Muscles can’t be toned or shaped, they can only get bigger or smaller. … Untrue. Different uses shape muscles in different ways. Two athletes I knew in college, both scary strong. One a football player, one a rings man gymnast. Both huge arms. Both lean. Football player’s arm a solid cylinder. Rings man’s arm had crevices between his biceps and triceps you lose a wallet in. ---
**Author:** ![CookingWithGas](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cookingwithgas/32/485_2.png) [@CookingWithGas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CookingWithGas)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2012, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/31 "2012-02-23T01:57:25Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > Untrue. > > Different uses shape muscles in different ways. Two athletes I knew in college, both scary strong. One a football player, one a rings man gymnast. Both huge arms. Both lean. Football player’s arm a solid cylinder. Rings man’s arm had crevices between his biceps and triceps you lose a wallet in. This does not mean that it was due to their training activity. Everyone has different natural muscle shapes and body types. Even if you just compare football players to one another you will see different physiques. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2012, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/32 "2012-02-23T03:39:12Z")
Okay, let’s get into details. An individual muscle, say the biceps, consists of many different muscle units organized at different angles and attaching, in this case, by way of two different heads. Some movements of that muscle require some muscle units to maximally activate and leave others relatively inactive, others cause different patterns of activation. The units that are being maximally activated will hypertrophy, the ones not, won’t. Different shape muscles _will_ result as a consequence of the sort of movements being intensely performed with regularity. Also the individual muscle units can hypertrophy by adding sarcomeres in parallel (in general increasing the the maximum force those particular units can produce) or by increasing the number of sarcomeres in parallel (in general increasing the velocity that the muscle can move) - those different responses to different stimuli also produce different shapes to the individual units, which together result in different shapes to the muscle overall. In short, a muscle is not a single unit. It is a collection of muscle units that adapt to the specific stimuli that each of them individually are put under, which can vary depending on the specific exercises being done. (As well as being trained to work more effectively together.) ---
**Author:** ![Cubsfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Cubsfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cubsfan)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2012, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/33 "2012-02-23T05:18:48Z")
> [@misterW](#): > > 12 sets??!! No wonder you are there all day. That is an insane number of sets. If you can do that many sets, I suspect you are using a weight that is too easy for you. Do 3 or 4 sets, and shoot for a weight that allows you to JUST be able to do 8-10 reps, before you can’t do any more. QFT. 12 sets is pretty ridiculous. You need to challenge yourself a lot more on the weight. Do you do one or two exercises a day or something? ---
**Author:** ![Cubsfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f4b2a3/32.png) [@Cubsfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cubsfan)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2012, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/34 "2012-02-23T05:27:07Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > OK–progress report. In the last week, I’ve bought some extra weights (Craigslist) and I’ve discovered that my rack can be set up so that the bar is touching my chest, meaning that I now DON’T need to lift the bar even an inch with my hands alone. > > Lying flat on the floor, I can “bench” press safely now, I think, and I upped the weight to 90 lbs. Did four sets, 15 reps each, tonight, plus a few warmups with 30 lb. dumbbells first. What does this mean? I don’t even understand your terminology. How do you do a bench press lying flat on the floor? I can’t picture the mechanics. And what do you mean the bar can be set up an inch from your chest? Are you saying you start in the down position? ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2012, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/35 "2012-02-23T12:19:11Z")
> [@Cubsfan](#): > > What does this mean? I don’t even understand your terminology. How do you do a bench press lying flat on the floor? I can’t picture the mechanics. > > And what do you mean the bar can be set up an inch from your chest? Are you saying you start in the down position? OK–here’s me, back flat, feet flat, knees bent. I’ve got two heavy wooden boxes,about a foot tall, each with a notch a little bigger than the bar, about five feet apart by my chest, the notches about even with my elbows. This is my “rack.” I put the 90-lb. barbell on the “rack” and slide myself underneath. Now the bar is an inch or so above my chest. Yes, I start in the “down” position. Am I committing heresy? Seems safe enough to me, the boxes acting as a barrier to any muscle failure. ---
**Author:** ![nate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nate/32/13085_2.png) [@nate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nate)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2012, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/36 "2012-02-23T14:55:10Z")
I don’t see how you can do a proper bench press with your setup. You need to have clearance between your back and the floor to allow your elbows to fall below your back to be able to get the barbell to touch your chest. Or maybe I’m imagining your setup wrong. ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2012, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/37 "2012-02-23T15:02:31Z")
> [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](#): > > OK–here’s me, back flat, feet flat, knees bent. I’ve got two heavy wooden boxes,about a foot tall, each with a notch a little bigger than the bar, about five feet apart by my chest, the notches about even with my elbows. This is my “rack.” > > I put the 90-lb. barbell on the “rack” and slide myself underneath. Now the bar is an inch or so above my chest. Yes, I start in the “down” position. Am I committing heresy? Seems safe enough to me, the boxes acting as a barrier to any muscle failure. That’s a floor press, not a bench press. Not that there’s anything wrong with that–the floor press is a legitimate exercise, and probably better if you have shoulder issues–but the two are different things. ---
**Author:** ![pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@pseudotriton\_ruber\_ruber](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pseudotriton_ruber_ruber)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2012, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/38 "2012-02-23T15:30:16Z")
> [@ultrafilter](#): > > That’s a floor press, not a bench press. Consider me corrected. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [February 23, 2012, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/39 "2012-02-23T15:48:37Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > … Also the individual muscle units can hypertrophy by adding sarcomeres in parallel (in general increasing the the maximum force those particular units can produce) or by increasing the number of sarcomeres in parallel (in general increasing the velocity that the muscle can move) … Should read > [@](#): > > … Also the individual muscle units can hypertrophy by adding sarcomeres in parallel (in general increasing the the maximum force those particular units can produce) or by increasing the number of sarcomeres [del]in parallel[/del] **in series** (in general increasing the velocity that the muscle can move) … Sorry. ---
**Author:** ![Toxylon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f05b48/32.png) [@Toxylon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toxylon)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2012, 7:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519/40 "2012-05-22T07:29:55Z")
> [@Toxylon](#): > > Bench pressing solo without spotter racks or safety pins is dangerous business. Sometimes, on a challenging rep, the arms just lose it mid-way up, and the bar comes promptly down on the trainee’s chest, or, worse, throat. People get killed this way. [home trainee crushed to death by barbell during solo benchpressing](http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/weightlifter-crushed-to-death-by-barbell-during-842641) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sets-reps-weights/612519.md?page=1)