# Seven Sinful Cities? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 5, 2008, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944 "2008-08-05T18:37:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/1 "2008-08-05T18:37:51Z")
In Heinlein’s _Glory Road_, the protagonist finds himself in Singapore, which he describes as “one of the Seven Sinful Cities where _anything_ can be had.” He didn’t list the other six, and I am not familiar enough with organized vice (or disorganized vice, for that matter) to be able to fill in the blanks. So: What are the Seven Sinful Cities? The cities where, if you put a foot wrong, you will wind up in a back alley, beaten, robbed, drugged, and sold into slavery in a brothel? While you can probably find anything in Salt Lake City that you can find in Vegas if you look hard enough, what I am looking for are the cities which glory in their seamy reputation, the places where drugs, gambling, prostitution, murder for hire, official corruption, and talking in the theater are the norm rather than the exception. I came up with four: Las Vegas New Orleans Rio de Janero Singapore I could add a few more, but am not certain enough of my facts to put them down in pixels. Amsterdam has the drugs and the prostitution, but does it have the overall seediness to qualify? Does Macao still have that reputation, or was that a century ago? Is Hong Kong included, or are its sins nowadays more of a financial nature than those of the flesh? I’m sure we have more than enough expertise on the Dope to fill out or correct my list. What are your nominations for the Seven Sinful Cities? ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/2 "2008-08-05T18:53:39Z")
I’d say that New York or Los Angeles probably qualify. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/3 "2008-08-05T18:59:31Z")
I doubt that there’s much you can’t get in Moscow, these days. Amsterdam is probably pretty good for sex and drugs. Probably not as good as Moscow for black market weapons. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/4 "2008-08-05T19:01:25Z")
Nah. NY and LA are positively at Salt Lake City level compared to some places I’ve been. For that matter, so is Vegas. Rio ranks right up there, though it was positively genteel compared to Tijuana. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/5 "2008-08-05T19:03:44Z")
I’m not sure than Singapore qualifies: you can get flogged for littering there, and that’s not such a big sin. But, if Singapore, then I’d suggest adding Bangkok and Hong Kong to the list. ---
**Author:** ![Hockey\_Monkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a183cd/32.png) [@Hockey\_Monkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hockey_Monkey)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/6 "2008-08-05T19:27:47Z")
Bangkok Tijuana Amsterdam ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/7 "2008-08-05T19:29:10Z")
Macau or Hong Kong in Asia, along with Bangkok(which goes even too far obviously). ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/8 "2008-08-05T19:48:43Z")
[QUOTE=Mr. Moto] Nah. NY and LA are positively at Salt Lake City level compared to some places I’ve been. For that matter, so is Vegas. [/QUOTE] Now that’s probably true, but not when Heinlein was writing. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/9 "2008-08-05T19:59:12Z")
[QUOTE=mswas] Now that’s probably true, but not when Heinlein was writing. [/QUOTE] Good point. I’d forgotten about Bangkok and Tijuana - Bangkok probably outdoes Singapore nowadays. Moscow is also a good one. Keep 'em coming! ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/10 "2008-08-05T20:17:47Z")
Manamma, Bahrain Rio Tijuana Manila ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/11 "2008-08-05T20:24:18Z")
Shanghai, at least historically. ---
**Author:** ![WillSantini](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ed8c4c/32.png) [@WillSantini](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillSantini)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/12 "2008-08-05T20:26:16Z")
Laredo ---
**Author:** ![The\_Batman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/22d042/32.png) [@The\_Batman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Batman)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/13 "2008-08-05T20:33:03Z")
I agree with everyone who’s mentioned Tijuana, I moved away from there almost a year ago but it’s been the wild west over there, especially these last five years. ---
**Author:** ![Desert\_Nomad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desert_nomad/32/177_2.png) [@Desert\_Nomad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desert_Nomad)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/14 "2008-08-05T21:37:14Z")
[QUOTE=BrotherCadfael] While you can probably find anything in Salt Lake City that you can find in Vegas if you look hard enough, what I am looking for are the cities which glory in their seamy reputation, the places where drugs, gambling, prostitution, murder for hire, official corruption, and talking in the theater are the norm rather than the exception. [/QUOTE] Not quite the same, but in Peshawar you can find most anything - weapons/drugs related. Need a surface to air missile, no problem. ---
**Author:** ![Mbossa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@Mbossa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mbossa)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/15 "2008-08-05T22:24:57Z")
Marrakech (aka Marrakesh) sounds like it might fit the bill. [ > [@](#): > > Marrakech has the largest traditional market (souk) in Morocco and also has one of the busiest squares in Africa, Djemaa el Fna.[1] The square bustles with acrobats, story-tellers, water sellers, dancers, and musicians, as well as drug lords by day; By night, the square turns into food stalls, becoming a huge open-air restaurant with busy life that include the infamous Ladies of the Night(prostitutes). ]([Marrakesh - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marrakech)) ---
**Author:** ![ASAKMOTSD](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/919ad9/32.png) [@ASAKMOTSD](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASAKMOTSD)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/16 "2008-08-05T22:29:26Z")
What no love for Detroit? We have murder, corruption, occasional mayhem - what do you people want? ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/17 "2008-08-05T22:49:11Z")
St. Petersburg, Florida. On the surface it seems quiet… TOO QUIET. Yet beneath its brittle veneer of geriatric indifference lurks a seething cauldron of immorality and perversion. Some of these debaucheries are known only to the extremely elderly. Here, every form of depravity is catered to for the right price. Corruption and degeneracy are rampant in this unwholesome bastion of moral turpitude. Vile pedlars hawk their obscene wares along the shadowed market streets, chanting hoarsely in unknown tongues. In the pallid light of dawn, heavily cloaked figures move silently among the gutters, gathering up the dead; corpses eviscerated of organs, corneas, bone marrow, scavenged over until they are practically unidentifiable as human. ---
**Author:** ![WormTheRed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/bbe5ce/32.png) [@WormTheRed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WormTheRed)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2008, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/18 "2008-08-05T23:29:45Z")
I’d say Riga would qualify. As I in one weekend there got threatened by the russian mob (at a restaurant) and a guy who kept offering me “whatever you can think of” when I walked past his car. That guy really reminded me of [Chet P\*\*\*y (Soooo NSFW)](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VpM8YcbUb4I) in From Dusk till Dawn ---
**Author:** ![LouisB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@LouisB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisB)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2008, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/19 "2008-08-06T00:18:12Z")
[QUOTE=Terrifel] St. Petersburg, Florida. On the surface it seems quiet… TOO QUIET. Yet beneath its brittle veneer of geriatric indifference lurks a seething cauldron of immorality and perversion. Some of these debaucheries are known only to the extremely elderly. Here, every form of depravity is catered to for the right price. Corruption and degeneracy are rampant in this unwholesome bastion of moral turpitude. Vile pedlars hawk their obscene wares along the shadowed market streets, chanting hoarsely in unknown tongues. In the pallid light of dawn, heavily cloaked figures move silently among the gutters, gathering up the dead; corpses eviscerated of organs, corneas, bone marrow, scavenged over until they are practically unidentifiable as human. [/QUOTE] Yeah, but it beats Tampa. Tampa ain’t nothing but sink holes and traffic jams. ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2008, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944/20 "2008-08-06T00:37:44Z")
And strip clubs! Don’t forget the strip clubs. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/seven-sinful-cities/458944.md?page=2)