# Sexual predators after release **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 14, 2004, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411 "2004-09-14T13:31:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2004, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/1 "2004-09-14T13:31:22Z")
A sexual predator who was “castrated” (I don’t know if it was done chemically or surgically) has been released in California. If I heard correctly, he will live in Washington. Naturally, people are angry. A poll was taken, and some people said that the ex-con should be forced to wear a tracking bracelet. 11% said he should be locked up. Others said that he has served his sentence and should be left alone to rejoin society. I understand that people don’t want a sex offender living near them. The question is, where will they live? No matter where the person moves, he is dogged by his record and the authorities make sure everyone knows what he has done. Many times the ex-con is forced to go elsewhere. Of course, the scenario plays out again. It seems as if people believe that a sex offender who has served his time has no right to live _anywhere_. At least, not near them. But since the same attitudes are everywhere, then by extension he has nowhere to go. As I said, I understand why people would be upset at having a sex offender in their neighbourhood; but again, what’s to be done? Maybe sex offenders should just be executed and have done with it? (I’m being sarcastic. I am pretty much against Capital Punishment.) 11% of the people polled said to lock him up. For how long? Should sex offenders be given life sentences? What’s the solution? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2004, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/2 "2004-09-14T13:42:25Z")
He has served his time (for whatever crime he was convicted of), but I think it can be argued that it should not be assumed that he is rehabilitated, or perhaps even argued that complete rehabilitation is impossible. That’s the problem. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2004, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/3 "2004-09-14T13:59:30Z")
> [@](#): > > That’s the problem. Indeed. But what’s the solution? [list][li]Keep them in prison forever[/li][li]Execute them[/li][li]Make him an outcast[/li][li]Find that he has “paid his debt to society” and leave him alone[/\*][/li]I’m sure that many people would favour option 1. But that would violate the Constitution because the punishment would (in many or most cases) be too severe for the crime. Option two is unreasonable, in my opinion. Option three is what we’re doing now. But if we make it impossible for someone who _has_ been rehabilitated (in this case, the guy voluntarily opted for castration), then how can the offenders become preductive members of society? I do appreciate that neighbours ought to know the risks; but again, how can someone be reintegrated into society if he is being persecuted? Option four would work with some offenders, but not for others. But how do you choose which? Are there other options? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2004, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/4 "2004-09-14T14:24:56Z")
> [@Johnny L.A.](#): > > Indeed. But what’s the solution? I was hoping you wouldn’t ask that. Perhaps we should first consider whether we can safely assume that _there is_ a solution - one that adequately satisfies our somewhat antagonistic senses of justice, safety and humanity, that is. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2004, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/5 "2004-09-14T15:48:19Z")
There are no good answers. As for me, if society wants to keep offenders away from others, society should have to grow a pair, change the sentencing, and pony up the cash money for the offenders’ upkeep. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2004, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/6 "2004-09-14T15:51:39Z")
Just to add to the debate, sexual criminals have one of the highest rates of recidivism. Once they commit that first crime, there are likely to do it again. My recommendation is option 1: Keep them in prison (or some other method of seperating them from the opportunity to commit their crime). ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2004, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/7 "2004-09-14T15:57:09Z")
[Sex Crime Recidivism](http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/press/rsorp94pr.htm). Sobering… ---
**Author:** ![Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac8455/32.png) [@Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bippy_the_Beardless)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2004, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/8 "2004-09-14T16:10:33Z")
Is there a high case of recidivism with chemically castrated ex sex crime prisoners? (I can’t read **Cartooniverse** ’s link so this data may be there) I would not see much injustice in release of dangerous and likely to reoffend prisoners being contingent on them undergoing some form of permanent castration (chemical or surgical) but they should have sperm samples taken, stored, and be given free medical help should they eventually want to have a family. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2004, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/9 "2004-09-14T16:35:10Z")
> [@Cartooniverse](#): > > [Sex Crime Recidivism](http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/press/rsorp94pr.htm). > > Sobering… And how, exactly, do you interpret those stats? I think the most interesting thing about them is that sex offenders have the _lowest_ recidivism rate, and yet there’s still hysteria when they’re released and you still have people wondering if its possible for a sex offender to be rehabilitated. If this is a poll (the OP feels a bit more like a great debate…) my opinion would be that a released sex offender shouldn’t be treated any differently then any other released convict. I’m very much against “Meagans Law”… ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2004, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/10 "2004-09-14T20:54:41Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > And how, exactly, do you interpret those stats? > > I think the most interesting thing about them is that sex offenders have the _lowest_ recidivism rate This may be precisely _because_ they are closely monitored now. > [@](#): > > and yet there’s still hysteria when they’re released I think the problem is that when a petty thief is released and returns to crime, all that happens is a few more petty thefts, whereas a sex-offender returning to crime (even if that might be statistically less likely) ruins another life, or [worse](http://www.sarahpayne.com/memorial/roywhiting.html). Hysteria is a bad thing, I agree, but so is naiveté. > [@](#): > > and you still have people wondering if its possible for a sex offender to be rehabilitated. I think it’s a perfectly valid thing to wonder - suppose, for example, that paedophilia is an _orientation_ (not an acceptable one, obviously). ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2004, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/11 "2004-09-14T21:10:33Z")
> [@](#): > > If this is a poll (the OP feels a bit more like a great debate…) I wondered if this should go in GD. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2004, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/12 "2004-09-15T03:53:10Z")
I’m torn on this issue in many ways, but one thing I do think is awful is that, when you release a sex offender into society, the nice neighborhoods with concerned neighborhood alliances and all will hound them out of their place. These are the places with good child supervision and, obviously (because the parents threw such a fit) concerned parents. So the offender get chased into the rotten neighborhoods, where there are just as many kids but with likely far less supervision and sometimes parental involvement, who are much more vulnerable in many ways. I think it creates a bad situation on all sides. For myself, I’d say they’ve served their sentances and should be free now like any other criminal. But then I don’t have kids and I don’t have a child molester living on my street. Oprah did a show on it and I felt pretty conflicted about all sides represented. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2004, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/13 "2004-09-15T12:40:36Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > This may be precisely _because_ they are closely monitored now. Is there any evidence at all to back up that guess? Other released criminals are closely watched as well, and I haven’t seen any evidence that the pressure on released sex offenders is drastically increased, even in areas that take Megan’s law seriously (for example, I get a post card with a photo and personal information every time one is released in my neighorhood). It’s possible that Meagan’s law is having an impact, but attributing the low recidivism of sex offenders to it and similiar measures is big stretch to make without any evidence. > [@](#): > > I think the problem is that when a petty thief is released and returns to crime, all that happens is a few more petty thefts, whereas a sex-offender returning to crime (even if that might be statistically less likely) ruins another life, You know that criminals other then petty thiefs and sex-offenders are released, right? There are murderers, people who commit domestic violence, non-sexual child abusers, burglars, larcenists, etc. They ruin lives too, in many cases far worse then the average sex-offender did. Where’s the “Meagans Law” to let people know that a wife-beater is moving into the neighorhood? What if someone starts dating him? Won’t someone _PLEASE_ think of the adult women! > [@](#): > > or [worse](http://www.sarahpayne.com/memorial/roywhiting.html). Setting public policies based on a small set of extreme cases isn’t a good practice. > [@](#): > > Hysteria is a bad thing, I agree, but so is naiveté. And straw men: arguing that sex offenders should be treated differently then all other types of released criminals because they can potentially cause more harm then a released petty thief is pretty bad. > [@](#): > > I think it’s a perfectly valid thing to wonder - suppose, for example, that paedophilia is an _orientation_ (not an acceptable one, obviously). There’s no such thing as an “acceptable” or “unacceptable” orientation. An orientation is simply the way a person is–a set of desires that can’t really be changed. _Acting_ on those desires, in a sex offenders case, is unacceptable. Merely desiring something is not. ---
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2004, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/14 "2004-09-15T13:33:57Z")
Assuming that repeat sex offenders can not be rehabilitated, it’s not just a question of punishment vs. crime, it’s a matter of protecting the rest of society from that person’s future crimes. So I don’t think locking the person up forever is unreasonable. ---
**Author:** ![misstee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/958977/32.png) [@misstee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/misstee)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2004, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/15 "2004-09-15T14:00:35Z")
Before we moved to our current house, we had a sex offender living in our neighborhood. When he was released from prison, the sheriff’s office had a piece in the paper stating his address and that legal action would be taken against anyone who harassed the individual. ( He was convicted of raping a 12 year old girl ) I did not let my kids/step kids play outside in our [fenced in] back yard alone. I was worried about them. That is part of my job as a parent, however, it seemed unfair to my kids that I has to keep them locked in [the back yard] because a predator was out there. I do not know what the solution is. I don’t know where sex offenders should go. ---
**Author:** ![Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac8455/32.png) [@Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bippy_the_Beardless)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2004, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/16 "2004-09-15T15:20:32Z")
> [@misstee](#): > > I did not let my kids/step kids play outside in our [fenced in] back yard alone. I was worried about them. That is part of my job as a parent, however, it seemed unfair to my kids that I has to keep them locked in [the back yard] because a predator was out there. Here is, I think the core of the problem. The released sex offender probably incresed the risk to **mistee** ’s children by only an incredably small amount. Less probably than if a ex child murderer had been released in the area, which **misstee** would not have been informed about. The children would have been under much greater risks from other calamities when they were allowed out before. BUT. The knowledge of the released sex offender, and the fact that there was a non-zero chance he might attack one of **mistee** ’s children means that **mistee** must now take extra precaution or face this slight risk of terrable outcome. Those who believe the risk is so minimal that **mistee** should not have reacted, must consider that people don’t react to probability in a logical fashion, if they did then there would be no State/National Lottery tickets ever sold. It is easy to be brave on behalf of yourself, but to be brave at a risk (however small) to your children is not an easy thing. P.S. I’m not quite sure how this post will be read/interpretted, so I am saying here that I in no way blame **mistee** for keeping her kids in with the knowledge she ad. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2004, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/17 "2004-09-15T23:28:20Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > Is there any evidence at all to back up that guess? Nope, hence the conspicuous inclusion of the word ‘may’ - sheer idle speculation, not masquerading as anything other than sheer idle speculation. > [@](#): > > And straw men: What straw men? Where did I set up a deliberately distorted version of your argument in order to attempt to refute it? > [@](#): > > arguing that sex offenders should be treated differently then all other types of released criminals because they can potentially cause more harm then a released petty thief is pretty bad. Pretty bad eh? Perhaps it’s as well I never made such an argument. > [@](#): > > There’s no such thing as an “acceptable” or “unacceptable” orientation. An orientation is simply the way a person is–a set of desires that can’t really be changed. _Acting_ on those desires, in a sex offenders case, is unacceptable. Merely desiring something is not. I think you understood what I meant. In any case, I think it could be argued that some kinds of desire in some people put them at elevated risk of doing something that would be unacceptable; we may not be able to stop the desire from taking place, but society may be reluctant to accept the person’s presence in their midst. > [@](#): > > You know that criminals other then petty thiefs and sex-offenders are released, right? There are murderers, people who commit domestic violence, non-sexual child abusers, burglars, larcenists, etc. They ruin lives too, in many cases far worse then the average sex-offender did. Where’s the “Meagans Law” to let people know that a wife-beater is moving into the neighorhood? What if someone starts dating him? Won’t someone PLEASE think of the adult women! And please, what is this kind of whiny sarcasm supposed to achieve other than pushing me toward an extreme that I never intended to occupy. If you’re looking for some hysterical unreasoning knee-jerker, you’ll have to look elsewhere - my post above was never intended to be anything other than a few earnest thoughts on the matter, but you have reacted as if they were dogmatic chest-beating. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2004, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/18 "2004-09-16T00:08:15Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > What straw men? Where did I set up a deliberately distorted version of your argument in order to attempt to refute it? My original argument was that that the disproportionate fear people have of released sex offenders is irrational and the belief they can’t be rehabilitated incorrect because they’re the criminal class least likely to re-offend. Here were my exact words: > [@Metacom](#): > > I think the most interesting thing about them is that sex offenders have the lowest recidivism rate, and yet there’s still hysteria when they’re released and you still have people wondering if its possible for a sex offender to be rehabilitated. Your response was: > [@Mangetout](#): > > I think the problem is that when a petty thief is released and returns to crime, all that happens is a few more petty thefts, whereas a sex-offender returning to crime (even if that might be statistically less likely) ruins another life, or worse. Hysteria is a bad thing, I agree, but so is naiveté. In my original argument, I was (implicitly) comparing sex-offenders to other classes of criminals–your response compares sex offenders to petty thieves. You’ve narrowed the argument from all criminals to the most convenient subset. Classic straw man, IMO. > [@](#): > > I think you understood what I meant. I didn’t, and still don’t, unless this is your way of saying “I agree, but…” 😃 > [@](#): > > And please, what is this kind of whiny sarcasm supposed to achieve other than pushing me toward an extreme that I never intended to occupy. Perhaps I would have been more cordial if you hadn’t implied that I was naive in your first reply to me?: > [@Mangetout](#): > > Hysteria is a bad thing, I agree, but so is naiveté. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2004, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/19 "2004-09-16T00:21:01Z")
My comment regarding naiveté wasn’t directed at you (although I can see how it looks that way) - it was intended as more of a general caution against the idea of going from one extreme all the way to the other. My apologies for the confusion. Most of what I said was intended to be _comment upon_ the issues raised in your post, not argument against them. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2004, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411/20 "2004-09-16T00:31:25Z")
> [@](#): > > In my original argument, I was (implicitly) comparing sex-offenders to other classes of criminals–your response compares sex offenders to petty thieves. You’ve narrowed the argument from all criminals to the most convenient subset. Classic straw man, IMO. You’ll notice that my comment _contrasting_(not comparing) sex offenders and petty thieves was a response to your expression of surprise regarding the hysteria - the reason people get hysterical is that the perceived potential for damage is greater and more distressing; I did not make any response to the paragraph in which you compared a broader range of criminals [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sexual-predators-after-release/264411.md?page=2)