# Shall **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 29, 2007, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986 "2007-06-29T23:18:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4da419/32.png) [@Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gala_Matrix_Fire)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2007, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/21 "2007-06-30T12:54:00Z")
We all use ‘shall’ around the office. It’s the right word, and we’re a bunch of language nerds. Far be it from us to dumb down our language, especially when there are no plebes around to hear us. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Miss\_Mapp](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miss_mapp/32/369_2.png) [@Miss\_Mapp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miss_Mapp)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2007, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/22 "2007-06-30T13:31:05Z")
I have a fondness for “shall” and “shan’t” and use them whenever I can. Also “ought.” (The verb, not as a colloquialism for zero.) It’s fun to say “Shall we?” or “Ought I?” ---
**Author:** ![Harmonious\_Discord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/74df32/32.png) [@Harmonious\_Discord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harmonious_Discord)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2007, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/23 "2007-06-30T13:52:03Z")
You bet. I use hung instead of hanged too. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Woo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7c8e57/32.png) [@Dr.Woo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Woo)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2007, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/24 "2007-06-30T17:19:11Z")
I use “shall” frequently and occasionally “shan’t”. Similar to **Hal** , I balance it by saying stuff like “Aw hell to the no, ho!” also. ---
**Author:** ![Soul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Soul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soul)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2007, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/25 "2007-06-30T17:21:52Z")
“Shall” and “Shan’t” are part of my daily vocabulary. They’re absolutely essential! ---
**Author:** ![Sierra\_Indigo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f0a364/32.png) [@Sierra\_Indigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sierra_Indigo)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/26 "2007-07-01T00:20:38Z")
Hehe. My particular foil for my fondness for “shall” and “shan’t” is an almost childlike glee in the -izzle suffix. Which often results in a butt-swatting from hubby when I’ve called him my husbnizzle for shizzle my dizzle. Izzle. ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/27 "2007-07-01T03:25:11Z")
It’s useful as a legal term - “should” or “could” or “would” just doesn’t cover all situations close enough. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/28 "2007-07-01T03:39:52Z")
“Shall” is commonly used in court orders, e.g. “The Court orders that the Defendant Bodsworthy shall pay to the Plaintiff Higglesgottom the sum of $2.98 forthwith.” In that sense, “shall” is more emphatic than “will”. In general, the less emphatic usage is I shall, you will, he will, we shall, you will, they will, and the more emphatic usage is I will, you shall, he shall, we will, you shall, they shall. ---
**Author:** ![Ruby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/13edae/32.png) [@Ruby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruby)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/29 "2007-07-01T05:22:29Z")
I use shall practically every day. Shant, not so much. ---
**Author:** ![cerberus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/71e660/32.png) [@cerberus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cerberus)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/30 "2007-07-01T05:46:19Z")
I agree with Frank about not lowering a language gratuitously by surveying the most common usage. As for a **Lexus Search** , is that where I drive around in a **Lexus** with a parabolic microphone and record people’s use or lack thereof of the word “shall”? Or are we talking about **LexisNexis**? 🙂 I don’t see how common usage dictates the original meaning or utility of a word. I concede that should/must/will appear to be more comfortable in routine usage, but that does not remove shall from the toolbox. ---
**Author:** ![Peanuthead](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peanuthead/32/360_2.png) [@Peanuthead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peanuthead)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 6:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/31 "2007-07-01T06:01:02Z")
[QUOTE=danceswithcats] ‘May’ ‘Should’ and ‘Shall’ are important words in many documents, particularly when those documents pertain to worker behavior where safety is concerned. [/QUOTE] Yes indeed. The NEC (National Electrical Code) emphasizes the distiction explicitly. (At least the last time I read it) **May** - you have a _choice_. **Should** - it is _recommended._ \*\*Shall \*\* - it is the _only_ way to do it. ---
**Author:** ![mamboman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecb155/32.png) [@mamboman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mamboman)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/32 "2007-07-01T06:33:27Z")
Heck yes. All the time. ---
**Author:** ![DMark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@DMark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMark)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 9:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/33 "2007-07-01T09:59:53Z")
Americans most certainly use it far less than Brits…I think the most I use the word is when saying, “Shall we?” when suggesting something illicit or out of the ordinary. Otherwise, it is usually somewhat pretentious in American English. BTW, I recently saw the film Pirates of the Caribbean and heard the phrase, “Batten down the hatches.” and realized I have never used the word “batten” in my life, other than with hatches, which seldom comes up in conversations in Las Vegas. ---
**Author:** ![Colophon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f05b48/32.png) [@Colophon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colophon)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/34 "2007-07-01T12:53:19Z")
I use “shall” pretty often, mostly in “Shall I…?” or “Shall we…?” constructions. “Shan’t” I say less often, but it doesn’t strike me as archaic at all. A question for those who don’t use it: what word do you use instead, e.g. in the sentence “Shall I open the window?”? “Will I open the window?” sounds like either a challenge to guess my next move, or a sentence spoken by a foreigner with a shaky grasp of English grammar. “Should I open the window?” sounds like a hypothetical question, with no sense of intent. Neither sounds quite right to me. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/35 "2007-07-01T13:39:39Z")
I searched the boards for use of this term, got zero hits and the following message: > [@](#): > > The following words are either very common, too long, or too short and were not included in your search : shall I know it’s not too short or too long, as a five letter word will normally return results. Yup, must be too common. Case closed. ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2007, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/36 "2007-07-01T21:24:54Z")
I’ve been told that it used to be low-class to say “I will” as opposed to “I shall”. I don’t know if this is true or not. ---
**Author:** ![Colophon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f05b48/32.png) [@Colophon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colophon)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2007, 10:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/37 "2007-07-02T10:28:46Z")
[QUOTE=Zsofia] I’ve been told that it used to be low-class to say “I will” as opposed to “I shall”. I don’t know if this is true or not. [/QUOTE] AFAIK it’s not about “class”, it’s about subtly different meanings. As my dictionary says: “The usual rule given for the use of _shall_ and _will_ is that where the meaning is one of simple futurity, _shall_ is used for the first person of the verb and _will_ for the second and third: _I shall go tomorrow_; _they will be there now_. Where the meaning involves command, obligation or determination, the postions are reversed: _It shall be done_; _I will definitely go_.” ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2007, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/38 "2007-07-02T11:00:42Z")
Yep, shall and (less frequently) shan’t are in my normal vocab. ---
**Author:** ![Gumboots](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/838e76/32.png) [@Gumboots](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gumboots)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2007, 11:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/39 "2007-07-02T11:18:02Z")
I can’t think of an example for the last time I used shan’t but I use shall pretty frequently. Shall is far from obsolete. ---
**Author:** ![robby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robby/32/11048_2.png) [@robby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robby)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2007, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986/40 "2007-07-02T14:35:21Z")
[QUOTE=Peanuthead] Yes indeed. The NEC (National Electrical Code) emphasizes the distiction explicitly. (At least the last time I read it) **May** - you have a _choice_. **Should** - it is _recommended._ \*\*Shall \*\* - it is the _only_ way to do it. [/QUOTE] We engineers use these words in the same manner for construction specifications. The most common word in a set of specs is probably the word “shall.” It shows up in just about every sentence. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shall/409986.md?page=3)