# Shepherd's Pie/Cottage Pie **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [November 29, 2010, 8:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie-cottage-pie/562268 "2010-11-29T08:57:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2010, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie-cottage-pie/562268/21 "2010-11-30T16:42:40Z")
TBH, regardless of whether a 19th-century cookbook confirms or denies that a shepherd’s pie has to have minced meat, in the 20th and 21st centuries a shepherd’s pie has to include mince (I don’t think it matters either way whether it’s leftover or not). I mean, there are reasons individual dishes have names - once you vary it too much, it’s a different dish with a different name. A chef claiming that shepherd’s pie with non-minced meat was valid would get very small tips. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2010, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie-cottage-pie/562268/22 "2010-11-30T17:07:52Z")
> [@scifisam2009](#): > > TBH, regardless of whether a 19th-century cookbook confirms or denies that a shepherd’s pie has to have minced meat, in the 20th and 21st centuries a shepherd’s pie has to include mince (I don’t think it matters either way whether it’s leftover or not). > > I mean, there are reasons individual dishes have names - once you vary it too much, it’s a different dish with a different name. A chef claiming that shepherd’s pie with non-minced meat was valid would get very small tips. You don’t tip a chef, and you don’t withhold a server’s tip because of the kitchen. Anyhow, I agree with you in principle, but it wouldn’t bother me if I got a shepherd’s pie with diced meat. I think chunks are certainly straying a bit too far off the path, but that’s a coin flip to me. If it’s clearly stated on the menu, then I’m okay with it. ETA: And it’s not just 19th century cookbooks. Feel free to look through Google Books, but there’s plenty of recipes through the 20th century that call for cubed or diced lamb or beef. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2010, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie-cottage-pie/562268/23 "2010-11-30T22:55:55Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > You don’t tip a chef, and you don’t withhold a server’s tip because of the kitchen. Sometimes you do both. > [@](#): > > Anyhow, I agree with you in principle, but it wouldn’t bother me if I got a shepherd’s pie with diced meat. I think chunks are certainly straying a bit too far off the path, but that’s a coin flip to me. If it’s clearly stated on the menu, then I’m okay with it. > > ETA: And it’s not just 19th century cookbooks. Feel free to look through Google Books, but there’s plenty of recipes through the 20th century that call for cubed or diced lamb or beef. I think the major difference might be that I’m English and you’re not. To you, it’s just any old recipe, but it’s something I’ve grown up with. Shepherd’s pie without mince would be like making clam chowder without clams. Like I said, I’m sure that dish with chunks of meat and lots of veg under mash could be lovely, but it’s not shepherd’s pie. Shepherd’s pie is comfort food, and you don’t want to be messing with people’s comfort food. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2010, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie-cottage-pie/562268/24 "2010-12-01T03:24:45Z")
> [@scifisam2009](#): > > I think the major difference might be that I’m English and you’re not. To you, it’s just any old recipe, but it’s something I’ve grown up with. Shepherd’s pie without mince would be like making clam chowder without clams. I admire your passion. I get into these same sorts of arguments about chili and barbecue on this side of the pond. ---
**Author:** ![AndrewL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@AndrewL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AndrewL)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2010, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie-cottage-pie/562268/25 "2010-12-01T14:40:06Z")
My shepherd’s pie recipe used to use Campbell’s Scotch Broth soup as a primary ingredient, to cook the potatoes in before adding to the meat mixture and for the source of barley, carrots and other small cooked vegetables. Unfortunately, it has been discontinued in my area. I am currently experimenting with homemade lamb stock made from cheap lamb neck bones. I also leave out the traditional sage and rosemary, on account of my wife being lethally allergic to those spices. ---
**Author:** ![villa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc79bd/32.png) [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2010, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie-cottage-pie/562268/26 "2010-12-01T16:18:01Z")
> [@scifisam2009](#): > > I think the major difference might be that I’m English and you’re not. To you, it’s just any old recipe, but it’s something I’ve grown up with. Shepherd’s pie without mince would be like making clam chowder without clams. > > Like I said, I’m sure that dish with chunks of meat and lots of veg under mash could be lovely, but it’s not shepherd’s pie. Shepherd’s pie is comfort food, and you don’t want to be messing with people’s comfort food. I agree in a way. I think everyone’s Mum had her own Shepherd’s Pie recipe, and that was the correct way of making Shepherd’s Pie. I remember going round to friends’ houses for tea and being appalled at what they called Shepherd’s Pie. I’ve always had it with mince, though. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2010, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie-cottage-pie/562268/27 "2010-12-01T16:45:07Z")
I heard a recipe for a French-ish variation on cottage pie on NPR. I adapted it some, and this is what I ended up with (everything is according to your taste): very lean ground beef spicy sausage (I ended up liking hot Italian sausage for this) onions garlic beef and mushroom soup base (cheating, but very tasty) water or red wine shredded cheddar cheese mashed potatoes (garlic style works well) Soak soup base in water or wine. Brown and drain meat. Using a little of the fat, sautee onion and garlic. Put all ingredients into pot and simmer for a while until the flavors meld. Put in casserole. Top with small amount of shredded cheese. Top with mashed potatoes. Top that with additional cheese, thinly spread, to get a lovely browned crust. Bake at 350 for about 30 minutes. ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2010, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie-cottage-pie/562268/28 "2010-12-01T17:13:50Z")
We’re having [this](http://allrecipes.com//Recipe/Meat-Loaf-Pie/Detail.aspx) tonight. Well, more or less, because I am not capable of following a recipe without tweaking it, and I don’t like the way this falls apart when you cut it. I think I’ll be using some of WhyNot’s ideas to improve it. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2010, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie-cottage-pie/562268/29 "2010-12-01T20:37:24Z")
One excellent way of doing it with leftovers is to find a really good lamb kleftico recipe or any other long slow cooked tomato-ey lamb dish Then the next day, pick the leftover lamb off the bone, chop roughly, mix back in to the leftover sauce. Mashed tatie on top and bob’s yer uncle. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2010, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie-cottage-pie/562268/30 "2010-12-01T21:38:33Z")
> [@Mollie\_Magill](#): > > I made this last night. There was much eating after the initial (and usual) cries of “I don’t like that!” For the veggies, I used about a cup of frozen mixed vegetables. Yay! I’m glad they liked it. We’re having it tonight, as I found a whole mess o’ ground beef for half off at Aldi today, bringing it to under $1 a pound. 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie-cottage-pie/562268.md?page=1)