# Shepherd's Pie **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 8, 2014, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615 "2014-12-08T00:13:02Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2014, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/21 "2014-12-08T16:50:34Z")
> [@WotNot](#): > > Not that I’ve ever heard. I just don’t know of anything to associate it with Scotland, particularly. I’ve always assumed it’s just one of those dishes that has variations on a theme across UK and Ireland, since the introduction of potatoes. It certainly has no regional connotations here. ---
**Author:** ![SeldomSeen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/7ba0ec/32.png) [@SeldomSeen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SeldomSeen)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2014, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/22 "2014-12-08T23:30:00Z")
Thanks to all who responded. The book in question was Frederick Forsyth’s _Icon_ and the exact quote (which I should have checked) was “Lunch was a kind of minced lamb covered in a potato crust. His hosts called it shepherd’s pie and soaked it all in a spicy black sauce”. So, soaked, not poured, but pretty much the same thing. I’m thinking some kind of [blood sauce](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_as_food#Soups.2C_stews_and_sauces) as several others have suggested and which I probably won’t be pouring on my shepherd’s pie in future. As to the origins of the dish, A quick check of easy resources (Yahoo, Wikipedia, couple of cooking sites) shows all say something like “Shepherd’s Pie probably originated in Scotland and in the north of England”. The question was really whether some traditional ingredient had been left out of the American version. If the ingredient in question is blood sauce, I think I’ll just stay with Tabasco. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2014, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/23 "2014-12-08T23:47:19Z")
> [@brainstall](#): > > And as for the use of the word pouring… how else do you describe what someone does with ketchup on fries? “Put.” Nothing can be “poured” if it’s so thick that you ever have to spank or squeeze the bottle to get it out. ---
**Author:** ![Coriolanus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/coriolanus/32/18769_2.png) [@Coriolanus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coriolanus)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2014, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/24 "2014-12-08T23:51:29Z")
> [@SeldomSeen](#): > > Thanks to all who responded. The book in question was Frederick Forsyth’s _Icon_ and the exact quote (which I should have checked) was “Lunch was a kind of minced lamb covered in a potato crust. His hosts called it shepherd’s pie and soaked it all in a spicy black sauce”. So, soaked, not poured, but pretty much the same thing. I’m thinking some kind of [blood sauce](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_as_food#Soups.2C_stews_and_sauces) as several others have suggested and which I probably won’t be pouring on my shepherd’s pie in future. > > As to the origins of the dish, A quick check of easy resources (Yahoo, Wikipedia, couple of cooking sites) shows all say something like “Shepherd’s Pie probably originated in Scotland and in the north of England”. The question was really whether some traditional ingredient had been left out of the American version. If the ingredient in question is blood sauce, I think I’ll just stay with Tabasco. > [@SanVito](#): > > I’ve always assumed it’s just one of those dishes that has variations on a theme across UK and Ireland, since the introduction of potatoes. It certainly has no regional connotations here. It’s a delicious - carry-able - dish that a shepherd could bring with him in the morning - out to the meadows with the sheep - and perhaps finish up before sunset. I could eat one every day. I’ve not tried - but I approve of Tabasco sauce on top. I’m Irish, yet I made this several times for my Irish mum. She’d probably not approve of the Tabasco, however. I am totally making this for the New Years feast, here in Rossiya! S novym godom! (Happy New Year). ---
**Author:** ![sisu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@sisu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sisu)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/25 "2014-12-09T00:42:49Z")
My immediate thought was HP, my kids like tomato sauce (ketchup) on theirs I prefer HP. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/26 "2014-12-09T02:48:32Z")
Given the original quote, it could just mean gravy that’s baked in with the whole thing, not something put on top at all. ---
**Author:** ![Tapioca\_Dextrin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Tapioca\_Dextrin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tapioca_Dextrin)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/27 "2014-12-09T03:02:08Z")
> [@SeldomSeen](#): > > The question was really whether some traditional ingredient had been left out of the American version. Lamb?? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![sisu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@sisu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sisu)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/28 "2014-12-09T03:14:53Z")
> [@Tapioca\_Dextrin](#): > > Lamb?? 😉 Yeah I love mince lamb but so many people make it with beef, still yummy but! ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/29 "2014-12-09T13:40:37Z")
> [@Tapioca\_Dextrin](#): > > Lamb?? 😉 Or mutton? You can’t even **get** mutton in America! ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/30 "2014-12-09T13:58:28Z")
> [@sisu](#): > > Yeah I love mince lamb but so many people make it with beef, still yummy but! In the UK we’d call the beef version ‘cottage pie’. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 2:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/31 "2014-12-09T14:03:25Z")
> [@SeldomSeen](#): > > Thanks to all who responded. The book in question was Frederick Forsyth’s _Icon_ and the exact quote (which I should have checked) was “Lunch was a kind of minced lamb covered in a potato crust. His hosts called it shepherd’s pie and soaked it all in a spicy black sauce”. So, soaked, not poured, but pretty much the same thing. I’m thinking some kind of [blood sauce](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_as_food#Soups.2C_stews_and_sauces) as several others have suggested and which I probably won’t be pouring on my shepherd’s pie in future. > > As to the origins of the dish, A quick check of easy resources (Yahoo, Wikipedia, couple of cooking sites) shows all say something like “Shepherd’s Pie probably originated in Scotland and in the north of England”. The question was really whether some traditional ingredient had been left out of the American version. If the ingredient in question is blood sauce, I think I’ll just stay with Tabasco. Well, I’ve never heard of blood sauce. If I google the term (or even blood gravy), it just sends me to American recipe sites, so you can’t blame the British for that one. A lot of people here would add a few splashes of [Worcestershire Sauce](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worcestershire_sauce) in the dish for a bit of spice. ---
**Author:** ![JKilez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e5b9ba/32.png) [@JKilez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKilez)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/32 "2014-12-09T14:23:07Z")
> [@sisu](#): > > My immediate thought was HP, my kids like tomato sauce (ketchup) on theirs I prefer HP. Given the original quote, this would be my first thought as well. One would pour on the HP just like one would pour ketchup over fries in the US. The term “pour” does not necessarily imply “douse”. It can just mean liberally apply. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/33 "2014-12-09T14:44:26Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Or mutton? You can’t even **get** mutton in America! Mutton has been a staple of Kentucky BBQ joints for generations. You can even find it on the menu at Arthur Bryant’s in KC. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/34 "2014-12-09T15:02:28Z")
> [@JKilez](#): > > Given the original quote, this would be my first thought as well. One would pour on the HP just like one would pour ketchup over fries in the US. The term “pour” does not necessarily imply “douse”. It can just mean liberally apply. It would be very unusual to apply HP liberally to shepherd’s pie. It’s strongly flavoured and would completely overwhelm the shepherd’s pie, to the extent of making it inedible if applied liberally. Why do some Americans think Brits use blood in everything? It’s only used in one type of sausage that’s also traditional in several other countries. Blood sauce (which I have also never heard of before) is not an ingredient in shepherd’s pie. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/35 "2014-12-09T15:08:56Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Mutton has been a staple of Kentucky BBQ joints for generations. You can even find it on the menu at Arthur Bryant’s in KC. I was gonna mention that–particularly the Owensboro area of Western Kentucky and I’ve seen it just across the border in Evansville, Indiana, as well. You can also sometimes find it at Halal butchers, although whether it’s lamb or mutton is not always clear. That said, it’s generally not easy at all to find in the US. Even plain ol’ lamb can sometimes take digging, especially if you’re looking for a cut other than chops or leg. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/36 "2014-12-09T15:09:27Z")
> [@SciFiSam](#): > > Why do some Americans think Brits use blood in everything? How many is some? I’ve never heard another American say anything like that. Our stereotypes of what you eat run more towards that you have fish and chips or tea and crumpets at every meal. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/37 "2014-12-09T15:13:44Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > How many is some? I’ve never heard another American say anything like that. Our stereotypes of what you eat run more towards that you have fish and chips or tea and crumpets at every meal. I agree. If it’s a stereotype, it’s not a particularly known one. I think many Anericans would be aware of black pudding but, beyond that, I don’t think its a known association. In my neighborhood, blood is more associated with Polish food (blood sausage/kiszma, and duck blood soup/czernina) and some Asian cuisines. ---
**Author:** ![troub](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troub/32/14802_2.png) [@troub](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/troub)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/38 "2014-12-09T15:29:04Z")
> [@JKilez](#): > > The term “pour” does not necessarily imply “douse”. It can just mean liberally apply. Why does it even have to mean that? To me, you could “pour” even what amounts to a few drops. If you pick up a container, and tip it so that some of the contents spill out, that’s “pouring.” Isn’t it? What else would it be? ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/39 "2014-12-09T15:40:20Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I agree. If it’s a stereotype, it’s not a particularly known one. I think many Anericans would be aware of black pudding but, beyond that, I don’t think its a known association. In my neighborhood, blood is more associated with Polish food (blood sausage/kiszma, and duck blood soup/czernina) and some Asian cuisines. I could eat some кишка (kishka). It’s all but impossible to find good blood sausage in the area. I may end up biting the bullet and driving a couple hours over to Parma OH, where there is a large Ukrainian population, to stock up on kishka, salo, and other delicacies for the holidays. ---
**Author:** ![JKilez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e5b9ba/32.png) [@JKilez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKilez)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615/40 "2014-12-09T16:37:49Z")
> [@troub](#): > > Why does it even have to mean that? To me, you could “pour” even what amounts to a few drops. If you pick up a container, and tip it so that some of the contents spill out, that’s “pouring.” Isn’t it? What else would it be? Drizzle? Dabble? Sprinkle? Shake? Pepper? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shepherds-pie/706615.md?page=3)