# sherlock series 3 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 18, 2013, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312 "2013-03-18T23:15:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![BrokenBriton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@BrokenBriton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrokenBriton)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2014, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/281 "2014-01-14T18:05:47Z")
> [@Bozuit](#): > > I’m a little confused and disappointed. When Sherlock checked Magnussen’s glasses and found out they’re ordinary, I assumed this was an act and he didn’t _really_ expect him to be using some kind of HUD on his glasses. I also assumed his ignorance of the true location of the “vaults” was feigned. Right up until he shot Magnussen I assumed he was letting Magnussen think he was winning in order to defeat him. I can’t see Sherlock accepting defeat (and shooting Magnussen is surely admitting defeat) without more of a fight. > > Are we supposed to assume all of this _was_ an act in order to get Magnussen into a position where shooting him in front of the authorities was possible? Can we imagine Sherlock considered every possible option and came to the conclusion that the best kind of victory he could achieve against Magnussen, while still protecting his friends, was this? > > I was really tired when I watched the last episode so maybe there’s something I’m missing… As Holmes said, I think more than once, Magnussen was anextremely dangerous foe. Presumably because he outsmarts everyone else most of the time. ---
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2014, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/282 "2014-01-14T18:23:54Z")
> [@Lissla\_Lissar](#): > > Why was Sherlock hanging out in the heroin den at the beginning? He said it was part of his case for Lady Smallwood? He needed Magnusson to really believe that he had a drug problem. However, that seemed to me like a plot point that was mentioned early on (Sherlock runs out of Barts ecstatic that his “addiction” was about to hit the front pages) but I can’t see what the significance of it was in the end. It never seemed to go anywhere. ---
**Author:** ![Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/half_man_half_wit/32/21766_2.png) [@Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Half_Man_Half_Wit)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2014, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/283 "2014-01-14T18:39:39Z")
> [@Lissla\_Lissar](#): > > Why was Sherlock hanging out in the heroin den at the beginning? He said it was part of his case for Lady Smallwood? He was building a ‘pressure point’ for Magnusson to attach to, in the hopes that he would believe Sherlock cared about whether or not the public thinks he’s a junkie, and attempt to manipulate him using this knowledge. > [@Gyrate](#): > > Okay, I’ve rewatched “The Sign of Three” again and I’ve still missed something in the rapid exposition. How did the “Mayfly Man” know who to date to get information on his victim and the wedding? He didn’t, that’s why he had to date so many; he stopped as soon as he had found a way in. > [@Bozuit](#): > > I’m a little confused and disappointed. When Sherlock checked Magnussen’s glasses and found out they’re ordinary, I assumed this was an act and he didn’t _really_ expect him to be using some kind of HUD on his glasses. I also assumed his ignorance of the true location of the “vaults” was feigned. Right up until he shot Magnussen I assumed he was letting Magnussen think he was winning in order to defeat him. I can’t see Sherlock accepting defeat (and shooting Magnussen is surely admitting defeat) without more of a fight. > > Are we supposed to assume all of this _was_ an act in order to get Magnussen into a position where shooting him in front of the authorities was possible? Can we imagine Sherlock considered every possible option and came to the conclusion that the best kind of victory he could achieve against Magnussen, while still protecting his friends, was this? > > I was really tired when I watched the last episode so maybe there’s something I’m missing… I think this can be read in at least two ways: one, to show that even Sherlock isn’t infallible. He’s made mistakes before (and notably, there’s Mary), and this sort of thing may be a way to keep him from getting too powerful a character, what with his otherwise near-omniscience about anybody with nary a glance. In the end, he had pledged his protection to the Watsons, and used the only way out to safety—for them—that was left. The other is that yes, Sherlock either knew or strongly suspected that there were no tangible physical records; he killed Magnusson because really, what other way would there be to neutralize him? He’d walk on any trial because of the judge’s fondness for girly undergarments purchased online from Japan, he’d never see the inside of a cell, and worse, he’d always be a danger to Mary. Killing him was the only option to remove the threat, and he did it in a way so as to ensure minimum harm both to him and Watson. These options aren’t independent: in the end, they just differ on when Sherlock picked up on the empty vault, and he may have done that at any point between the very beginning and actually seeing the back room. ---
**Author:** ![Bozuit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/edb3f5/32.png) [@Bozuit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bozuit)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2014, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/284 "2014-01-14T18:40:20Z")
> [@BrokenBriton](#): > > As Holmes said, I think more than once, Magnussen was anextremely dangerous foe. Presumably because he outsmarts everyone else most of the time. Of course he said that. But he needs to be “dangerous”, otherwise there’s not much fun to the story, is there? However, Magnussen’s only trick is his “pressure points”. The idea that Sherlock, or anyone else really, would not predict the “get to Sherlock through Mary and Watson (again)” move is hard to believe. I don’t see how he could have failed to predict any of Magnussen’s “reveals”. If that’s true, he must have planned to murder Magnussen before even getting to his house, which is a little unsatisfying for me since it’s: a) An admission of defeat from Sherlock, which felt unjustified given the lack of time spent on the Sherlock v Magnussen story - if it had been a bigger part of the whole of series three with regular stalemates/smaller defeats it would make more sense. b) A little uncharacteristic of either this Holmes or the original (as far as I remember) to resort to cold-blooded killing to solve a problem. Perhaps this will all make more sense upon the arrival of series four. > [@PaulParkhead](#): > > He needed Magnusson to really believe that he had a drug problem. However, that seemed to me like a plot point that was mentioned early on (Sherlock runs out of Barts ecstatic that his “addiction” was about to hit the front pages) but I can’t see what the significance of it was in the end. It never seemed to go anywhere. Perhaps, if all Sherlock’s efforts to convince Magnussen that his “pressure point” was drugs turned out to be for naught, with Magnussen ridiculing Sherlock for attempting to fool him, the ending would make more sense. ---
**Author:** ![Bozuit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/edb3f5/32.png) [@Bozuit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bozuit)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2014, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/285 "2014-01-14T18:55:16Z")
> [@Half\_Man\_Half\_Wit](#): > > The other is that yes, Sherlock either knew or strongly suspected that there were no tangible physical records; he killed Magnusson because really, what other way would there be to neutralize him? He’d walk on any trial because of the judge’s fondness for girly undergarments purchased online from Japan, he’d never see the inside of a cell, and worse, he’d always be a danger to Mary. Killing him was the only option to remove the threat, and he did it in a way so as to ensure minimum harm both to him and Watson. What about simply obtaining some other kind of leverage against Magnussen? Something that would allow Sherlock to destroy Magnussen if he didn’t keep the relevant secrets. This could have at least been explored, even if just to show Sherlock exhausting his other options. Alternatively, it wouldn’t seem implausible (within the show) for Sherlock to use (and perhaps develop) a drug that damages memory in such as way as to destroy Magnussen’s memory palace. Finally, Sherlock could simply persuade Mycroft to put Magnussen in a dark hole somewhere with no way of getting messages out. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2014, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/286 "2014-01-14T19:03:50Z")
Actually, I think that when Mycroft was in the helicopter at the end, Mycroft intended to lock up Magnussen somewhere. At first I thought Mycroft was planning to kill Magnussen by sniper, which was, I thought, why he kept telling Sherlock to step away from him. But Mycroft seemed to find Magnussen useful, so perhaps he thought he could keep him locked up and controlled. ---
**Author:** ![Bozuit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/edb3f5/32.png) [@Bozuit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bozuit)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2014, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/287 "2014-01-14T19:29:39Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Actually, I think that when Mycroft was in the helicopter at the end, Mycroft intended to lock up Magnussen somewhere. At first I thought Mycroft was planning to kill Magnussen by sniper, which was, I thought, why he kept telling Sherlock to step away from him. But Mycroft seemed to find Magnussen useful, so perhaps he thought he could keep him locked up and controlled. Yes, I expected Mycroft (or the men with him) to shoot Magnussen at one point too. It seemed like they were setting it up with Magnussen’s assumption that Sherlock and Watson were the targets. ---
**Author:** ![A\_Lethargic\_Prawn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@A\_Lethargic\_Prawn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/A_Lethargic_Prawn)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2014, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/288 "2014-01-14T21:47:20Z")
Watched it again tonight but there are still some things that have been nagging me since Sunday; 1. Mycroft having his laptop on him at their parents. Why? 2. The off-hand ‘Job offer to decline’ for Sherlock that would be fatal in six months. A possible exit strategy for Sherlock? 3. Mycroft’s apparent knowledge of being drugged at their parents. Did he consciously drink it, knowing it was drugged? 4. Mycroft being present with the SWAT team at the end. Why would he be present in such a situation? Did he have doubts about the ‘vaults’ and deduced the outcome that Sherlock would choose? I’m probably just over-analysing moot points but I can’t help think Mycroft was actively supporting, or at least aware of, Sherlock’s plan. Anyone got any theories? Also, what did Mycroft mean at the end regarding the familial sentiment and the ‘other’? A third Holmes sibling? ---
**Author:** ![galen\_ubal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/galen_ubal/32/4440_2.png) [@galen\_ubal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/galen_ubal)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2014, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/289 "2014-01-14T21:57:26Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Actually, I think that when Mycroft was in the helicopter at the end, Mycroft intended to lock up Magnussen somewhere. At first I thought Mycroft was planning to kill Magnussen by sniper, which was, I thought, why he kept telling Sherlock to step away from him. But Mycroft seemed to find Magnussen useful, so perhaps he thought he could keep him locked up and controlled. > [@Bozuit](#): > > Yes, I expected Mycroft (or the men with him) to shoot Magnussen at one point too. It seemed like they were setting it up with Magnussen’s assumption that Sherlock and Watson were the targets. That had been my thought as well - that Mycroft was going to have his men shoot Magnusson. Especially after Sherlock loudly announced that all the blackmail information was in Magnusson’s head. I’m still rather surprised that that’s not where they went, and I think it would have made much more sense. Certainly, Mycroft has had people killed before, given his position, if not necessarily so directly. ---
**Author:** ![BrokenBriton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@BrokenBriton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrokenBriton)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2014, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/290 "2014-01-14T22:58:00Z")
> [@Bozuit](#): > > If that’s true, he must have planned to murder Magnussen before even getting to his house, which is a little unsatisfying for me since it’s: > > a) An admission of defeat from Sherlock, which felt unjustified given the lack of time spent on the Sherlock v Magnussen story - if it had been a bigger part of the whole of series three with regular stalemates/smaller defeats it would make more sense. > > b) A little uncharacteristic of either this Holmes or the original (as far as I remember) to resort to cold-blooded killing to solve a problem. > > Perhaps this will all make more sense upon the arrival of series four. “planned” is a bit strong for me. He clearly wanted it as an opton of last resort hence asking Watson if he’d bought his gun as they walked towards the helicopter. I liked the shooting. After all, it’s what many would have liked to have done to Murdoch, at least in their imagination. It’s Sherlock 'reimagined in a 21st century context, not regurgitated. > [@A\_Lethargic\_Prawn](#): > > Watched it again tonight but there are still some things that have been nagging me since Sunday; > > 1. Mycroft having his laptop on him at their parents. Why? > 2. The off-hand ‘Job offer to decline’ for Sherlock that would be fatal in six months. A possible exit strategy for Sherlock? > 3. Mycroft’s apparent knowledge of being drugged at their parents. Did he consciously drink it, knowing it was drugged? > 4. Mycroft being present with the SWAT team at the end. Why would he be present in such a situation? Did he have doubts about the ‘vaults’ and deduced the outcome that Sherlock would choose? > > I’m probably just over-analysing moot points but I can’t help think Mycroft was actively supporting, or at least aware of, Sherlock’s plan. Anyone got any theories? > > Also, what did Mycroft mean at the end regarding the familial sentiment and the ‘other’? A third Holmes sibling? 1. He’s basically head of national security, not an IT contractor 2. Refs the Serbian story from earlier (dead in six months was Mycroft’s estimate) 3. Outside/smoking banter, and they were talking about the alcohol (how Mycroft loved Sherlock, etc) 4. Because they were arresting the man most dangerous to the country? ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [January 14, 2014, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/291 "2014-01-14T23:13:47Z")
> [@A\_Lethargic\_Prawn](#): > > Watched it again tonight but there are still some things that have been nagging me since Sunday; > Also, what did Mycroft mean at the end regarding the familial sentiment and the ‘other’? A third Holmes sibling? this harkens back to a statement made by papa holmes to mary. he said that mama holmes gave up her career for “the children”. not “the boys” or “to stay home with mycroft and sherlock”; he said “the children”. why would you say that unless you have a mixed set. it kinda jumped out at me. then mycroft’s statement at the end being very gender neutral and non personal; has me thinking sister, and perhaps that things did not go well. perhaps something happened in eastern europe where the holmes go to meet their fate. (resulting in nero wolfe!) ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/292 "2014-01-15T01:01:19Z")
> [@Bozuit](#): > > Right up until he shot Magnussen I assumed he was letting Magnussen think he was winning in order to defeat him. I can’t see Sherlock accepting defeat (and shooting Magnussen is surely admitting defeat) I would pay good money to have you write the next James Bond movie. [Bond guns down a minion] _“I admit defeat; he outsmarted me.”_ [Bond uses a gimmicked wristwatch to kill the henchman] _“And I am defeated again! Truly, his intellect was more than I could handle!”_ [Bond sets the film’s evil mastermind on fire for the win.] _“Curse me for a fool! I am a wretched failure, doomed to forever wallow in defeat!”_ ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/293 "2014-01-15T01:54:59Z")
So why is Sherlock’s dead dog a pressure point? ---
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/294 "2014-01-15T02:05:00Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > So why is Sherlock’s dead dog a pressure point? Because he loved the dog. In ep2 we see Mycroft speaking to Sherlock on the phone, warning him of the dangers of getting emotionally involved and he says something like “remember Redbeard?” Then when Sherlock is in his mind palace trying to avoid dying from the gunshot wound, the dog appears and he (Sherlock, that is, not the dog) says something like “Looks like they’re putting me down too, old boy.” It’s just an indication of his potential weakness - he can and does form emotional bonds, but very rarely. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/295 "2014-01-15T02:42:04Z")
The pressure points are not potential weaknesses, they are things Magnussen can use to blackmail someone. A dead dog doesn’t fit at all. ---
**Author:** ![Bozuit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/edb3f5/32.png) [@Bozuit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bozuit)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/296 "2014-01-15T03:07:41Z")
I don’t think they’re just intended for blackmail purposes. The opium or “Hounds of Baskerville” (or whatever it said) would be no good for blackmail either. ---
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/297 "2014-01-15T03:30:37Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > The pressure points are not potential weaknesses, they are things Magnussen can use to blackmail someone. A dead dog doesn’t fit at all. It was just a symbol, not something he could use directly for blackmail. It indicated that Sherlock has weak points, because he does actually care about some people (and dogs). A person who has no emotions and doesn’t give a shit about anything would be hard to blackmail. ---
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/298 "2014-01-15T03:34:33Z")
> [@Bozuit](#): > > I don’t think they’re just intended for blackmail purposes. The opium or “Hounds of Baskerville” (or whatever it said) would be no good for blackmail either. Well, I can see how an apparent drug addiction would be a possible angle, but the “Hounds of Baskerville” certainly wouldn’t work. It was just an indication - there are things that scare him. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 5:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/299 "2014-01-15T05:42:43Z")
> [@A\_Lethargic\_Prawn](#): > > Watched it again tonight but there are still some things that have been nagging me since Sunday; > > 1. Mycroft having his laptop on him at their parents. Why? Oh? Where did you get the idea that was Mycroft’s laptop he brought to Magnussen’s? Was it because Sherlock wanted you to think that it was the same one on the table? I bet it’s full of cat photos and engineering software. And Christmas without a computer? At his _family’s?_ ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2014, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312/300 "2014-01-15T06:03:15Z")
> [@PaulParkhead](#): > > He needed Magnusson to really believe that he had a drug problem. However, that seemed to me like a plot point that was mentioned early on (Sherlock runs out of Barts ecstatic that his “addiction” was about to hit the front pages) but I can’t see what the significance of it was in the end. It never seemed to go anywhere. It’s one of several points showing Sherlock wasn’t as far ahead of Magnussen than he thought. He knew he had to have a pressure point that Magnussen could exploit to get him to negotiate with him, and thought he didn’t really have one, so he manufactured one he feels he has under control - drug addiction. But Magnussen already knew he could get at him with John, Irene, Redbeard, Moriarty, or the Hound. Similarly, he thought he’d figured out Magnussen’s trick with the glasses…but the glasses were just glasses, and he had a Mind Palace. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sherlock-series-3/653312.md?page=16)