# Shooting a fawn. Any "good" reason? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 9, 2014, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762 "2014-12-09T14:52:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2014, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/41 "2014-12-09T23:48:45Z")
Good grief, even in places where there are leash laws dogs are allowed to run free on their own property. And it’s winter. The snakes are asleep. I assume kayaker knows the risks since it’s his property. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/42 "2014-12-10T00:08:15Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > Well, yes, but it’s a little weird to come in and quiz someone who is out burying gut piles–and is therefore presumably pretty familiar with hunters and hunting and the dangers therein. It smacks of a tu quoque: the OP is potentially critical of some hunter, somewhere, and the response is to go looking for something to attack in return. ''Yeah, well, who knows, but why were you even out there?" is an odd response. > > That may not be at all the intent, but it’s very much how it came across. Or - The OP asked a legitimate question that he wanted an answer to. As to my post, what do you suppose the term - I’m curious - means? I had serious, issue-related, questions and I made those questions public. **kayaker** was nice enough to provide more details. Your post seems to be an attempt to prevent questions from being asked. Or at least, that’s how it came across. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/43 "2014-12-10T00:15:45Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > A friends home was hit a year or two ago. She was in the kitchen and thought her cat knocked something over. The police were called, recovered a bullet, but unless a suspect and rifle were found, she was told the case would likely never be solved. Decades ago, while I was a young **doorhinge** and still living with my folks near Midway Airport in Chicago, our house was struck by a bullet. The police were called, they recovered a bullet, and said that unless a suspect and firearm were found, the case would likely never be solved. ---
**Author:** ![Mama\_Zappa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/71e660/32.png) [@Mama\_Zappa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mama_Zappa)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/44 "2014-12-10T01:09:35Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > I think he just understands that if a hiker gets shot, the hiker has the most to lose - and so it’s in his best interest to consider his actions carefully, up to and including carefully considering whether it’s worth the risk to exercise his right to be in the woods during hunting season. Any hunter that shoots a hiker should be charged with felony reckless endangerment and never be allowed to possess guns again - but that won’t help the hiker, who may be disfigured, paralyzed, or killed in the incident. > > As an avid motorcyclist, the analogous situation for me would be to think carefully about whether I want to exercise my right to ride mile after mile in another driver’s blind spot. This. We were walking a week or so ago along a trail through some woods, and saw with bemusement signs saying that bow hunting was allowed for deer control purposes (suburban area, just enough woods that deer thrive) and to stay on posted trails. We did so, but when the paved trail ran out and we continued on dirt paths, we were glad we were wearing brightly colored clothing (bright red and bright blue) - just hoped we didn’t encounter any color-blind bowhunters. When the dirt trail petered out we crossed a semi-open area (trees and a thick carpet of leaves) to a nearby backyard - and I admit I was a titch nervous the whole time. Another example of “yeah, they aren’t allowed to harm you but precious good it does you” is crossing the street. It’s not legal for cars to hit you. Cars even have to yield to you if you’re in a crosswalk. But when I cross, I look out for the cars because drivers don’t always pay attention. My grieving family may have grounds to sue the inattentive drive but it doesn’t fix _me_. Common sense is required. ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/45 "2014-12-10T03:28:47Z")
> [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](#): > > Good grief, even in places where there are leash laws dogs are allowed to run free on their own property. And it’s winter. The snakes are asleep. > > I assume kayaker knows the risks since it’s his property. Well it is Offal, but if he wants to run the risks, then its all on him… ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/46 "2014-12-10T03:37:24Z")
> [@Orwell](#): > > No, you said if there were a problem, there should be a change in **regulations** for hunters. You didn’t say “behavior”. Sure, I’m nitpicking, but the constant call for new policies, rules, regulations and laws irks me. It’s a pet peeve. Then what you’re irked by has nothing to do with my understanding of reality. Yes, I called for regulations **in order to change hunter behavior** , and I called for it **in a hypothetical universe that’s not our own**. Is that really what you want to be making a stink over? If so, go for it, but it’s a mighty trifling thing for you to get worked up over. FWIW, if these fatalities increased significantly, there would certainly be a cause for that increase. In this hypothetical world, I’d look into what the cause was, and then I’d call for appropriate REGULATIONS (ooga booga!) to eliminate that cause. Is it the new wave of potsmoking hunters who unaccountably start mistaking humans for deer? Regulate the smoking of weed while hunting. Is it a new style of hunting called sprinthunting, in which you see who’s the first to bag a deer? Regulate sprinthunting. Whatever your boogyman idea of regulations is, that’s probably not what I’m suggesting. The analogy to looking both ways before crossing the street seems problematic, since more people are killed each year as pedestrians than are killed by hunters by a factor of several thousand. Looking both ways is a trivial way to decrease your chance of being one of those thousands of fatalities; entirely avoiding “wandering around the woods during deer season,” as **doorhinge** suggests, is a major inconvenience to avoid a very small risk. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/47 "2014-12-10T12:21:50Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > OK, so the dogs only wander around off leash on Sundays? > > You _do_ have copperheads, rattlesnakes, coyotes, bears, wild hogs, and ticks that cause Lyme disease and Rocky Mountain spotted fever. > > Have you ever seen a dog bit by a Pit Viper? Very nasty. Not that this is worthy of reply, but for completeness’ sake… Our dogs are very well trained. We own leashes and keep a set in each vehicle. At home we maintain verbal control. “Stay close” is a command they follow, so while working in the yard or barn they remain on a tight verbal leash. Sure, we have copperheads. I’ve seen two in my life. My dogs have weekly experience with garter snakes. They are afraid of them and behave accordingly. Coyotes and bears exist, but are both rare and timid. No wild hogs. Yes there are ticks, and my yearly Advantix/Frontline bill probably exceeds what I spend on my own healthcare each year. Also, our dogs are have recieved the Borrelia bacterin, making Lyme disease less of a concern. [Cite](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=17665031&postcount=6) But seriously, if we are going to discuss tick related disease, [I have some experience from my gf’s ordeal.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=693630) ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/48 "2014-12-10T13:46:35Z")
I live in the burbs. I miss the days before leash laws. Yes, there was more stray dog poop then, but there were many fewer nuisance critters, and I enjoyed the interactions with neighborhood dogs. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/49 "2014-12-10T14:12:30Z")
Lest DrDeth be worried about the safety of our dogs, [here’s a pic.](http://i681.photobucket.com/albums/vv174/kayaker01/20141005_181437_zps0212af78.jpg) All have completed basic and advanced obedience. In addition, the Shepherd has completed basic agility and basic scent work. The Shepherd has brought home a prize from Paws For The Cure three consecutive years. And they’re good dogs.🙂 Thinking over mishaps in the woods, getting skunked is one malady I’ve had to deal with. A paw laceration and some minor strains/sprains have occurred over the years as well. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/50 "2014-12-10T14:39:30Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > …entirely avoiding “wandering around the woods during deer season,” as **doorhinge** suggests, is a major inconvenience to avoid a very small risk. (post shortened) You don’t come here for the hunting, do you? Why would you, a non-hunter, chose to wander around the woods during deer season? To view hunters in their natural state? To chase game away from the hunters? In the hope of receiving a non-life-threatening injury so you can sue the landowner and hunter? To poop in the woods? ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/51 "2014-12-10T15:03:51Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > (post shortened) > > You don’t come here for the hunting, do you? Why would you, a non-hunter, chose to wander around the woods during deer season? To view hunters in their natural state? To chase game away from the hunters? In the hope of receiving a non-life-threatening injury so you can sue the landowner and hunter? To poop in the woods? I used to do a lot of hiking. I was more interested in viewing trees and deer in their natural state than in observing hunters. YMMV. I tried to wear bright, artifical colors during hunting season, but otherwise didn’t worry about it much. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/52 "2014-12-10T15:05:49Z")
WATCH OUT FOR SNAKES! (obligatory MST3K ref) ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/53 "2014-12-10T15:27:06Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > You don’t come here for the hunting, do you? Why would you, a non-hunter, chose to wander around the woods during deer season? My experience is mainly in NH, not sure where you are from. Most people I hike with are 4 season hikers, and are out in the woods throughout the year. During hunting season they generally wear orange, especially down low where the hunters are more common but not all hikers do so. They also typically put an orange vest on their dogs, who are usually off leash around here. If you’re on trails you’re pretty darn safe. Hunters know enough not to hunt around hiking trails even though it is legal. Hikers scare off game and hiking trails generally take you up high quickly, which hunters are trying to avoid. Hikers are also often bushwackers and many destinations are not on trails. During hunting season most bushwackers take more precautions but aren’t going to stop their activities. Again, blaze orange and making more noise are pretty standard, plus choosing destination that avoid the most popular terrain for deer hunting. Lots of folks wander in the woods for a variety of reasons. Taking precautions are good, but if you avoided the woods during hunting season that’s a big chunk of time out of your schedule. Hunters can and should be held to a high standard for safety. Hikers should understand the risks and take appropriate precautions. But neither has exclusive use of the woods. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/54 "2014-12-10T15:34:44Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > My experience is mainly in NH, not sure where you are from. Most people I hike with are 4 season hikers, and are out in the woods throughout the year. During hunting season they generally wear orange, especially down low where the hunters are more common but not all hikers do so. They also typically put an orange vest on their dogs, who are usually off leash around here. > > If you’re on trails you’re pretty darn safe. Hunters know enough not to hunt around hiking trails even though it is legal. Hikers scare off game and hiking trails generally take you up high quickly, which hunters are trying to avoid. > > Hikers are also often bushwackers and many destinations are not on trails. During hunting season most bushwackers take more precautions but aren’t going to stop their activities. Again, blaze orange and making more noise are pretty standard, plus choosing destination that avoid the most popular terrain for deer hunting. > > Lots of folks wander in the woods for a variety of reasons. Taking precautions are good, but if you avoided the woods during hunting season that’s a big chunk of time out of your schedule. Hunters can and should be held to a high standard for safety. Hikers should understand the risks and take appropriate precautions. But neither has exclusive use of the woods. All true here as well. Excellent post, thanks! ---
**Author:** ![Zorkmid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e68b1a/32.png) [@Zorkmid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zorkmid)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/55 "2014-12-10T15:42:13Z")
Someone might have shot it by accident, then panicked and took off when they saw what they did. I can see an inexperienced hunter (or a drunk one :rolleyes:) doing that. Or shot it deliberately and not taken it for meat because they were worried about getting busted by the game commission. ---
**Author:** ![Zorkmid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e68b1a/32.png) [@Zorkmid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zorkmid)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/56 "2014-12-10T15:46:44Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > My experience is mainly in NH, not sure where you are from. Most people I hike with are 4 season hikers, and are out in the woods throughout the year. During hunting season they generally wear orange, especially down low where the hunters are more common but not all hikers do so. They also typically put an orange vest on their dogs, who are usually off leash around here. > > If you’re on trails you’re pretty darn safe. Hunters know enough not to hunt around hiking trails even though it is legal. Hikers scare off game and hiking trails generally take you up high quickly, which hunters are trying to avoid. > > Hikers are also often bushwackers and many destinations are not on trails. During hunting season most bushwackers take more precautions but aren’t going to stop their activities. Again, blaze orange and making more noise are pretty standard, plus choosing destination that avoid the most popular terrain for deer hunting. > > Lots of folks wander in the woods for a variety of reasons. Taking precautions are good, but if you avoided the woods during hunting season that’s a big chunk of time out of your schedule. Hunters can and should be held to a high standard for safety. Hikers should understand the risks and take appropriate precautions. But neither has exclusive use of the woods. I agree with this. I went hiking a lot and did orienteering in college and my 20’s. We used common sense so neither I nor anyone I know ever had trouble with hunters. It helps that the vast majority of hunters aren’t Elmer Fudd’s, too. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/57 "2014-12-10T16:02:46Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Lest DrDeth be worried about the safety of our dogs, [here’s a pic.](http://i681.photobucket.com/albums/vv174/kayaker01/20141005_181437_zps0212af78.jpg) I’m really concerned about your dogs in this picture. They really should be on a leash. You wouldn’t want them to impale themselves on those yellow sticks behind them. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/58 "2014-12-10T16:13:50Z")
> [@Drunky\_Smurf](#): > > I’m really concerned about your dogs in this picture. They really should be on a leash. You wouldn’t want them to impale themselves on those yellow sticks behind them. 😛 I had to look at the picture to see what you meant. Those are canine agility poles, used for “weaving”. [And in this picture you can see a blue “tunnel”, part of the agility course my gf works the dogs on.](http://i681.photobucket.com/albums/vv174/kayaker01/20141005_181355_zpsbdc256c3.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/59 "2014-12-10T16:14:24Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > (post shortened) > > You don’t come here for the hunting, do you? Why would you, a non-hunter, chose to wander around the woods during deer season? I deeply apologize. I thought “hiking” was a concept familiar to everyone, but, in the interests of fighting ignorance, allow me to tell you about “hiking.” Hiking is a pastime, a leisure activity, in which people go for walks in nature. Often they walk in the woods. Many people find this activity to be relaxing. People enjoy the smells of the woods. People enjoy the sights and sounds of the woods. They enjoy the mild-to extreme physical activity that comprises hiking. Many people in our country hike. People hike in spring. They hike in summer. They hike in autumn. They hike in winter. People hike with their families. They hike with their friends. They hike with their dogs. They hike alone. Please let me know if you have any other questions about “hiking”; I will be happy to fight your ignorance on this subject further. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2014, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762/60 "2014-12-10T16:45:01Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > …Lots of folks wander in the woods for a variety of reasons. Taking precautions are good, but if you avoided the woods during hunting season that’s a big chunk of time out of your schedule. Hunters can and should be held to a high standard for safety. Hikers should understand the risks and take appropriate precautions. But neither has exclusive use of the woods. (post shortened) Deer hunted northern Wisconsin and “the hills” of Illinois. (That’s a joke. Illinois ranges from 279 feet to 1,235 feet.) All states are different and Illinois likes to change it’s rules as often as possible. You really have to read the regs every year. Illinois does offer State owned public land for deer hunting. Some sites require that you display a parking tag and park in a designated parking area. At some sites, hunters have to sign in and out (for safety purposes. 6 hunters in - 6 hunters out.) Others have had state employees checking you in and out. And you need a valid hunting license plus blaze orange clothing. During hunting season, people without a valid hunting license are NOT permitted to wander about these sites. Both a safety issue and it prevents the anti-hunting, animal-rights zealots from harassing the hunters. And harassing hunters is illegal. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-a-fawn-any-good-reason/706762.md?page=4)