# Shooting at the center of mass (bin Laden related) **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 4, 2011, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685 "2011-05-04T13:20:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685/41 "2011-05-04T22:18:54Z")
Don’t Navy Seals use the ‘snipers triangle’ for targeting, in any case? That would include head shots, especially if his chest was obscured by others between the shooter and ObL. -XT ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2011, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685/42 "2011-05-04T22:20:37Z")
> [@](#): > > I thought most lethal gunshots were cause by the transfer of energy (I don’t know the technical term for this). Yes, and the transfer of energy makes holes in the body, which bleed. ---
**Author:** ![standingwave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9de0a6/32.png) [@standingwave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/standingwave)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685/43 "2011-05-06T17:19:42Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > Double tap to the head makes sure that they are dead. From the range they were shooting from, SEALs don’t miss. Besides, center of mass shots can be blocked by armor, which gives the Bad Guy time to do nefarious things. This. Body armor works! I am reminded of this account of the Bella Ambush as told in [Sebastian Junger’s ‘War.’](http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Books/war-sebastian-junger/story?id=10604181) > [@](#): > > I ask Kalenits when was the first moment he realized he was in an ambush, and he says it was when the helmet was shot off his head. Almost immediately he was _hit three times in the chest, twice in the back_, and then watched his best friend take a round through the forehead that emptied out the back of his head. Kalenits says that when he saw that he just “went into awe.” Head shots avoid the problem of concealed armor. Double taps help overcome the limitations of pistol rounds. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685/44 "2011-05-06T20:41:35Z")
close operation with a laser sight pretty much guarantees placement and if you can see a face then it doesn’t have armor over it. If you look at the pictures on the web the others were similarly shot. If you kick a door in and enter with bright lights there is the advantage of deer-in-headlights lack of movement. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685/45 "2011-05-06T20:57:35Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Yes, and the transfer of energy makes holes in the body, which bleed. Right. Remember, guns don’t kill people. Bullets kill people. ---
**Author:** ![JustinC](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justinc/32/8083_2.png) [@JustinC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JustinC)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2011, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685/46 "2011-05-06T23:48:06Z")
[A Veteran of SEAL Team Six Describes His Training](http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/features/2011/05/navy-seal-team-six-excerpt-201105?currentPage=all) is a fascinating insight into training to become a SEAL. On reading this I think OBL should’ve made his lair in an active volcano. ---
**Author:** ![Otara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a88e4f/32.png) [@Otara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otara)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685/47 "2011-05-07T00:43:59Z")
> **[Shooting of Jean Charles de Menezes](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Jean_Charles_de_Menezes)** > > Jean Charles da Silva e de Menezes (Brazilian Portuguese: \[ʒeˈɐ̃ ˈʃaʁliz dʒi meˈnezis\]; 7 January 1978 – 22 July 2005) was a Brazilian man killed by officers of the London Metropolitan Police Service at Stockwell station on the London Underground, after he was wrongly deemed to be one of the fugitives involved in the previous day's failed bombing attempts. These events took place two weeks after the London bombings of 7 July 2005, in which 52 people were killed. > The Independent Police Complaints... “It was revealed that police policy toward suspected suicide bombers had been revised, and that officers had been ordered to fire directly toward suspects’ heads, the theory according to British authorities being that shooting at the chest could conceivably detonate a concealed bomb.[17]” I suspect similar concerns may have been present here. Also of course a successful head shot gives less time to pull a detonator or whatnot. Otara ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685/48 "2011-05-07T02:19:55Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > I always aim for the dangling bits. 😉 > > Doesn’t kill, but sure gets their attention. And then you can get Medieval on their asses. ---
**Author:** ![Gukumatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/74df32/32.png) [@Gukumatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gukumatz)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685/49 "2011-05-07T02:23:00Z")
A (Norwegian) army officer was interviewed about it the day after the details started coming out, especially the apparent lack of interest in taking him alive as evinced by the head-shots. His only comment was that shots at center mass was still Standard Operating Procedure, but that this had in no way been a standard operation carried out by standard soliders. And it was more of a guide-line, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685/50 "2011-05-07T04:13:34Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > The “Shoot for the center of mass” rule applies to normal people like cops Not so much anymore. 29 years of law enforcement and over the last 4 years or so my firearms training has been almost entirely head shots for targets that are 4 yards away or less (the distance the majority of police shootings occur). This is standard training now, from the holster. And it’s one shot as most subjects drop after they’re hit in the melon. A Double tap could result in an unaccountable round going past the target. ---
**Author:** ![chacoguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/50afbb/32.png) [@chacoguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chacoguy)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2011, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685/51 "2011-05-07T04:47:15Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > Not so much anymore. 29 years of law enforcement and over the last 4 years or so my firearms training has been almost entirely head shots for targets that are 4 yards away or less (the distance the majority of police shootings occur). This is standard training now, from the holster. And it’s one shot as most subjects drop after they’re hit in the melon.\*\* A Double tap could result in an unaccountable round going past the target\*\*. Unless they’re motionless, on the ground. ---
**Author:** ![CapnPitt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/edb3f5/32.png) [@CapnPitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CapnPitt)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2011, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685/52 "2011-05-08T15:09:15Z")
Thanks everyone for the great replies. Very interesting to someone who know next to nothing about this stuff. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/shooting-at-the-center-of-mass-bin-laden-related/580685.md?page=2)