# Should a state or city have the right to secede from the USA? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 30, 2005, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-state-or-city-have-the-right-to-secede-from-the-usa/319335 "2005-08-30T22:15:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Kyle\_Rayner1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58f4c7/32.png) [@Kyle\_Rayner1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyle_Rayner1)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-state-or-city-have-the-right-to-secede-from-the-usa/319335/21 "2005-09-01T03:16:41Z")
**iamthewalrus(:3=** I see your point and I would be upset too but if the majority rules in a fair vote to secede than I don’t know what to say. How about the Loyalists who were loyal to the British and didn’t want the United states of America to become a country? The majority won. ---
**Author:** ![Bytegeist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9dc877/32.png) [@Bytegeist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bytegeist)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2005, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-state-or-city-have-the-right-to-secede-from-the-usa/319335/22 "2005-09-01T15:11:50Z")
> [@Kyle Rayner1](#): > > … but if the majority rules in a fair vote to secede than I don’t know what to say. How about the Loyalists who were loyal to the British and didn’t want the United states of America to become a country? The majority won. Of course _there was no vote_ in that case. There was no procedure available for leaving the British empire, a procedure the Rebels could have “won” by being numerous enough. Independence was won through war — an _extra-legal_ procedure (to put it lightly). In fact the rebels weren’t even in the majority anyway. At the time of the American Revolution, it was estimated that the colonists were roughly split evenly among Loyalists, rebels, and the indifferent. If the Brits had allowed a referendum on the question of independence, those in favor of it might very well have lost. Not that there was the remotest chance of a referendum being called on any issue in 1776, here or anywhere. ---
**Author:** ![Kyle\_Rayner1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58f4c7/32.png) [@Kyle\_Rayner1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyle_Rayner1)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-state-or-city-have-the-right-to-secede-from-the-usa/319335/23 "2005-09-02T04:34:27Z")
I see your point but if like you said it was evenly divided and the loyalists and the indifferent out-weighted the rebels. Did the US have the right to secede in 1776 and if yes why would it be wrong for another state or city to secede? I know they won through war but shouldn’t the majority rule every time? I mean, wasn’ it hypocritcal of the US to hold elections at that time where the majority wanted to be a part of the British empire? ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-state-or-city-have-the-right-to-secede-from-the-usa/319335/24 "2005-09-02T06:16:03Z")
> [@Kyle Rayner1](#): > > I see your point but if like you said it was evenly divided and the loyalists and the indifferent out-weighted the rebels. > > Did the US have the right to secede in 1776 and if yes why would it be wrong for another state or city to secede? > > I know they won through war but shouldn’t the majority rule every time? I mean, wasn’ it hypocritcal of the US to hold elections at that time where the majority wanted to be a part of the British empire? Not only that, there were 13 states in the US under the Articles of Confederation. Nine of those states seceded and formed a new United States under the Constitution. What would have happened if the any of the other 4 states did not ratified the Constitution? A very real possibility since Rhode Island refused to sign it without a Bill of Rights. ---
**Author:** ![Kyle\_Rayner1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58f4c7/32.png) [@Kyle\_Rayner1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyle_Rayner1)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2005, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-state-or-city-have-the-right-to-secede-from-the-usa/319335/25 "2005-09-02T06:32:34Z")
Yeah, true good points **Saint Cad** and thanks for weighing in on the debate. I think it is kind of hypocritical that the US would pull a hissy fit if a state or city seceded. Even with a vote, even though, when the US first formed no vote was involved. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-state-or-city-have-the-right-to-secede-from-the-usa/319335.md?page=1)