# Should a white person be ashamed for being white? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 28, 2020, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634 "2020-05-28T23:07:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Yankees\_1996\_Champs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Yankees\_1996\_Champs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yankees_1996_Champs)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2020, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/1 "2020-05-28T23:07:19Z")
The resurgence of police chokeholds and racism under Trump has made some people feel that white people should be ashamed of being white. What do you think? ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2020, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/2 "2020-05-28T23:08:27Z")
I think your statement is false. ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2020, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/3 "2020-05-28T23:14:06Z")
Is a strawman is afraid of being a strawman? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2020, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/4 "2020-05-28T23:20:33Z")
I agree with **bobot**. I haven’t seen anybody arguing that the mere fact of being racially identified as white is anything for anybody to be ashamed of. Here are some things that I think **are** being called out as shameful in the current controversies: - White people complacently ignoring the fact of their racial privilege and getting offended if anybody points out their racially-privileged status. - White people assuming that if a white person doesn’t explicitly endorse racially discriminatory beliefs, then there’s no way that white person can “be racist”. - White people reflexively blaming the impacts of anti-black racism on the alleged intransigence or folly of black people themselves. - White people reacting to widespread outrage about egregious racist injustice by diverting the conversation to whether white people are being unfairly harmed or blamed by said outrage. (See, e.g., the topic of this thread.) ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2020, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/5 "2020-05-28T23:30:25Z")
> [@Yankees\_1996\_Champs](#): > > The resurgence of police chokeholds and racism under Trump has made **some people** feel that white people should be ashamed of being white. Which people? > [@](#): > > What do you think? I think it’s stupid and pointless. ---
**Author:** ![Unreconstructed\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/76d3ee/32.png) [@Unreconstructed\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unreconstructed_Man)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2020, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/6 "2020-05-28T23:30:39Z")
> [@Yankees\_1996\_Champs](#): > > The resurgence of police chokeholds and racism under Trump has made some people feel that white people should be ashamed of being white. > > What do you think? No. I’ve seen lots of people online (some here) say they’re ashamed of being white, but they’re just losers who are trying to make this all about them. It’s pretty sad. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2020, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/7 "2020-05-28T23:37:08Z")
> [@Yankees\_1996\_Champs](#): > > The resurgence of police chokeholds and racism under Trump has made some people feel that white people should be ashamed of being white. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![Yankees\_1996\_Champs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Yankees\_1996\_Champs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yankees_1996_Champs)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2020, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/8 "2020-05-28T23:37:52Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Cite? A lot of people on Twitter, social media, etc. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2020, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/9 "2020-05-28T23:51:01Z")
I’ll respond further, maybe, when this thread finds its way to the appropriate forum. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2020, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/10 "2020-05-28T23:58:00Z")
\*\* Should a white person be ashamed for being white?\*\* Only if they’re also a Yankees fan. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2020, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/11 "2020-05-29T00:07:25Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Cite? > [@Yankees\_1996\_Champs](#): > > A lot of people on Twitter, social media, etc. That’s not how cites work here. “A lot of people on Twitter” is not a cite. You need to link to specific examples to back up your assertion. Otherwise, it’s not a debate. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2020, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/12 "2020-05-29T00:09:46Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > \*\* Should a white person be ashamed for being white?\*\* > > Only if they’re also a Yankees fan. 🙂 This is a very discriminatory and unfair statement. Non-white Yankees fans should also be ashamed. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2020, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/13 "2020-05-29T00:26:42Z")
Nope, nobody should be ashamed of skin color. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2020, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/14 "2020-05-29T00:32:19Z")
> [@Yankees\_1996\_Champs](#): > > The resurgence of police chokeholds and racism under Trump has made some people feel that white people should be ashamed of being white. > > What do you think? “Some people are saying”…what exactly? ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2020, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/15 "2020-05-29T01:02:03Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > I agree with **bobot**. I haven’t seen anybody arguing that the mere fact of being racially identified as white is anything for anybody to be ashamed of. You’re right that you won’t typically see anyone argue that. But depending on what areas of the net you frequent, you may see individuals posting disclaimers revealing their whiteness almost apologetically when they participate certain topics of discussion. You may also see people sometimes say something makes them ashamed to be white. ---
**Author:** ![Unreconstructed\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/76d3ee/32.png) [@Unreconstructed\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unreconstructed_Man)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2020, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/16 "2020-05-29T01:03:47Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > You’re right that you won’t typically see anyone argue that. But depending on what areas of the net you frequent, you may see individuals posting disclaimers revealing their whiteness almost apologetically when they participate certain topics of discussion. You may also see people sometimes say something makes them ashamed to be white. Just search “Ashamed to be white” on Twitter. You’ll get, like, a million results. It ain’t rare. ---
**Author:** ![Chingon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chingon/32/17645_2.png) [@Chingon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chingon)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2020, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/17 "2020-05-29T01:23:29Z")
I don’t think so, but what a provocative question! Is provocative the right word? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2020, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/18 "2020-05-29T01:25:37Z")
> [@Odesio](#): > > But depending on what areas of the net you frequent, you may see individuals posting disclaimers revealing their whiteness almost apologetically when they participate certain topics of discussion. You may also see people sometimes say something makes them ashamed to be white. Sure, but what I said is that “I haven’t seen anybody arguing that the mere fact of being racially identified as white is anything for anybody to be ashamed of”. ISTM that when people colloquially use the phrase “ashamed to be white”, it means something quite different. Namely, that they’re ashamed of the racism and bigotry that has been so pervasive in traditionally white-supremacist culture, and ashamed that they’re still the beneficiaries of societal privilege based on that racism and bigotry, and ashamed of the continued failure of white people in general to effectually stamp out that racism and bigotry. That’s not at all the same thing as being simply “ashamed of skin color”, as **Velocity** put it. ---
**Author:** ![Unreconstructed\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/76d3ee/32.png) [@Unreconstructed\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unreconstructed_Man)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2020, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/19 "2020-05-29T01:34:17Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > ISTM that when people colloquially use the phrase “ashamed to be white”, it means something quite different. Namely, that they’re ashamed of the racism and bigotry that has been so pervasive in traditionally white-supremacist culture, and ashamed that they’re still the beneficiaries of societal privilege based on that racism and bigotry, and ashamed of the continued failure of white people in general to effectually stamp out that racism and bigotry. > > That’s not at all the same thing as being simply “ashamed of skin color”, as **Velocity** put it. I imagine this’d be a difficult interpretation to evidence. ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2020, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634/20 "2020-05-29T01:38:17Z")
> [@Yankees\_1996\_Champs](#): > > The resurgence of police chokeholds and racism under Trump has made some people feel that white people should be ashamed of being white. > > What do you think? What do YOU think? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-a-white-person-be-ashamed-for-being-white/854634.md?page=2)