# Should altering classified docs & then leak to Press to stir up scandal hysteria be a crime? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 17, 2013, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605 "2013-05-17T16:07:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/1 "2013-05-17T16:07:54Z")
Is it not a crime for House Members to take requested classified materials from the White House for use in a so-called scandal investigation, and then alter those documents and then leak the contents to the Press with the intent to mislead the public about the scandal they are supposed to be seriously investigating? Republicans appear to have committed this crime on Benghazi but is it simply an act of political dishonesty with no criminal lisbilty for the perpetrators. I believe since it does involve leaking classified information in the first place, the fact that the docs were altered should rise to some level of criminality. This kind of lying is the real scandal. > [@](#): > > One day after The White House released 100 pages of Benghazi emails, a report has surfaced alleging that Republicans released a set with altered text. > CBS News reported Thursday that leaked versions sent out by the GOP last Friday had visible differences than Wednesday’s official batch. Two correspondences that were singled out in the report came from National Security Adviser Ben Rhodes and State Department Spokeswoman Victoria Nuland. > > Republicans Altered Benghazi Emails, CBS News Report Claims > The Huffington Post > > [HuffPost - Breaking News, U.S. and World News | HuffPost](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mobileweb/2013/05/16/republicans-benghazi-emails_n_3289428.html?icid=hp_front_top_art) ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/2 "2013-05-17T16:15:31Z")
It’s about as dishonest as it gets and the press should respond loudly and harshly to discourage anybody else from pulling this kind of stunt, but I have trouble picturing what kind of crime it should be. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/3 "2013-05-17T16:18:25Z")
It should show, yet again, that the GOP cannot be trusted. It still baffles me that people listen to them, trust them, and think Obama’s bad. I find it a nice rule in life to believe the exact opposite of what the GOP believes. They think Obama’s the worst president ever? I have him up there near Lincoln. They think he’s a liar? I call him the most honest president we’ve ever had. They say he’s a foreigner? I believe he created baseball and apple pie and designed the American flag. That kind of opposite hyperbole is a lot closer to the truth than anything the GOP or its partisan groups spit out ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/4 "2013-05-17T17:20:02Z")
No, it should not. I find it unlikely that the government would be forced to meet a reasonable standard of evidence to prove that their version of the classified document is the original and not a forgery, which makes it a perfect weapon to persecute whistleblowers - not only can you charge them with a crime, you can do so while ruling that they didn’t actually reveal anything untoward. ---
**Author:** ![BlankSlate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/blankslate/32/80_2.png) [@BlankSlate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlankSlate)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/5 "2013-05-17T20:50:45Z")
Since the House is determined to permanently avoid doing anything useful, why not have some Benghazi Hearings Benghazi Hearings. Of course, the ruling party will determine there was no wrongdoing, but that will give them something to do while they dream up a new phony “scandal”. ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/6 "2013-05-17T21:12:13Z")
The thing that is puzzling me is why they would do this? The changes that they made weren’t monumental, and they couldn’t really use their version of the e-mails effectively since I soon as they make a big deal about them, someone would notice the difference and they would get caught. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2013, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/7 "2013-05-17T21:49:45Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > The thing that is puzzling me is why they would do this? > > The changes that they made weren’t monumental, and they couldn’t really use their version of the e-mails effectively since I soon as they make a big deal about them, someone would notice the difference and they would get caught. Its obvious. They want to get some mileage out of the “scandal” by faking emails, knowing that the first reports will contain all of the emotional anger by tying Obama to Benghazi and that subsequent reports denying it will be met by their most ardent supporters as the cover-up, or flat out ignored because people will hear the outrage but not the ultimate explanation and resolution If you are the GOP, you don’t have to be right. You can lie about it, create a scandal, knowing that your supporters are so dumb they won’t look past the initial anger and accusations. Nobody watching FOX News is going to look at NBC or CNN later and recognize that the GOP doctored the emails. Instead, they’ll stash it in the back of their heads that there’s yet another thing Obama was covering up ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/8 "2013-05-18T01:01:20Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > The thing that is puzzling me is why they would do this? > > The changes that they made weren’t monumental, and they couldn’t really use their version of the e-mails effectively since I soon as they make a big deal about them, someone would notice the difference and they would get caught. The changes made were monumental in that they were leaked to ABC and CBS because leaking them to Fox News would not have created the huge sensation that Jon Karl of ABC’s report produced last week. Return your thoughts to last Wednesday when the big Republican Benghazi blockbuster House hearings were a big flop. And then Jon Karl revved the nut jobs all up once again. Now the die hards just claim they need more emails and will never stop the gum-flapping that there is a scandal in Benghazi somewhere and there should be no quit until the cover up is defeated and we no that Obama and Hillary are proven to be evil. You must remember that this Republican controlled House need not prove a scandal exists to achieve what they want. Scandal-mongering is a business decision in my view for the right. They need to keep that 33% sending money to right wing causes without ever really delivering any right winger policies. Getting Obama is enough to keep Rush and Fox and the Heritage Foundation going. > [@](#): > > Heritage Foundation to GOP: "Don’t Legislate, Focus On Scandals … > [answers.yahoo.com](http://answers.yahoo.com) › … › Politics > 2 hours ago – Heritage Action, the political activist offshoot o… … Not a member? … Speaker John Boehner and Majority Leader Eric Cantor: focus on … DNC advice: Keep robbin’ 'em blind, tell them anything! > > [Conservative Advice To GOP: Don't Legislate, Focus On Scandals : It's All Politics : NPR](http://www.npr.org/blogs/itsallpolitics/2013/05/17/184824660/advice-to-gop-dont-legislate-focus-on-scandals?ft=1&f=1003) ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/9 "2013-05-18T01:06:58Z")
Rachel Maddow is ripping ABC a new one right now. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/10 "2013-05-18T01:17:14Z")
Rachel is explaining to her fellow journalist that if they know who the source is that made up the lie about what the Benghazi talking point emails actually said and then fed their lies to you as a journalist, such as Jon Karl, then that source is no longer a source - that person is a con artist and you no longer are required to protect that source, If you got those emails that are fake then you know who gave them to you. Give the liar up. That would be punishment enough for me. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/11 "2013-05-18T01:31:26Z")
A huge stupid mistake by the Republicans. Just when the Obama administration is facing some actual scandals, the Republicans pull a stunt like this and put themselves back in hot seat. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/12 "2013-05-18T13:51:44Z")
I’m just hazarding a guess here, but that guess would be that the perps here thought Obama would never, ever, ever actually release the e-mails. They probably figured they were right about their accusations, and the real e-mails would prove that, so they were not risking anything, because if Obama did release them, it would prove them right. So he wouldn’t. And then he did. So, the problem boils down to believing their own bullshit, and relying upon it. Oopsy! ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/13 "2013-05-18T14:18:26Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > I’m just hazarding a guess here, but that guess would be that the perps here thought Obama would never, ever, ever actually release the e-mails. They probably figured they were right about their accusations, and the real e-mails would prove that, so they were not risking anything, because if Obama did release them, it would prove them right. So he wouldn’t. And then he did. > > So, the problem boils down to believing their own bullshit, and relying upon it. Oopsy! However the edited changes by Republicans who passed those changes to the Press were changes that twisted the facts to focus on the State Department and that is exactly where the wanted the Benghazi Scandal to go - AFTER HILLARY. It was reported that Congressional staffers could take notes but not copy the emails, so I would be interested in knowing if the ‘drafts of the notes’ were changed just prior to passing them off to Jon Karl and other members of the news media. If original notes were accurate but then realizing that that Wednesday Benghazi hearings were a flop, since they thought only Fox News was reporting on it, then they came up with some hastily revised drafts that Jon Karl screamed the headline that the WH ‘scrubbed the emails’ from Jon Karl’s big new find. Actual quotes from the emails. Don’t you think we deserve to know if that kind of nefarious activity took place? The timing of this does not solidify that this was an “ooooops” moment. Big things are at stake here including Republicans holding onto the House in 2014 and winning the WH in 2016 and the Senate. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/14 "2013-05-18T14:35:08Z")
Is this actually being reported anywhere, cause i haven’t seen it. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/15 "2013-05-18T17:37:10Z")
[http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18563\_162-57584947/wh-benghazi-emails-have-different-quotes-than-earlier-reported/](http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18563_162-57584947/wh-benghazi-emails-have-different-quotes-than-earlier-reported/) > [@](#): > > Republicans also provided what they said was a quote from an email written by State Department spokesman Victoria Nuland. > > The Republican version quotes Nuland discussing, “The penultimate point is a paragraph talking about all the previous warnings provided by the Agency (CIA) about al-Qaeda’s presence and activities of al-Qaeda.” > > The actual email from Nuland says: “The penultimate point could be abused by members to beat the State Department for not paying attention to Agency warnings.” > > The CIA agreed with the concerns raised by the State Department and revised the talking points to make them less specific than the CIA’s original version, eliminating references to al Qaeda and affiliates and earlier security warnings. There is no evidence that the White House orchestrated the changes. > **[When ABC News Claimed It Had "Obtained" The Benghazi Emails](https://www.mediamatters.org/abc/when-abc-news-claimed-it-had-obtained-benghazi-emails)** > [@](#): > > ABC News is now claiming that its Benghazi “exclusive” was based on summaries of emails between administration aides, not the emails themselves – an assertion belied by their earlier reports. > > CNN’s Jake Tapper reported on May 14 that he had obtained an email sent by White House aide Ben Rhodes that “differs from how sources inaccurately quoted and paraphrased it in previous accounts to different media organizations,” including ABC’s Karl. According to Tapper, previous accounts of the email made it “appear that the White House was ‘more interested in the State Department’s desire to remove mentions of specific terrorist groups and warnings about these groups so as to not bring criticism to the State Department than Rhodes’ email actually stated.'” > > The conservative media has spent months obsessing over the Benghazi talking points that administration officials were discussing in those emails. According to right-wing conspiracy, the administration edited the talking points to downplay the role of terrorism in the attack in order to benefit the Obama reelection campaign. In fact, as then-CIA director David Petraeus noted, the talking points were changed to avoid interfering with the ongoing investigation into the perpetrators – an account bolstered by the full version of the Rhodes email. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/16 "2013-05-18T18:35:44Z")
Well, Benghazigategate ought to be fun. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/17 "2013-05-18T21:30:09Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Well, Benghazigategate ought to be fun. Benghazigategate began before the four dead Americans body’s were cold. Romney opened mouth and inserted his Testoni clad foot right in it. > [@](#): > > I’m outraged by the attacks on American diplomatic missions in Libya and Egypt and by the death of an American consulate worker in Benghazi. It’s disgraceful that the Obama Administration’s first response was not to condemn attacks on our diplomatic missions, \*\*but to sympathize with those who waged the attacks. \*\* Sympathizing with those who attack US Soil would be tantamount to treason. Romney really showed how much he sucked when he and RNC Chairman Priebus came out swinging with that crap. But Romney is a loser so the scandal went away on it’s own. But we should not forget what the top Republican at the time said. ---
**Author:** ![Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/7ba0ec/32.png) [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omg_a_Black_Conservative)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/18 "2013-05-18T22:05:24Z")
Because that’s what he did, and then proceeded to label it as a protest against an anti-Muslim video. [Better late than never, I suppose.](http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/post/obamas-claim-he-called-benghazi-an-act-of-terrorism/2013/05/13/7b65b83e-bc14-11e2-97d4-a479289a31f9_blog.html) ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2013, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/19 "2013-05-18T22:15:45Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > Because that’s what he did, and then proceeded to label it as a protest against an anti-Muslim video. > > [Better late than never, I suppose.](http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/post/obamas-claim-he-called-benghazi-an-act-of-terrorism/2013/05/13/7b65b83e-bc14-11e2-97d4-a479289a31f9_blog.html) Can you show me where Obama showed sympathy for the alleged terrorists? ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2013, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605/20 "2013-05-19T00:06:56Z")
> [@Omg\_a\_Black\_Conservative](#): > > Because that’s what he did, and then proceeded to label it as a protest against an anti-Muslim video. > > [Better late than never, I suppose.](http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/post/obamas-claim-he-called-benghazi-an-act-of-terrorism/2013/05/13/7b65b83e-bc14-11e2-97d4-a479289a31f9_blog.html) What is what he did? My God, you post a link to the Washington Post giving Obama four Pinocchio’s for saying “Act of Terror” three times immediately following the attack and then claiming to have called it an “Act of Terror **ism** ” right after the attack. And apparently our President who has plenty of work related things to do while running for re-election against a man who no longer had a job, did not include “ism” on the word “terror” three times immediately following the attack. And that deliberate, conniving, artfully dodgy language was supposed to mislead enough voters to conclude that al Qaeda was truly defeated after he got Osama Bin Laden and that the attack at Benghazi was just a group of ticked off Muslims mad about the video just like up in Cairo and other embassies around the world. And the purpose of this lie was to keep the American people from finding out that killing Osama Bin Laden was not enough to prevent al Qaeda from launching an attack and that would mean voters should conclude that Mitt Romney should become President. Is that about right, or what is it you are trying to tell us? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-altering-classified-docs-then-leak-to-press-to-stir-up-scandal-hysteria-be-a-crime/658605.md?page=2)