# Should Antifa violence be condemned? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 20, 2018, 5:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902 "2018-08-20T05:14:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 12
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2018, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/221 "2018-08-22T19:11:01Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Well, the Oregonian said that one guy is Antifa, so it must be a real group. Are you also advancing the point of view that antifa doesn’t exist? ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2018, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/222 "2018-08-22T19:15:50Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Are you also advancing the point of view that antifa doesn’t exist? No, I’m advancing the point of view that not every guy with a mask assaulting another guy is antifa. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2018, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/223 "2018-08-22T19:20:21Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > I did not say that he “_might be_”, I said that he “_might **as well** be_”. The difference between those two things is not very subtle. What I am saying is that if you nuzzle assholes, expect to be treated like an asshole, even if that is not what you literally are. > > Once more, Stiles was consorting with the nazi side: that makes him decidedly non-random. And the other five victims? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2018, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/224 "2018-08-22T19:22:51Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Because the American Flag is. Glorious Sacred Symbol of everything that is Good and Right and Proper, and it and anyone bearing it should always be treated with deference and respect. > > . :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: But certainly it is not a symbol of Naziism. It flies over every govt building, in every schoolroom, over many homes and businesses. Attacking someone for waving the flag is a mark of just plain violent stupidity. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2018, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/225 "2018-08-22T19:25:47Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > Sorry, I don’t consider punching white supremacists or Nazis to be morally repugnant, so that argument won’t work on me. Yeah, let’s not pretend that the Antifa goal is punching Nazis, since so far they have done it _exactly once._ They have also burned a car once. So, it would seem burning cars is just as much a cornerstone as punching nazis. Oh, they vandalized and damaged dozens of businesses, so that would appear to be their primary goal. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2018, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/226 "2018-08-22T19:27:15Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Yeah, let’s not pretend that the Antifa goal is punching Nazis, since so far they have done it _exactly once._ They have also burned a car once. So, it would seem burning cars is just as much a cornerstone as punching nazis. Oh, they vandalized and damaged dozens of businesses, so that would appear to be their primary goal. I don’t pretend that. I don’t condone burning cars or damaging businesses. That’s why I didn’t say “I condone that!” ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2018, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/227 "2018-08-22T19:28:54Z")
> [@Slash1972](#): > > I would hope that the viewpoint of mainstream America would be “White Supremacists and Nazis deserved to be punched every single time they appear in a place where punching can be done” And who to do that? Not Antifa, since they mostly break windows of businesses and hit guys with metal rods. Lets get over this idea that Antifa is in the business of punching nazis, since they _don’t do that_. They break windows. Burn cars. Turn peaceful demonstrations into violent riots. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2018, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/228 "2018-08-22T19:30:35Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > And who to do that? Not Antifa, since they mostly break windows of businesses and hit guys with metal rods. > > Lets get over this idea that Antifa is in the business of punching nazis, since they _don’t do that_. They break windows. Burn cars. Turn peaceful demonstrations into violent riots. Well, they should start spending more time punching nazis and white supremacists and less time burning cars. Next time I attend an Antifa meeting, I’ll try to get that on the agenda. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2018, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/229 "2018-08-22T19:59:55Z")
I haven’t been getting notices since they purged the DFH from their ranks. I don’t know who the other guy was. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/230 "2018-08-23T00:46:40Z")
I’m sad to see the way ‘fascist’ is being used again as a generic insult for neo-nazis and the far right. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/231 "2018-08-23T01:35:32Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > I’m sad to see the way ‘fascist’ is being used again as a generic insult for neo-nazis and the far right. Was it being used in some other way recently? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/232 "2018-08-23T01:58:44Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > I’m sad to see the way ‘fascist’ is being used again as a generic insult for neo-nazis and the far right. Neo nazis- sure. They are fascists. But just the alt-right bunch of idiots? They aren’t fascists, just idiots. ---
**Author:** ![TimeWinder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@TimeWinder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TimeWinder)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/233 "2018-08-23T02:14:45Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > No actual numbers? I guess the violent antifa fighting the violent Nazis is all make believe? Where is this happening? In what numbers? I’m not claiming that nobody who calls themselves “antifa” is out there performing violent acts. I am claiming that there exists no such organized group, and that the “members” of the non-group number no more than a handful at any given moment, and have been declining rather than increasing. I am also claiming–explicitly–that “Antifa” is exactly equivalent to the other groups I mentioned (substituting ‘sleeper cell’ for ‘splinter cell,’ of course): a tiny number of people that the Right has imaginated into a huge threat for the purpose of making their followers afraid, angry, and unwilling to examine their own crimes. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/234 "2018-08-23T12:44:57Z")
Just _imaginated_? I suspect \*infiltrated \*among the anti-fascism demonstrators, for the purpose of distraction and delegitimization, might be more accurate. They won’t show their faces. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/235 "2018-08-23T14:29:04Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > No actual numbers? I guess the violent antifa fighting the violent Nazis is all make believe? It’s not make believe, it’s just irrelevantly small. If you have some numbers to suggest that the scope of antifa violence isn’t irrelevantly small, let’s have 'em. I warn you, I’m prepared to take what you come up with as antifa’s violence record and compare it to violence perpetrated by toddlers, so you better have more than a few beatings to talk about, because toddlers are nasty little buggers. ---
**Author:** ![Slash1972](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slash1972/32/6461_2.png) [@Slash1972](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slash1972)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/236 "2018-08-23T14:45:42Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > I warn you, I’m prepared to take what you come up with as antifa’s violence record and compare it to violence perpetrated by toddlers, so you better have more than a few beatings to talk about, because toddlers are nasty little buggers. It’s more shocking to compare it to violence perpetrated by law enforcement. But the toddler comparison is definitely funnier. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/237 "2018-08-23T15:26:42Z")
Do you happen to know how violence by fascists in America stacks up against toddlers? ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/238 "2018-08-23T15:40:55Z")
Toddlers with guns can be pretty brutal. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/239 "2018-08-23T16:15:13Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Do you happen to know how violence by fascists in America stacks up against toddlers? If you want to ask whether or not Fascist violence should be condemned, start your own thread. This is about the “scourge” of Antifa violence. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [August 23, 2018, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902/240 "2018-08-23T16:22:59Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > If you want to ask whether or not Fascist violence should be condemned, start your own thread. This is about the “scourge” of Antifa violence. _shrug_ it was just a question. You sounded like someone who understood and was concerned with the relative rates of incidents of violence. I thought you might know that one too, off the top of your head. If you don’t, or do and don’t want to say, that’s fine. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902.md?page=11) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-antifa-violence-be-condemned/819902.md?page=13)