# Should Barbaric Practices Be Stopped **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [September 6, 2010, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837 "2010-09-06T21:24:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/21 "2010-09-07T06:03:10Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > > [@Broomstick](#): > > > > Uh… cite? Which tribes? I want names. > > > > Also, some types of ritual cannibalism, such as the funeral cannibalism of the Fore tribe, don’t involve killing someone, they involve eating someone already dead. Which, to my mind, is different than killing someone for dinner. > > And IIRC, the worst situation there was the disease “kuru”, wasn’t it? Sort of a human version of “mad-cow”. It WAS mad cow disease, IIRC. No “sort of” to it. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/22 "2010-09-07T12:10:54Z")
It was a prion disease like mad cow, but it was not the mad cow prion it was the kuru prion. Sort of like the difference between measles and chicken pox - both viruses, both give you spotty rashes, but not the same disease. ---
**Author:** ![Dunkelheit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dunkelheit/32/248_2.png) [@Dunkelheit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dunkelheit)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/23 "2010-09-07T12:51:53Z")
> [@matt\_mcl](#): > > I would much prefer to spend my time stopping barbaric practices that my very own civilization is doing. I would like to second that proposal. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/24 "2010-09-07T13:16:16Z")
Should we educate people like the stone age New Guinea tribes? They cannot live a western lifestyle, and if we were to impose our values on them, they would probably wind up as wards of the state. Maybe it is best to leave them alone. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/25 "2010-09-07T13:17:53Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > > [@Guinastasia](#): > > > > And IIRC, the worst situation there was the disease “kuru”, wasn’t it? Sort of a human version of “mad-cow”. > > It WAS mad cow disease, IIRC. No “sort of” to it. You R incorrectly. Kuru is a spongiform encephalopathy like BSE and CJD, but not the same disease. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/26 "2010-09-07T13:31:10Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > Should we educate people like the stone age New Guinea tribes? Of course. Our own ancestors started out in the Stone Age like everyone else. > [@ralph124c](#): > > Maybe it is best to leave them alone. How? Are we to stick them in a preserve and shoot anyone trying to get in or out? Even if all you mean by that is “do nothing”, that just ultimately means they’ll eventually get run over by whomever comes along that doesn’t feel like doing so. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/27 "2010-09-07T14:05:50Z")
Well, these people live in an environment that cannot support a large population. If we extend them medical care, their population will skyrocket-then you will have poverty and disease. So, we educate them and raise their expectations-where will they find jobs to pay for clothing, housing, TVs, coca cola, etc. They would wind up living in slums on the fringes of whatever minimg town are in New Guinea. They cannot live a western lifestyle because their environment cannot support it-is it a kindness to them to try to make them like us? ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/28 "2010-09-07T14:21:43Z")
> [@Fried Dough Ho\[/quote](#): > > Who are we to define what is barbaric for another culture and then impose our values on them? Just because the ruling classes of a culture find certain practices acceptable, it doesn’t mean that it’s right. Do you think that women in some cultures think it’s a good idea for women to be stoned to death for “adultery” even if it was rape? Some “culturally acceptable traditions” are actually culturally forced on people. In any case, yes, barbaric practices need to stop. They need to stop here at home and they need to stop abroad. > [@Superfluous Parentheses](#): > > Just to clarify, I think moral relativism is a concept that is useful to a point, but personally, I draw the line somewhere before personal harm. Exactly. There is also big difference between a _voluntary_ practice that our culture feels is barbaric and one in which great harm is being done to a person who would really prefer that it not. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/29 "2010-09-07T14:23:59Z")
As a purely practical matter, it’s all but impossible to actually stop practices in other cultures which are evil (and I don’t have a problem with labeling some cultural practices as “evil” period. I’m no moral relativist). Female genital mutilation, the depraved treatment of women in some Arab countries, honor killings, culturally sanctioned pedophilia and rape. These are all worse things than cannibalism _per se_ (which is only really evil if the entree is murdered first), but it would not be within the realm of any reasonable possibility to forcibly put a stop to any of it. ---
**Author:** ![Peeta\_Mellark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/bc8723/32.png) [@Peeta\_Mellark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peeta_Mellark)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/30 "2010-09-07T14:25:31Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > Well, these people live in an environment that cannot support a large population. What about their environment is so unique compared to all of the other places on the planet that have been developed? It’s bigger than New Zealand, so it’s certainly not size. The climate? No, because places with similar climates have been developed. Are there growing pains and difficulties in developing nations? Obviously, and they’re often tragic. That doesn’t mean we should pretend this is Star Trek and we’re using some Prime Directive to keep them in pristine ignorance. Far worse than “raising expectations their environment can’t support” would be the fact that as the traditional societies adopt new practices all of the amazing biodiversity in the region will be at risk. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/31 "2010-09-07T14:26:39Z")
> [@Fried\_Dough\_Ho](#): > > Who are we to define what is barbaric for another culture and then impose our values on them? Who were we to decide that antisemitic genocide was wrong and impose our values on the Nazis? ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/32 "2010-09-07T14:42:34Z")
I’ll start from the position of ‘live and let live’, but from an individual basis, not societal. Do whatever you want as long as it doesn’t harm another person. I’ll add that ‘harm’ doesn’t include “I don’t like what I’m seeing over there.” So you can wear a burqa, and I can walk down the street in sandals and a sunhat. We each have the right to dislike what we see, but we don’t have the right to stop it. And if you have a problem with the ‘temptation’ of the appearance of others, that’s your problem, not theirs. You don’t get to paw them on the train and them blame it upon their outfit. And, consenting adults can marry whoever they want, even if I find it icky. Hence, [the anti-gay efforts in Uganda and their US supporters](http://www.democracynow.org/2010/3/25/international_uproar_over_uganda_anti_gay) would be opposed. As would be bans on polygamy. And even incest, though I find that icky. It’s not my life. Also, this implies support for restrictions on pollution. Why? Because you can do whatever you want, as long as it doesn’t harm me. Dumping smoke into my air or toxins into my water is harming me, and I do not give you permission to do it. (Obviously we’d have to find what the minimum levels of substances are that cause harm.) Speaking of substances that cause harm… consider recreational drugs. I would legalise these, but make people resonsible for their actions under them as if they were cold sober. Kill someone while drunk? Sorry, you just committed premeditated murder. Likewhise while stoned or on crack. And smoke all you want, but don’t let me smell it. So: I oppose the War on Drugs. Support separated smoking areas. Do not require employees to enter smoky areas. And yes, genocide is wrong So is rape. And punishing the victim is doubly wrong. Yes, I oppose barbaric practices. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/33 "2010-09-07T14:51:42Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > Should we educate people like the stone age New Guinea tribes? They cannot live a western lifestyle, and if we were to impose our values on them, they would probably wind up as wards of the state. Surely they could find employment acting in commercials for GEICO? ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/34 "2010-09-07T15:00:19Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > Well, these people live in an environment that cannot support a large population. While New Guinea _as a whole_ has low population density, the highlands are a different story: > [@](#): > > The gardens of the New Guinea Highlands are ancient, intensive permacultures, adapted to high population densities [Wikipedia page](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Guinea) IIRC, when airplanes overflew the spine of New Guinea fairly late in the history of exploration (the 1930s, maybe?) they were surprised to see the large, dense populations the area supported. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/35 "2010-09-07T15:37:39Z")
First of all we must keep the civilization we got. That means protecting it from enemies inside and out. Once we do that, we can try to spread it by our good example to others. We ought not to force ourselves on others without lots of thought. But if we are forced by events to impose our will on others, we ought not to be ashamed to do the job right. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/36 "2010-09-07T18:20:50Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > > [@Guinastasia](#): > > > > And IIRC, the worst situation there was the disease “kuru”, wasn’t it? Sort of a human version of “mad-cow”. > > It WAS mad cow disease, IIRC. No “sort of” to it. No, it was mad HUMAN disease. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/37 "2010-09-08T00:01:53Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > Well, these people live in an environment that cannot support a large population. If we extend them medical care, their population will skyrocket-then you will have poverty and disease. So, we educate them and raise their expectations-where will they find jobs to pay for clothing, housing, TVs, coca cola, etc. > They would wind up living in slums on the fringes of whatever minimg town are in New Guinea. > They cannot live a western lifestyle because their environment cannot support it-is it a kindness to them to try to make them like us? The first generation probably won’t adapt so well but the later generations will doubtlessly do better than being bushmen in the jungle. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/38 "2010-09-08T00:03:56Z")
Wow. Racist much? ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/39 "2010-09-08T00:06:18Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Wow. Racist much? No. I never said about New Guineans being naturally inferior which would be racist-merely that civilized life will be more fruitful and productive. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837/40 "2010-09-08T00:13:08Z")
It’s culturally bigoted at the least and any sentence which contains the phrase “…doing better than being bushmen in the jungle” carries racial overtones whther you’re aware of it or not. And what do you mean by “fruitful and productive?” Fruitful and productive for who? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/should-barbaric-practices-be-stopped/552837.md?page=3)